Strategy Three tall forwards

[jedi mind tricks]

I suspect you may be putting words in his mouth, JMT. He actually said "Both [Tabs and Ape] of them have continued to physically develop strength and power and weight, and we're experimenting with three tall forwards which would give them better opportunity to play together"

That is not the same as saying he is considering Pav, Ape and Tabs forward. I assumed he meant the youngsters might play together if Pav or Sandi or Clarke are injured.

Yes. It appears that I have misinterpreted Ross Lyon's message. I believe Ross would like to get more games into Apeness this season and the two leading forwards with a resting ruckman seems more plausible.

 

[Apenesslike]

I'd like to see how they go against Elvis and a fit Dawson. If they can clunk them against those 2, they're ready to drop in together. If not, the small forward line has worked well in the best part, especially when Ballas and Walters are both lining up.

 

[E Shed]

Its going to get exciting when Apeness has some more weight to throw around and starts clunking pack marks near goal. Haven't we needed someone like that for what seems like ages.

 

[eastfreo75]

If Sandilands or Clarke get injuried, playing Pav, Tabs, Apes, and Sandilands/Clarke makes sense. Apes can play back up ruck and Clarke/Sandilands do the majority of the ruck work.

 

[jedi mind tricks]

If Sandilands or Clarke get injuried, playing Pav, Tabs, Apes, and Sandilands/Clarke makes sense. Apes can play back up ruck and Clarke/Sandilands do the majority of the ruck work.

Just like when the great man Kepler was playing for Freo.

 

[theGav56]

If Apeness is big and fit enough to play relief ruck then he should be big and fit enough as a forward.

 

[Boppo]

I like the idea. Mayne gets freed up a bit to be more flexible. Also Pav gets a chop out from the top backman when the other two start to pose problems.

 

[Boppo]

Just rewatched the Ape draft vid..I want him in the team. Pretty good mover for 2m tall! Marks at the top of the leap with sure hands and his two handed ruck work though curious looks effective. Can't wait.

 

[Dockernut]

If Apeness is big and fit enough to play relief ruck then he should be big and fit enough as a forward.

He's definitely big enough and may be fit enough (not sure about his aerobic capacity stats) to play relief ruck, but does he understand the role sufficiently/is his tap work up to even WAFL standard? I wouldn't have thought so at this stage. Hence my preference for Griff over him for the Ruck/Tall Fwd possie.

Dont agree with you on this.Griff has been underwhelming so far and Apeness has been used in the ruck and is quick with a big tank.Has also been clunking some pack marks.Apeness is the future KPP ,Griff to get a gig when Sandi is rested.

Underwhelming is a bit hard on Griff IMO. I hear what you're saying about the Ape as a future prospect, Salim, but I think Griff at his best (see his games in 2013 leading up to his knee injury) is miles ahead of what I think Ape can offer currently.

 

[Taylor]

Is he even a ruckman? Plenty of guys get thrown into the ruck in juniors because they are the tallest.

We don't need to do the same.

 

[Schauermann]

Not sure this could ever work unless one of the three was rucking, 3 talls plus the extra ruckman (Zac) is too top-heavy.

Agree on this.

Taberner and Apeness really should be tried in a ruck role in the practice matches. Think that would improve our team quite a bit if this works out. Have they done ruck work at training at all?

Underwhelming is a bit hard on Griff IMO. I hear what you're saying about the Ape as a future prospect, Salim, but I think Griff at his best (see his games in 2013 leading up to his knee injury) is miles ahead of what I think Ape can offer currently.

Well, he problem with this is, that Griffin is no forward. Somehow using a natural ruck as forward is not working out that often. But also worth a try. Griffin never had a change to have an impact forward, since he had to play first ruck due to injury or was injury himself...

 

[salim malik]

Is he even a ruckman? Plenty of guys get thrown into the ruck in juniors because they are the tallest.

We don't need to do the same.

Apeness will pinch hit forward as the occasional ruck the same as Tabs and most other tall forwards through out the comp .I dont think any one expects Apeness to be a dominant ruckman.

 

[salim malik]

Agree on this.

Taberner and Apeness really should be tried in a ruck role in the practice matches. Think that would improve our team quite a bit if this works out. Have they done ruck work at training at all?

Both are involved in the ruck drills.

 

[Schauermann]

Both are involved in the ruck drills.

Good to hear.

 

[Schauermann]

Is he even a ruckman? Plenty of guys get thrown into the ruck in juniors because they are the tallest.

We don't need to do the same.

We don't, but we need a forward who is a decent 2nd ruck or a 2nd ruck who can have impact up forward. Loosing to much run with 2nd ruck playing mostly from the bench...

 

[Taylor]

We don't, but we need a forward who is a decent 2nd ruck or a 2nd ruck who can have impact up forward. Loosing to much run with 2nd ruck playing mostly from the bench...

I agree but we might just conceded the tap around the ground with a key structural player in there.
If he can't match the leap of a genuine ruck then he is asking to get a knee to the ribs, potentially on purpose to ruin our structure.

Id really prefer Clarke to stay roaming the middle for the entire game, he is an athlete.

 

[Schauermann]

Id really prefer Clarke to stay roaming the middle for the entire game, he is an athlete.

Will work as well I'd say. Just needs to have a more consistent impact in the middle (and/or kick goals more consistently).

 

[Dockernut]

Well, he problem with this is, that Griffin is no forward. Somehow using a natural ruck as forward is not working out that often. But also worth a try. Griffin never had a change to have an impact forward, since he had to play first ruck due to injury or was injury himself...

So assuming we are forced to play one or the other, our options are:
1. ageing workhorse ruckman, that at his best will provide good service in the ruck (at the highest level), a decent level of involvement around the ground and minimal impact up forward; or
2. raw second year tall who has shown glimpses of high/pack marking capabilities in the WAFL and at training, limited influence in the ruck (except against kids), but who projects as a future KPF based on current trajectory.

It's a bit six of one, half a dozen of the other. But as I said, my preference is Griff at this stage.

 

[copa mundials]

Griffin > Clarke.

Clarke is ****ing shit. When will people realise he is useless around the ground – slow, lumbering, and even Ross said something about that in the Q&A.

A bit like Col Syvia, a bit like our shit drafting and recruitment, and I'll be right about this one too.

 

[DudleyDocker]

Griffin > Clarke.

Clarke is ******* shit. When will people realise he is useless around the ground – slow, lumbering, and even Ross said something about that in the Q&A.

A bit like Col Syvia, a bit like our shit drafting and recruitment, and I'll be right about this one too.

Get a grip mate.

 

[eastfreo75]

The Modern day biggest structural issue is the ruck role. Option one is to go with one ruck and have others pinch hit in the ruck. Usually a tall forward. Option two is go with two ruckmen and with one or both playing forward.

Option one have the advantage structurally of having another runner. Option two have an advantage at the stoppages and clearances when a ruck is going against a pinch hitter.

For me, Lyons is trying to have both options available due to injury, form and who we are playing.

Option one is Sandilands/Griffin/Clarke/Hannath as ruck and Taberner/Apeness as a pinch hitter

Option two is two of Sandilands/Griffin/Clarke/Hannath/Moller.

Lyon is wisely cover all situations. Also, when Sandilands, Pavlich and Griffin retire. Option one seems like a good plan for the future. Clarke as number one ruck and Tabs/Apes as pinch hitters.

 

[Dockernut]

Clarke is ******* shit. When will people realise he is useless around the ground – slow, lumbering, and even Ross said something about that in the Q&A.

Pfft get a clue. Clarke is very agile at ground level for a player of his size.

A bit like Col Syvia, a bit like our shit drafting and recruitment, and I'll be right about this one too.

This whiffs of Freagle trolling.

 

[salim malik]

Griffin > Clarke.

Clarke is ******* shit. When will people realise he is useless around the ground – slow, lumbering, and even Ross said something about that in the Q&A.

A bit like Col Syvia, a bit like our shit drafting and recruitment, and I'll be right about this one too.

Sylvia is a waste but didnt cost us a pick but Wellingham on the other hand a top pick and is useless as the proverbials on a bull.
Gotta laugh at Freagles slagging of at Freo when the biggest joke is still running around with the Eagles and pocketing a poultice of cash.
Oh and Clarke is far from lumbering,big tank as well.

 

[theGav56]

The Modern day biggest structural issue is the ruck role. Option one is to go with one ruck and have others pinch hit in the ruck. Usually a tall forward. Option two is go with two ruckmen and with one or both playing forward.

Option one have the advantage structurally of having another runner. Option two have an advantage at the stoppages and clearances when a ruck is going against a pinch hitter.

For me, Lyons is trying to have both options available due to injury, form and who we are playing.

Option one is Sandilands/Griffin/Clarke/Hannath as ruck and Taberner/Apeness as a pinch hitter

Option two is two of Sandilands/Griffin/Clarke/Hannath/Moller.

Lyon is wisely cover all situations. Also, when Sandilands, Pavlich and Griffin retire. Option one seems like a good plan for the future. Clarke as number one ruck and Tabs/Apes as pinch hitters.

What you are saying is fair enough in a general sense. However at Fremantle the biggest structural issue remains KPF and how they work in combination with any resting rucks. The club is in the process of resolving the forward issues while juggling a stock of rucks who do not contribute well as forwards.

Reality is that if our forwards are successful then we can get by with 1 specialist ruck. If they aren't successful then playing Sandilands or Clarke forward becomes attractive.

 

[Taylor]

I'm interested in trying one of our many first ruck options on ground 100% of the game, taking the next week off and then again 100% game time following.

Adelaide and Port both play huge time on ground rucks and we have the bodies to do it too, we just have the luxury of rotating them.