Confirmed - Tim Kelly 2018 pt 2 | Page 35 | BigFooty

Confirmed Tim Kelly 2018 pt 2

Discussion in 'Drafts, Trading & Free Agency' started by Lore, Oct 22, 2018.

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  1. Pulsedriver

    Pulsedriver Team Captain

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    You're not humoring me beyond how you're scrambling to deflect from your contradiction, with these statements: "Wells himself never even put a top 10 price on the trade. Those words have been put into his mouth by imaginative Eagles posters" and "despite [Wells] being clear about the top 10 pick requirement all along?"

    Wells requiring a top 10 pick isn't my narrative, it's the requirement Wells himself set, a standard you have been holding WC to in this thread for not being able to acquire Kelly.

    Wells said the positions (of Geelong and WC) were too far apart. Given WC were willing to trade for pick 13, it stands to reason that too far apart means Wells wanted a top 10 pick. Wells did state: “He’s worth a top 10 pick I would have thought and perhaps more."
    https://www.perthnow.com.au/sport/a...ant-a-top-10-pick-for-tim-kelly-ng-b88984549z

    Your deflections need work. Go to SRP and hone your game.
     

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  2. Pulsedriver

    Pulsedriver Team Captain

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    I've answered this numerous times in thread already. Go back and have a read. I'm not going to answer the same question for every noob to this fred.

    Go back and have a read. I'm not going to answer the same question for every noob to this fred.
     
  3. Pulsedriver

    Pulsedriver Team Captain

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    This fact eludes them, for they're in the denial phase right now. They're desperate fanbois wishing, hoping and dreaming to have their cake and eat it too, in that they wanted to keep Kelly for 2019, but also want the kind of trade value that comes from being contracted when it comes to trading him a year later.
     
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  4. year of the cat

    year of the cat Brownlow Medallist

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    Can’t be rooted. I’m just responding to the idiotic post of yours up above. Shouldn’t waste my time with knuckle draggers.
     
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  5. Pulsedriver

    Pulsedriver Team Captain

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    So you can't be rooted informing yourself. Forever fanboi, huh?
     
  6. year of the cat

    year of the cat Brownlow Medallist

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    Poor attempt at trolling I think...
     
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  7. One_Wing

    One_Wing All Australian

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    How tf is this still being discussed....
     
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  8. ShaunWDT

    ShaunWDT Club Legend

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    Prior to breaking his leg yes, easily.
     
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  9. Nickoo

    Nickoo Premiership Player

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    You sound like julia Gillard denying she did anything out of the ordinary in covering up the union money trail.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
     
  10. Lunchlady Doris

    Lunchlady Doris Hall of Famer

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    What would I be deflecting from? West Coast being willing to trade for pick 13 - even if it is true - is not proof of anything except they were unable to get the deal done.

    You're getting bogged down in this whole top 10 pick stuff - and avoiding answering how Wells acted in bad faith. Should I take the above as a white flag?

    Let's pretend he told the Eagles brains trust that a top 10 pick was the minimum. Now explain how that is 'acting in bad faith'?

    Did he then up it to a top 5 pick once a top 10 was offered? What other nefarious deeds are you inventing and attributing to Wells to explain your bad faith stance?
     
  11. Obeanie1

    Obeanie1 Brownlow Medallist

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    Its negotiating in bad faith because it was asking / demanding massive overs. Or as Wells stated 'an exceptional offer will be required'

    Its like you want to buy my Nissan and I say sure $100,000 thanks take it or leave it.

    That isnt negotiating in good faith.
     

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  12. Pulsedriver

    Pulsedriver Team Captain

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    Your contradiction, as I quoted of you.

    You're from the school of Wells, as you're now arguing in bad faith, given I've already explained on numerous occasions how Wells acted in bad faith.

    Even you believe Wells placed a top 10 pick as the price for Kelly when you stated: "despite [Wells] being clear about the top 10 pick requirement all along?"
    Now you're saying "Let's pretend he [Wells] told the Eagles brains trust that a top 10 pick was the minimum."
    Again, you're all over the shop. You can't keep all your nonsense straight since you're making it up on the go.

    Such projection from the Lunchlady.

    If I were making it up, I wouldn't have provided a number of links to support my case.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2018
  13. AsterixTheGaul

    AsterixTheGaul Plucked from the Amos

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    There have been a statements that West Coast had weeks to sort this out. Really? I realise it’s been a while but if your club wins games in September, the trade period hits you fast.

    If any club is dragging their feet, it is Geelong coming up with a purposeful pastoral care plan and not hiding behind the off-field soft support cost cap.
     
  14. strauchnyy

    strauchnyy Club Legend

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    This is where there is a disconnect between WC and cats supporters. Nothing against either group as we are both biased to our club. The true messure of intelligence is seeing it from the other's perspective.

    To you, 2 x early 20s picks seemed like a good deal because you lost Lycett for one of them and they are both reasonable picks. I can see that and if I was a one-eyed eagle completely ignoring Geelong I'd agree with you.

    But (and please look at it from our perspective) to us:

    - Kelly is our best player under 24
    - Our only gun mid that runs & carries and creates other than Danger who is almost 30
    - 2nd in our BnF
    - won best first year player in the AFL
    - probably a top 4/5 player for us after Danger, Sel, Hawkins, Stewart
    - Therefore is absolutely critical to our list transition
    - picks 20 + 22 would be 25 + 27 after acad and F/S players and now not looking like good picks
    - Kelly was under contract after 1 year with us after he agreed to go into a draft with 18 clubs, after saying he'd love to play for any team even outside of WA
    - given he was under contract, you HAD to offer overs for us to agree, just coz that’s all you had doesn’t mean we had to take it (wc fans ignore this)
    - WC had no more right to him than say, Port pre-draft - we picked him before WC after WC chose two others above him (so they did have the chance and chose Allen) - this is how a draft works
    - picks are overrated as Kelly is better than more than about two thirds of the players picked around 10 in the last 10 years.
    - further from that, even if we got pick 10 for Kelly, it is likely Kelly would be better anyway, therefore 10 is NOT overs for Kelly, in the draft I would’ve picked Kelly at 8 before jones (after smith) but none of the draftees would impact 2019 better than Kelly
    - and further to that, picks in the 20s were even less likely to net a player that would justify a trade whilst under contract
    - We are playing for the now and a draft pick (even at 10) would be a loss while we have Dangerwood and Hawkins still in good form
    - refused freo and in doing so, removed the ‘family’ excuse entirey
    - Kelly is on draftee wages and when you consider his output, is one of the most valuable players in the AFL with his TPP - I suspect this is a massive reason to keep him as our cap is apparently tight.

    When you look at our reasons, there is no way in this universe would we accept two picks in the 20s. Zero. To us, picks in the 20s weren’t just extreme unders, they were borderline insulting for a contracted Kelly. To us he is worth a top 10 even though we probably would still lose. We had every right to keep to our word and not back down. WC didn't provide the price so he remained. There was no bad faith. That's utter crap. Wells is a professional.

    In 2019 he is out of contract so we lose the ability to hold him. That is it. WC still don't have the ability to just take him, that has not changed. We will ask for a pick around the 8 - 13 range. If you have that pick that's what it'll be. If you try to low ball and offer say your R2 pick, we will take that as bad faith and deal only with Freo or he will likely go to the draft to freo. That won't happen because WC are professionals. If you finish with say pick 18, we will push for something else and there will be middle ground reached. Pretty simple.

    To us it wasn’t a Nissan. It was a Maserati and you were offering 50c in the dollar when you had no right to it
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2018
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  15. Pulsedriver

    Pulsedriver Team Captain

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    That's why WC can wait and wait some more. WC can afford to hold out... even if it pushes Kelly into the draft.

    Where has any WCE fan claimed such?

    It'll be rejected, but you're free to ask.

    Wishing, hoping, dreaming and praying will at least keep you warm till next October.

    Give GFC what they demand or they'll do WC a favour and send Tim into the draft. Hhmmm!

    You seem to equate professionalism with GFC as not acquiescing to WC's offer, but equate WC being professional with acquiescing to GFC's demands. Did you not just speak of seeing things from the other side's perspective?

    If WC had pick 18, give or take a pick, it'll be just that pick alone, as it was with WC trading for Redden and Wellingham. If WC had and gave up pick 13, they'd seek an upgrade of their 2nd rounder. What leverage do Geelong have to force such favorable terms for themselves?

    Unlike 2018, 2019 is a buyers market, as Tim's out of contract. GFC can think of Tim as a Maserati all they wish, but how they view him won't sway how WC view him, nor will WC ignore the circumstances under which this supposed 'Maserati' can be purchased.[/QUOTE]
     
  16. Obeanie1

    Obeanie1 Brownlow Medallist

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    Three 2nd round picks is not 50 cents.

    Cats asked for two 2nds and our 2019 1st.

    We countered I beleive with our 2019 1st plus a 2nd for Kelly and your 2019 3rd.

    None of this is the 'miles apart' notion Wells was sprouting at the end.

    He never intended to trade unless the Eagles offered stupid compensation. The Eagles werent stupid.
     
  17. Isaac Cumming No 1

    Isaac Cumming No 1 Premium Platinum

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    Actually it is though. If that's the price you're willing to sell it for.
     
  18. masai

    masai Norm Smith Medallist

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    I agree, lot’s of playing semantics.

    Mrs Kelly, “ look what you’ve done to these footy supporters “.

    In 2019, these boards are going to be taken over by the Kelly Chronicles, ......... Tim & Josh.
     
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  19. Isaac Cumming No 1

    Isaac Cumming No 1 Premium Platinum

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    :think:I think we'll try and sort Josh early.
     
  20. Lunchlady Doris

    Lunchlady Doris Hall of Famer

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    Cool, assumptions and leaps of logic, all good.
     
  21. Pulsedriver

    Pulsedriver Team Captain

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    Direct quotes = "assumptions and leaps of logic." - Lunchlady Doris.
     
  22. Obeanie1

    Obeanie1 Brownlow Medallist

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    Not if the chance of actually get that price is zero.

    Then you are just wasting peoples time. Including your own.
     
  23. Isaac Cumming No 1

    Isaac Cumming No 1 Premium Platinum

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    I dont think you get what good faith means.

    It's certainly not bad faith to set the set the bar, where you have no obligation or declared interest in trading a player. Bad faith would be telling the other side you did want to trade and then not being reasonable.
    The Cats never said they wanted to trade Kelly and they had no obligation to.
     
  24. Lunchlady Doris

    Lunchlady Doris Hall of Famer

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    We've already shown your whole schtick is based on the fact that Wells actually listened to offers and didn't dismiss the Eagles attempts outright.

    You're taking the fact that the Eagles didn't end up with Sydney's pick 13 as proof that Wells stating pick 13 is not good enough. Even if this massive leap is correct - according to you he already made it clear he wanted a top 10 pick.

    No bad faith, whatsoever.
     
  25. Pulsedriver

    Pulsedriver Team Captain

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    At least you've come to somewhat understand the bad faith in which Wells behaved.

    The links with the quotes of Wells himself speaking as to valuing Kelly as top 10 and perhaps more, as well as Wells saying WC's offer was too far apart makes my case. You're in denial, I get it.

    Whatever keeps you warm...
     
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