Strategy Time to look to the future

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god of purple

god of purple

Senior List
May 9, 2013
198
148
Perth
AFL Club
Fremantle
I don't think we can win a premiership with the current squad we have now.

The sooner Ross Lyon and the Fremantle Football club realise this the better.

I think we are at the crossroads now. I believe we have to start looking to the future with our list.

These are all our players that are 28 or older:

Crowley* 30
Dawson* 28
Duffield* 29
Griffin 28
Johnson* 29
McPharlin* 32
Mundy* 29
Mzungu* 28
Pavlich* 32
D. Pearce* 28
Sandilands* 31
Sylvia 28

* In best 22

Most of these players are key players that make up a fair portion of our best 22. Now its not news to anyone that we have an old list, but I think its time we start turning this list around and preparing our replacements for these older guys.

Tonight in Ross lyon's presser, he said he would go through free agency, trading and the draft to improve our list. It is obvious we need to do really well in the drafts coming up, but if Ross and Fremantle are in the mindset that we can top off our list with trades and free agents, I am very worried. You have to know where you're at to make the necessary changes. If you don't, it could seriously harm your progress. I think we need to focus on drafting well and blooding youth to challenge for the future. I hope the brains trust at Freo realise this.

With teams like Hawthorn and Port Adelaide who could simply run us off our feet (like we saw tonight), do you honestly think we can challenge again in 2015 with our current list? I don't know about you guys, but I don't want Freo to stay in mediocrity, I want a premiership ASAP, to make amends for the robbery last year!

I realise there are a lot of new threads right now following our loss, but I'm interested to know what others think.
 
god of purple said:
Tonight in Ross lyon's presser, he said he would go through free agency, trading and the draft to improve our list. It is obvious we need to do really well in the drafts coming up, but if Ross and Fremantle are in the mindset that we can top off our list with trades and free agents, I am very worried. You have to know where you're at to make the necessary changes. If you don't, it could seriously harm your progress. I think we need to focus on drafting well and blooding youth to challenge for the future. I hope the brains trust at Freo realise this.
Click to expand...

It'd be just as concerning if they weren't considering all options.
 
Yes, while Ross' presser made us all feel a bit better, I was astonished to hear him claim that once you remove the three grandees, we're in the top 4 for games played by players under 24.

This may indeed be statistically correct, but it papers over the inconvenient truth that this is almost entirely in the midfield and forward lines - our defensive line is ageing rapidly, and we appear to have done very little at all to begin remedying this.

While the forward structure has been a mess for most of the last three seasons, at least towards the end of the season with the emergence of Crozier and Taberner (and Duffy, with a welcome cameo from Apeness in the middle) you can at least see the green shoots that we have to work with and with a little more judicious drafting I think we'll be OK in this regard. I may be almost alone with UFO Tatsu in my beliefs, but I think Hannath with his good kicking skills could also be a useful depth option as a depth ruck/forward and clearly there is some reason we are keeping him around.

Unfortunately, the defence is a big problem. Sutcliffe has really been one of the year's biggest success stories - from super sub of 2013 to playing every game as a handy HBF - and he has clearly marked himself as Paul Duffield's eventual successor.

But what else aside from this? Tanner Smith does seem to be injury prone, and Alex Pearce had a development year. Given that aside from Sutty the next youngest members of the defence are Silvagni and Spurr (both turning 28 in 2015) and I can foresee big trouble ahead unless we take some action towards plugging what seems to be a gaping hole in the age profile.

From what I saw in 2014, I do know that we won't do a Bulldogs or Saints style fall off the cliff. But neither will we ever be able to do a 2013 manic pressure game again, either - so time has come to start turning the wheel and building up the Dockers of the late 2010s so that we both have one last shot for Sandi and Pav as well as another surge when the likes of Fyfe and Neale are in their prime.
 

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We had some problems this year that are fixable for next year.

Here, for what it's worth, are my thoughts.

Free agents.

Our two free agents in gumby and sylvia were a bust, neither added to the team what we recruited them to do, which is both disappointing and unusual for free agents, usually they are known quantities and are successful inclusions. Sylvia had promise on paper but was so off the pace it wasn't funny, and the vestiges of a fig jam mindset didn't help. He will either improve next season or his contract will be cut short real fast.

Gumby was a gamble that didn't pay off. We wanted a kpf and tried to land several without success. Gumby was the only option open left and his body didn't make it - a great pity from him and us both, but them's the breaks.


Forward line

Tabs came on well and will continue to improve. Expect him to form a lasting relationship with the weights room over summer, same for Apeness. Plenty of promise in both those two, but still needs third tall option up front for depth with Kep hanging them up. Griff, hannath, clark et.al are great rucks but all are average forwards at best IMO. Rather have another true kpf on the field right now than these guys sorry.

Ballaz and Walters are great but we are too dependent on both as scoring options. Take one or the other away and we struggle disproportionately. Put lots of time into Duffy and Croz over the pre-season as both present plenty of promise for next year.

Mayne is handy in so many ways, but he's not one to kick a bag on a regular basis. A great forward but not a kpf scoring threat. Keep him in the 22 for his strengths, relieve him from any expectation to score heavily for the team and his goal kicking touch will come steamrolling back I reckon.

Pav is a legend but he's near the end, we can't assume we can rely on him next year, better to assume that he will have limited game time IMO, if he proves me wrong that's a bonus.

Midfield

Fyfe, Sandi, sutty, lachie, Barlow, Hill, tendai and Mundy have no case to answer - though Mundy had an average year by his standards.

Crowley was a bit hot and cold this year, but I'd give him a pass mark for the year all things considered. He too is nearing the end, but will still play many games next year.

D Pearce is handy in many regards and is good depth but morra would be a far better choice on the wing and will probably replace Pearce next year in the 22 if his knee holds up. Pearce was far more classy earlier in his career than he is now, but despite his lack of polish, he is still a keeper.

Suban and MTB are okay depth, bu are really lacking class and the nature of the game seems to be passing them by. Everyone knows that suban has no right foot, average speed, and will not get his arms free and handball if he's tackled... plus those good clearance sklls and pin-point passing aren't much chop if you rarely get hands to the ball. MTB is hard as nails but his disposal by foot is a worry and he's no scoring threat whatsoever. If he can't replace Crowley as a tagger in future then his playing days are numbered. Simpson, Ballard and even Brady Gray look more promising than either of these two for 2015 IMO. Ballard needs work with his kicking, but he runs, spreads, tackles and finds the ball with metrononic regularity. Simpson is a must-keep as his speed and creativity is sorely needed in the middle. If he can make the grade during the preseason, then him and Walters rotating through the midfield/forward pocket is a juicy proposition.

Sherro is a hard call for me - love his run, lots of promise but is still missing some key ingredients that I can't quite pin down yet.

Back line

Here's the rub: there's been too big a gulf between our best and worst defenders for too long. Our three kpds in Luke, johnno and dawson have kept other players like snos, smith and pearce out and we paid the price today.

Snos is so underrated its not funny, and smith and Pearce were too green to step into the side due to a lack of playing time. RTB is a brilliant coach, but nobody is perfect - and if he has one weakness its he goes with the same few players - especially defenders - far too often. As a result, our back six lacks the most depth of all, and has been overly dependent on our veterans for some time. It will take two years for smith and Pearce to be close to Luke or johnno's level, and for two years in a row now our older defenders have had their fitness break down at the worst time of the year, with only limited ready-made replacements on offer.

Injury played a partpart with our second string backs but that's only a partial excuse, and I think rtb knows it.Snos' injury problems prove we need more than one good kpd as a backup. Ibbo has been a great defender but he's really a utility with a gift for defending to my mind - they say he can play tall, but I'm not buying it and neither is his shoulder. He's great loose across hb as an intercept mark, but he's not a true kpd and his shoulder injuries made life difficult this year.

C Pearce was underutilized A lack of afl match practice made him rusty, which made it hard to perform, which cost him afl match practice, in a viscous circle of lost opportunity that cost us depth. Was surprised he was kept in defense even when suban and MTB were struggling at times in the midfield. If Sutty had been injured too we would have been in deep do-do, as there was no ready-made replacement in Pearce.

Spur took time to get going, but performed well for the year.. Likewise duffield. But again, if these guys had went down we would have been robbing peter to pay Paul to a degree.

The problems with the Peel alignment have some small part to play in our result this year. Never have I seen such a large gap between afl and wafl standards, and never before have our Peel players been so unready to perform at national level before. Peel's standards have to be closer to Freo's, otherwise we are only chronically under-preparing our second string players by keeping them with Peel.

Recruiting

If luke retires (and he will most likely) then we need two good back-up defenders - stat! Free agency is the preferred option to my mind as we can't guarantee smith and Pearce will be ready by march next year. Sydney and Hawthorn will be there in September again next year, and a shortage of tall defenders will bite us in the arse AGAIN if we don't find someone spare to help out back there and reduce the playing loads on our kp backs.

One more kpf option would be nice, but god knows from where (most likely fyfe). Assuming apeness or tabs get injured next year and Pav starts pulling up sore, we will need more taller scoring options. The fast break scoring wasn't always a winner for us. When push comes to shove, nothing beats contested marks up forward. We have struggled in this area for several years now - definitely a missing link for us.

Only other priority is to recruit some more foot speed. Lots of speedy options in the draft this year, so the game is going to get faster over time. More foot speed on every line is needed, and if you're not a real accurate kick on one foot, and an acceptable kick on the other then you're not a high priority for us in my view.

The days of being good enough to get by are over, much like our season really. Time to set the bar higher again.
 
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We need to close the gap between our best and worst games. The game against the Saints was the one that eventually cost us a top two and we were constantly under pressure with injuries to key players at the wrong time.

To have a realistic shot at a flag as an interstate team you need to finish top two and win the first one which is why Sydney are now in the box seat.

We clearly have a lot of work to do and take our chances but I don't subscribe to the doom and gloom of some on here.

We look to have a good crop of young players to come through in Apeness, Grey, Ballard, A Pierce, Duffy, Sheridan, Smith, Vandeleur, Wood etc.

Neale, Crozier, Tabener and Sutcliffe all took steps forward and took their opportunities this year and will further improve next season.

The key is to hit the finals with your best players fit and firing and unfortunately losing Ballantyne, Johnson, McPharlin and then Silvagni and Mundy obviously playing injured was a bridge too far this year.

Hopefully we get a better run of it next year but then again hope springs eternal in the perpetual Docker journey!
 
Not going to win a premiership with this group. Radical change needed.
 
Neale , Crozier and Sutty are all locks in our 22. Need a young KPP to come on in leaps and bounds next year, hopefully Alex Pearce puts on some size because all the feedback on him is good. Need to unearth another Elite talent through the middle of the ground, too many times tonight I watched Wines or Wingard do something that most of our players aren't capable of.
 
If we go through and rate guys playng today (Not based on today but just their grade) and some others, silvagni, mcpharlin, johno and ballas. It'll be noticable that this year, theres more c's than last, although some players have improved, the mid-range players last year who made the cut for B, are now c's - Look at Clancee. Might be due to injury and etc. but thats why we lost. Need improvement from these guys.
A's:
Sandilands
Fyfe
Pavlich
Barlow
Hill
Johnson
Walters
Sutcliffe
Barlow
B's:
Neale
Mundy
Crowley (Inconsistency cost A)
Silvagni
Duffield
Mzungu
Dawson
C's:
Suban
Spurr
Ibbotson (Ended well, but injury plagued season)
Crozier (Only played a few good ones, yet showed he's above a C)
D. Pearce
D's:
Clarke
C.Pearce
Tabener (Not bagging kid, just not there YET)
Mayne (Underperfomed, needs to kick more goals)
DeBoer (^)

Blues = Capable of being A Graders
Reds = Capable of being B graders
Didn't give Tabs a potential as he did well just to end up playing, credit to the kid!

But its the C's and D's that ultimately are the difference from last year, if you check last year, Neale was sub in the final, Deboer and Clarke arguabely the only C's come finals time. Its ultimately 21st player vs 21st these days, whoever wins here should win the game and having D graders wont cut it against the good teams. C's really needa step up next year.
 
I wouldn't be looking at free agency at all really now - age bracket is wrong for us.

Do what we can to improve next year - and much of this improvement if it comes will rely on the likes of Taberner, Crozier, Mora, Sheridan and maybe Simpson as a smokey. But still get the best we can out of the draft for the future. If we have not managed something fantastic by mid year then we should start having a real look at the list by playing some of them and consider trading some players for picks at the end of the year. Obviously Sydney idea of never dropping back and always competing is where Lyon has come from. I just question if that model can work for us without the $ and scholarship kids Sydney get - we lack enough top end talent.

Port will obviously improve again next year, scarily I think Sydney will as well and the way their scholarship picks are lining up they will be dominant for years. Hawthorn about the same, North not sure, GCS will make the finals and start to threaten.
 
Beetlebum said:
At 33 I'm less confident :cool:
Click to expand...
pretty sure we'll win one in Fyfes Career if he stays with us.
Midfield of: Neale, Fyfe, Clarke rucking, Morabito, Sutcliffe, Crozier, Ballard, Walters (Ross says midfielder)
seems pretty damn good to me.
1 MVP
1 Definite A Grader
2 ~A graders
1 Potential great Ruck
3 High ceiling players with a little work to do
Still tons of Improvement in all these guys!!
 
StingBitten said:
I think Fremantle will win the flag in my lifetime; if nothing unexpected happens.

I'm 26.
Click to expand...

I'm 41 and not so confident now. I am confident it will not be in the next 10 years. Not really a knock on Freo, just that I could name 10 clubs in the same boat the way the comp is now.
 

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Freo Dr said:
I'm 41 and not so confident now. I am confident it will not be in the next 10 years. Not really a knock on Freo, just that I could name 10 clubs in the same boat the way the comp is now.
Click to expand...

Wow, we were a couple of wins shy of a minor premiership. If things went slightly differently, we'd be the ones with the week off.
I really disagree that we won't win a flag in the next ten years.
I would like more passion at our club, and less regurgitation of the coach's mantras.
 
Chances at a flag are rare for most clubs. Our chance was last year, and we blew it.

We have some chance in 2015, but everything would have to fall our way with injuries and certain players like Morabito and Sylvia actually performing. After that, I fear we will be in the wilderness for a while ... 5th - 12th. I think we've got enough talent on our list that we won't bottom out, but I don't see us challenging for the flag for a long time.

Maybe if we're lucky when Fyfe is nearing the end of this career, we can recreate the hope to give our greatest player (now Pavlich, in time Fyfe) the ultimate send-off. But I wouldn't be surprised to see 10-15 years tick by and still be wondering if we'll ever win a flag.
 
Fremantle

B Lee Spurr, Zac Dawson, Cameron Sutcliffe
HB Danyle Pearce, Alex Silvagni, Tendai Mzungu
C Morabito , Lachie Neale, Stephen Hill
HF Matt Taberner, Chris Mayne, Hayden Ballantyne
F Michael Walters, Apeness , Duffy
FOL Zac Clarke, David Mundy, Nat Fyfe
I/C Hayden Crozier, Garrick Ibbotson, Michael Barlow, Syliva
EMG Matt de Boer, Tom Sheridan, Alex Pearce, Josh Simpson


Here is the team with 28 year olds in it and Mundy, who I think will play well until at least 32.

Out: McPharlin, Pavlich, Sandilands, Crowley, Duffield, Johnson, Mzungu

I still think this is a top 6 side, obvious weakness is missing Pavlich but things are not as bad as they appear at the moment.

I can not see us dropping out of the top 6 in the next 3 years.
 
god of purple said:
I don't think we can win a premiership with the current squad we have now.

The sooner Ross Lyon and the Fremantle Football club realise this the better.

I think we are at the crossroads now. I believe we have to start looking to the future with our list.

These are all our players that are 28 or older:

Crowley* 30
Dawson* 28
Duffield* 29
Griffin 28
Johnson* 29
McPharlin* 32
Mundy* 29
Mzungu* 28
Pavlich* 32
D. Pearce* 28
Sandilands* 31
Sylvia 28

* In best 22

Most of these players are key players that make up a fair portion of our best 22. Now its not news to anyone that we have an old list, but I think its time we start turning this list around and preparing our replacements for these older guys.

Tonight in Ross lyon's presser, he said he would go through free agency, trading and the draft to improve our list. It is obvious we need to do really well in the drafts coming up, but if Ross and Fremantle are in the mindset that we can top off our list with trades and free agents, I am very worried. You have to know where you're at to make the necessary changes. If you don't, it could seriously harm your progress. I think we need to focus on drafting well and blooding youth to challenge for the future. I hope the brains trust at Freo realise this.

With teams like Hawthorn and Port Adelaide who could simply run us off our feet (like we saw tonight), do you honestly think we can challenge again in 2015 with our current list? I don't know about you guys, but I don't want Freo to stay in mediocrity, I want a premiership ASAP, to make amends for the robbery last year!

I realise there are a lot of new threads right now following our loss, but I'm interested to know what others think.
Click to expand...


I still think we can challenge next year. Needs a big pre season and a little luck
 
over reaction by a lot of people. We only had one key defender and Ballatyne out.

As for the future, trade out some of the deadwood like De Boer and Griffin, and upgrade our picks.

Go to Free Agency and if we can get a tall like Frawley.
 
Pavs_Risotto said:
Wow, we were a couple of wins shy of a minor premiership. If things went slightly differently, we'd be the ones with the week off.
I
Click to expand...

Bloody good point - win a) that horrible Saints game and b) that Norfs game that was just thrown away, and Freo ends up on the top of the table. Different story, and one we can bemoan all we want - but to little effect!

The thing that really frustrated me this year was the inconsistency. This is a team that has shown that they can beat every team in the league, this season, but just goes missing at times. I'd like to see a) some more back-up in defence, b) better forward line structure, c) more accuracy in goalkicking and d) more consistency.
 
Crowley* 30 - he's got one more year. Not that difficult to replace
Dawson* 28 - 3 more years
Duffield* 29 - 2 more years - solid player can be replaced
Griffin 28 - depth player
Johnson* 29 - 2/3 years in him, difficult to replace
McPharlin* 32 - retire or one more year - difficult to replace
Mundy* 29 - 3 more years and can play half back
Mzungu* 28 - started late 3-5 years left
Pavlich* 32 - who knows? Fletcher and Harvey are how old?
D. Pearce* 28 - 2 years in him
Sandilands* 31 - Paul Salmon played a lot of years
Sylvia 28 - no impact him leaving

Most the players above have 2 or 3 years in them. Yes, plan for the future but people are over reacting
 
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