Tippett's Gone - READ RULES BEFORE POSTING

Which AFC deserter were/are you most salty towards?


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cmndstab

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Speaking of Blucher, we've heard rumours that Tippett has been suffering from depression and his leaving the club is an attempt to change his environment, which is often a positive strategy for sufferers of depression. Although not a sufferer myself I have known many people who have the neurological condition, including family members, and even though it seems odd that a man being paid extraordinary amounts of money to play a game might be depressed, the nature of depression as a neurological condition is that logic very rarely comes into the equation. There doesn't have to be a good reason for a sufferer to feel depressed, they just do.

However, it's also common for sufferers to fixate on one idea that they believe is going to help them, at the expense of considering any other options in a rational fashion. If he does indeed suffer from depression, then it's quite likely that this is what has happened with Kurt. He's decided that Sydney would be a good option, and he's not going to hear any other option. Doesn't matter if they're as good, or even better, that's not how the decision-making process works for a depressed person.


I'm only speculating of course, as I don't have a clue about Kurt's neurological state, but if it were the case, Blucher is a bigger scumbag than I thought. He would be literally taking advantage of a neurologically disabled man by encouraging him to stick by this one, narrow, course of actions. The more clubs Kurt talks to, the greater chance he is of finding favourable conditions, remuneration, respect, and so forth. However, Blucher is more than happy to take advantage of the situation, likely to benefit his sister and old mate in Ireland.

Of course, I'm simply speculating and could have the above all wrong, but it does makes me wonder. It would certainly explain some of Kurt's actions.
 

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Ramify

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Hello fellow Crows Fanatics,

Long time reader, first time poster (Well I started reading at the beginning of this thread anywho)

Whilst I may not be as well versed on the ins and outs of this trade period as a lot of you here seem to be, I think I have a very good knowledge of the game itself and would consider myself a fair judge of a players worth,or potential worth.

I just want you to consider a perspective should the 2nd worst case scenario eventuate and we end up with pick 22 and Jesse white.
Forget the injustice blah,blah and start believing this negative can be turned positive and that our COACHING staff have got what it takes it to take the dross received in this trade and turn it into gold.
I could have sat on this board for the almost 2 whole seasons prior to 2012 and picked maybe 3-5 of our players whom I thought where playing to 3/4 of their potential, and maybe only 2-3 who Id consider playing at a competitive AFL standard, meanwhile bagging/crucifying the rest in much the same way as a lot of you guys seem to be doing to poor old Jesse White. Id only do this if I was naive enough to believe that the reason for this was to lie purely on the players shoulders.
Not so IMHO. I could quite obviously see this was a symptom of inadequacies within leadership at the club,buck stopping at the Head Coach. Fast forward a season, and we now have a man at the reigns who, whilst maybe cutting his teeth still as far as tactical methodology, seems to have an abundance of what I deem to be the most important quality in a Coach/Leader, that being the ability to inspire,lead,enthuse and get the best out of his men on a consistent level,over of the course of a "Full" season.
We had 16-18 players of Jesse White ilk running around like chooks with their heads chopped off last year.
Ive seen enough of Jesse Whites game to suggest that he has enough to turn him into a player, under the right guidance. I wholeheartedly agree, he is nowhere near a like for like swap, But lets just think about all the shockers Kurt has had over the years and compare that to where he was at Vs Hawthorn. Think back to Texs constant fumbling of the ball, having chest marks bounce off the chest,constant brain fades, lack of forward pressure,plumeting confidence (yep possible even for a kid like Tex) and how this was costing himself regular game time because the Coach was inflexible and ignorant of what it took to get the best out of the kid. Now look at this future champion of the game and shudder with me in thinking of what hell play like in the next 2 years. Now, Im not suggesting Jesse White will be the Next Tex, but Im sure under the right guidance he can be as good as, if not better then the severely over rated Moneybags Tippet was at the time of his departure.

There are no free passes.You dont make it to top level without having what it takes to get there,this being assessed by selectors watching kids thrive in their comfort zones. The trick is to emulate that environment on a case by case basis, which Im confident our new young leader can do in this case. Jack Watts a perfect example of a kid excelling in his comfort zone,then floundering once removed and placed in an unfamiliar environment,without proper nurturing and with unrealistic expectation heaped upon his shoulders.

We as the 19th man must galvanise and not feed the negativity monster. Despite what you may think, this attitude is contagious and is a F`ing ugly trait that we as a collective seem to have made into a fine art over the years. Lets nock that chip off of our shoulder and embrace an attitude whch is more akin to that displayed by our Diggers. We will strive in the face of adversity. We need no leg up. We have faith in our soldiers. We back our leadership to get the result.
Turn Jesse into the "Cult" hero people tout pick 22 as becoming. Welcome the kid with open arms and watch as he flourishes in his new environment. Never know, could become the next Mini_Cox!

O.K ill stop now.
 

Kristof

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If he puts a 2yr/$2m contract on his head in the PSD and Sydney picks him, can they immediately renegotiate it to 4yr/$3.6m and change what they're paying in the first two years? Or must they pay $2m over the first two years, no matter how they extend the contract?
 

MattyB_76

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That's why you make it public knowledge that he's likely to be available. Clubs can pull all kinds of trickery, even after trade week is completed. Move around the loading of existing contracts, perhaps consider delisting one extra player to make room both on the list, and in the salary cap. Look at clearing up enough money the following year to offer a backloaded contract. There are plenty of ways to find extra cash.
I agree with Stabby.

Many/most of the best "footy player management" brains in Australia work for one of the 18 clubs. At the first sniff of Crows/Swans not reaching a deal (which was the recognition that Blucher is involved, and he's acting like a douche) these "footy brains" would have been working out ... if Tippett benefits their club (Yes!) and ... how they can get him. Media reports that "Sydney will just get him in the PSD", is all it would take for these guys to be working out the 'How'.

Also consider that the 2 teams who seem to have the cap space now (GWS and Carlton) are coached by evil geniuses. Sheedy Malthouse are GrandMasters of footy, and wouldn't let an opportunity like this (picking up a KPF/ruck for nix) slip by.

I have no doubt that Sydney will not get Tippett in the PSD.
 

fabs33

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So your saying, if Port decided to trade Nick Stevens to Collingwood, then Collingwood, and not Port wouldve won the flag?

I cant see how moral stance on d-ckhead player = premiership, unless its some sort of karmic thing?
Well Port were known as chokers prior to Stevens leaving, perhaps the club's stance had a unifying effect on the playing group that translated into a premiership the very next year. It certainly didn't help Collingwood, a rival.

EDIT: It also turned out badly for Stevens which was also in Port's favour.
 

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So your saying, if Port decided to trade Nick Stevens to Collingwood, then Collingwood, and not Port wouldve won the flag?

I cant see how moral stance on d-ckhead player = premiership, unless its some sort of karmic thing?
No, but you cant argue that if our administation is apathetic, meek and not ruthless/hungry enough how can we then expect to create a hungry and ruthless culture within our playing group.
 

Mattrox

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Hello fellow Crows Fanatics,

Long time reader, first time poster (Well I started reading at the beginning of this thread anywho)

Whilst I may not be as well versed on the ins and outs of this trade period as a lot of you here seem to be, I think I have a very good knowledge of the game itself and would consider myself a fair judge of a players worth,or potential worth.

I just want you to consider a perspective should the 2nd worst case scenario eventuate and we end up with pick 22 and Jesse white.
Forget the injustice blah,blah and start believing this negative can be turned positive and that our COACHING staff have got what it takes it to take the dross received in this trade and turn it into gold.
I could have sat on this board for the almost 2 whole seasons prior to 2012 and picked maybe 3-5 of our players whom I thought where playing to 3/4 of their potential, and maybe only 2-3 who Id consider playing at a competitive AFL standard, meanwhile bagging/crucifying the rest in much the same way as a lot of you guys seem to be doing to poor old Jesse White. Id only do this if I was naive enough to believe that the reason for this was to lie purely on the players shoulders.
Not so IMHO. I could quite obviously see this was a symptom of inadequacies within leadership at the club,buck stopping at the Head Coach. Fast forward a season, and we now have a man at the reigns who, whilst maybe cutting his teeth still as far as tactical methodology, seems to have an abundance of what I deem to be the most important quality in a Coach/Leader, that being the ability to inspire,lead,enthuse and get the best out of his men on a consistent level,over of the course of a "Full" season.
We had 16-18 players of Jesse White ilk running around like chooks with their heads chopped off last year.
Ive seen enough of Jesse Whites game to suggest that he has enough to turn him into a player, under the right guidance. I wholeheartedly agree, he is nowhere near a like for like swap, But lets just think about all the shockers Kurt has had over the years and compare that to where he was at Vs Hawthorn. Think back to Texs constant fumbling of the ball, having chest marks bounce off the chest,constant brain fades, lack of forward pressure,plumeting confidence (yep possible even for a kid like Tex) and how this was costing himself regular game time because the Coach was inflexible and ignorant of what it took to get the best out of the kid. Now look at this future champion of the game and shudder with me in thinking of what hell play like in the next 2 years. Now, Im not suggesting Jesse White will be the Next Tex, but Im sure under the right guidance he can be as good as, if not better then the severely over rated Moneybags Tippet was at the time of his departure.

There are no free passes.You dont make it to top level without having what it takes to get there,this being assessed by selectors watching kids thrive in their comfort zones. The trick is to emulate that environment on a case by case basis, which Im confident our new young leader can do in this case. Jack Watts a perfect example of a kid excelling in his comfort zone,then floundering once removed and placed in an unfamiliar environment,without proper nurturing and with unrealistic expectation heaped upon his shoulders.

We as the 19th man must galvanise and not feed the negativity monster. Despite what you may think, this attitude is contagious and is a F`ing ugly trait that we as a collective seem to have made into a fine art over the years. Lets nock that chip off of our shoulder and embrace an attitude whch is more akin to that displayed by our Diggers. We will strive in the face of adversity. We need no leg up. We have faith in our soldiers. We back our leadership to get the result.
Turn Jesse into the "Cult" hero people tout pick 22 as becoming. Welcome the kid with open arms and watch as he flourishes in his new environment. Never know, could become the next Mini_Cox!

O.K ill stop now.
I'd watch that movie.
 

Ramify

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Well Port were known as chokers prior to Stevens leaving, perhaps the club's stance had a unifying effect on the playing group that translated into a premiership the very next year. It certainly didn't help Collingwood, a rival.
Yes exactly! Should unify the whole lot of us into becoming the stongest Club in the Country(On every level).
 
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Well Port were known as chokers prior to Stevens leaving, perhaps the club's stance had a unifying effect on the playing group that translated into a premiership the very next year. It certainly didn't help Collingwood, a rival.
They also had a very good football team, I reckon thats got more to do with it...

...hopefully history repeats for what you've touched on there (about the unifying effect and premiership, from a players perspective).

Whatever the outcome, the player(s) we aquire to replace that dog on our list will have a special place in my heart. Sh-t, I might even grow to love Jesse White if he's included. He's a big unit, maybe Sando and the lads can get something out of him? Give him the #4 as a joke...
 

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Niximus

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So your saying, if Port decided to trade Nick Stevens to Collingwood, then Collingwood, and not Port wouldve won the flag?
It certainly didn't hurt them. They didn't strengthen a rival for the flag, only the 15th placed team.

I cant see how moral stance on d-ckhead player = premiership, unless its some sort of karmic thing?
You said:


"You absolutely never give anything away for free in business. Port did it, and look at them."

Implying that losing Stevens for nothing has left them where they are now.

They played in two grand finals in the four years after losing Stevens, winning a premiership in the process. It didn't hurt them at all.

If Collingwood had been offering pick 22 (Cameron Thurley), do you think their fortunes would be any different?
 

Ramify

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They also had a very good football team, I reckon thats got more to do with it...
Team of Champs VS Champion team, You know the story...


...hopefully history repeats for what you've touched on there (about the unifying effect and premiership, from a players perspective).

Whatever the outcome, the player(s) we aquire to replace that dog on our list will have a special place in my heart. Sh-t, I might even grow to love Jesse White if he's included. He's a big unit, maybe Sando and the lads can get something out of him? Give him the #4 as a joke...
Thaddaboy! Thats the spirit we need.
 

AFC3000

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Am I right in saying that last article didn't even claim Sydney had offered pick 22, it was their second round pick or Jesse White? I'd pass! At this point if we were told that another club not in the top 4 would take Tippett before Sydney in the PSD I would do it and see that as a win. Also I would rather see us wait and target someone we really want mid season with the spare money if were going to have to pay overs financially to convince someone Sydney is willing to let go come here if they are only a fringe player.
 
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No, but you cant argue that if our administation is apathetic, meek and not ruthless/hungry enough how can we then expect to create a hungry and ruthless culture within our playing group.
Yep, agree. I expect us to be exploring every avenue to get the best deal.

But IF that never amounts, I'll be p-ssed off about our lack of ability to get a good deal sure, but not as p-ssed off about it if we have ZERO to show for it. Thats not me saying "take the deal now please before we get screwed", thats me putting faith in our team that we take the best deal that is made available to us. If it is that deal, it sux, but you count your losses and move on. I just hope it doesnt cost us other bargaining time. Pick 23 or whatever with pick 19 all of a sudden looks a decent bargaining chip as Tippett himself. Surely someone would bite at that. GWS like picks...
 

Roo Lives Again

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Speaking of Blucher, we've heard rumours that Tippett has been suffering from depression and his leaving the club is an attempt to change his environment, which is often a positive strategy for sufferers of depression. Although not a sufferer myself I have known many people who have the neurological condition, including family members, and even though it seems odd that a man being paid extraordinary amounts of money to play a game might be depressed, the nature of depression as a neurological condition is that logic very rarely comes into the equation. There doesn't have to be a good reason for a sufferer to feel depressed, they just do.

However, it's also common for sufferers to fixate on one idea that they believe is going to help them, at the expense of considering any other options in a rational fashion. If he does indeed suffer from depression, then it's quite likely that this is what has happened with Kurt. He's decided that Sydney would be a good option, and he's not going to hear any other option. Doesn't matter if they're as good, or even better, that's not how the decision-making process works for a depressed person.


I'm only speculating of course, as I don't have a clue about Kurt's neurological state, but if it were the case, Blucher is a bigger scumbag than I thought. He would be literally taking advantage of a neurologically disabled man by encouraging him to stick by this one, narrow, course of actions. The more clubs Kurt talks to, the greater chance he is of finding favourable conditions, remuneration, respect, and so forth. However, Blucher is more than happy to take advantage of the situation, likely to benefit his sister and old mate in Ireland.

Of course, I'm simply speculating and could have the above all wrong, but it does makes me wonder. It would certainly explain some of Kurt's actions.

no mate.

Tippett is suffering from a disease that is often passed on from very young children...it's called memememememememem syndrome.....

it's caused by believing that you're the centre of the universe because everyone wants you to play with them just because you're a KPF/ruckman

There is a cure for this disease...he'll be cured of it next year when the swans realise how inconsistent he is and that they just wasted a million bucks a year on a basketballer who can't kick for shit
 

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Yep, if we can't be sure Sydney won't get him for free in the draft, we would look foolish not taking 22.

BUT, if he can only stipulate his terms in the draft at what Sydney can pay him this year, which will be substantially less than 1mill, then absolutely talk to the other clubs about our intentions, make certain they are poised to swoop and cut him adrift in the draft. That would be infinitely more satisfying than pick 22 and infinitely better for the club in the long run than having pick 22 and the reputation of a feeder club you can have your merry way with.
 

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If we take Jesse White crows can keep my membership next year. I'll be pissed right off. If we take him someone has to be delisted eg Tambling but he still has a year left on contract I would rather keep Tambling for 1 year then have Jesse White for 2 or so. Stuff the Swans have Tippett for $1m a year he wasn't worth $600k a year.
 

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Ramify if we end up with Jesse White, I will support him just like I do every other Crows player. I don't want us to get him though. Having said that, maybe I watched his one good game ever (read: Moran v Carlton) but I thought he was a pretty bright talent a few years back...
 

fabs33

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They also had a very good football team, I reckon thats got more to do with it...
Whether they were a good team or not didn't make a difference prior to Stevens leaving, infact they should've been a better team with him but they weren't, without him...

It could be just a coincidence but it might also not be. It turned out well for them in the end, so how can you say that they did the wrong thing?
 

feenix67

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No I can't buy that. The maths is only relavent to the individual club otherwise you're saying that we have a massive advantage because anyone coming back to SA only has 2 options whereas say North Melbourne have to compete against 9 others. The simple fact is we have only had 3 players in 22 years and probably 100 odd picks from interstate, that we have lost to the go home factor. This would have to be the best average of any club in the league and certainly is a small enough percentage to not affect our recruiting of Victorians in the future.

There is a lot more than 6 players that have come back to us as well, I just can't remember them all. Troy Bond, Fitzy, Tony Hall, Greg Anderson and Lewis Johnston are a few more that come to mind. I would be very surprised if any Victorian club has escaped with less than 3 go homes in the last 22 years.
I think you need to disclude the first couple of years when we had concessions to build a list. I'll see if I can be bothered doing some analysis on this and start another thread, so as not to derail this one. It's an interesting topic and I must admit to working on gut feel a bit, but the numbers dont seem to add up to me. Happy to be wrong, or at least debate it with you at a later date :thumbsu:
 

Roo Lives Again

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I think we should go on the attack. I know they're contracted, but we should be getting in the ear of players like Jetta and Rohan, tell them we'll double their salary if they'll demand a trade to adelaide, and ONLY adelaide. At the very least, it will force Sydney to pay these blokes more.

We've got all of Tippetts 800k four year contract sitting there. Lets target someone for gods sake. Instead of sitting here and cropping it from Sydney, lets show that they're not the only ones with buckets of cash. Tippett has now shown us exactly how to lure players back to Adelaide. Just have the player or management refuse to speak to port, or anyone else.
This is exactly the way to play it...but the AFC have no balls, no vision, no aggression....I really can't believe that we have Noble etc in charge...they probably earn 250k a year yet they have no clue...how the **** did they get the job?
 

jenny61_99

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This is exactly the way to play it...but the AFC have no balls, no vision, no aggression....I really can't believe that we have Noble etc in charge...they probably earn 250k a year yet they have no clue...how the **** did they get the job?
WTF is all this Noble hate about? o_O What has he ever done to you?
 
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