Tippett's Gone - READ RULES BEFORE POSTING

[cmndstab]

What we need to do is get in GWS's ear quicksmart. No, not about them taking Kurt in the PSD. We need to figure out what they value most highly in order to get another minidraft pick. The U17 minidraft is about the only remaining trade option where you can reasonably expect to get more than you pay more - because GWS doesn't really own those 17 year olds. They only own the draft picks, and they can't use them. So if we can find something they need, we can get access to one of those players.

Of course, other clubs are going to be doing the same thing, but they don't have the bargaining chip known as Kurt Tippett. Wherever he decides to go, rather than looking for what we want, we should look for whatever we can trade to whoever has what GWS wants.

I know some will say that we need to trade for a commodity that can help us in 2013, given our premiership window is open, but I think you need to take advantage of opportunities while they're there. Unless a gun, ready-made player is available, I think we should look to gain access to an elite youth if we can.

 

[The_Answer3]

Not sure the 17 window talent is as good this year.

 

[A FEW GOOD MEN]

Quick Update;

Fact 1; The AFC is now "walking away" from the gentleman's agreement that we have been assured on numerous occassions by the AFC did not exist. Yes, John Reid can accurately claim that there is nothing in Kurt's 2009 contract, but it is hard for him to deny there was an "agreement" unless Stephen Trigg is making it up.

Unfortunately the "agreement" may be better than what we could eventually receive i.e. nothing.

Fact 2; Kurt has been linked (appeared in the Ruccitiser) in a range of different guernseys, Gold Coast, Brisbane, Carlton, Collingwood, Sydney. At least it is providing employment for graphic designers.

Fact 3; After virtual silence since this time last year, the Gold Coast have final indicated that they will take Kurt off our hands as a gesture of support for a local lad. They are quite busy at the moment mind you so they might catch up with Kurt over the weekend.

How the story ends...........

1) Kurt leaves Adelaide - Tick

2) Kurt joins the Gold Coast

3) The AFC receive a mid to late first round draft pick.

P.S. Wayno, continually pedalling the same false statement does not make it true. I have previously explained in great detail why the Gold Coast's view of fair compensation in the "gentleman's agreement" (end of first round draft pick) does not match the AFC view (equivalent to the Ablett compensation). I am not Carolyn Wilson, I did not say a second round draft pick.

 

[cmndstab]

Not sure the 17 window talent is as good this year.

Considering the two players taken last year are of picks 1-5 quality this year, does that mean that the available talent this year is of 5-10 quality next year?

Because honestly, I'd take pick 5 for Tippett and run off cackling, even if I needed to wait a year to use it.

 

[IddyBiddy]

Not sure the 17 window talent is as good this year.

Apparently it is better according to AFL.com draft combine video day 1 (maybe not Jaeger and Crouch but overall).

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

So this sounds like an option that we should be exploring pretty heavily, right?

We get Melbourne to trade of their first pick (#3 or #4, whichever is allowed) to us.
We trade Tippett to the GC.
GC trade Melbourne Caddy & Toy (or something else of value), and don't mess with Viney.


GC would be happy.
Melbourne would be happy.
Crows would be happy (provided part of the deal was Melbourne not taking Toumpas).

I feel Melbourne would want /need something more to make that deal happen.

I don't think Melbourne would be happy about that at all, they would feel as if they are getting screwed over and not gaining anything from their position.

We will be the big winner by gaining pick 4, GC will be a big winner by gaining Tippett - Melb would be bent over by gaining Caddy for pick 4 who is clearly not worth that. I feel the GC would ahve to chuck another player or 2nd or 3rd round pick in to even a few things up.

 

[Iva Bigun]

That's even better for Melbourne.

Gold Coast agree not to nominate Viney.
Melbourne trade pick four for Caddy.
Melbourne pick up Viney with pick 26.
Gold Coast give pick four for Tippett.

Everyone wins. Even if Gold Coast weren't going to nominate Viney they should bluff.

Because of this

 

[cmndstab]

I feel Melbourne would want /need something more to make that deal happen.

I don't think Melbourne would be happy about that at all, they would feel as if they are getting screwed over and not gaining anything from their position.

We will be the big winner by gaining pick 4, GC will be a big winner by gaining Tippett - Melb would be bent over by gaining Caddy for pick 4 who is clearly not worth that. I feel the GC would ahve to chuck another player or 2nd or 3rd round pick in to even a few things up.

The benefit for Melbourne is GC agreeing not to bid on Viney. Hence giving them an extra top 5 talent for pick 20 or so.

And if GWS play silly buggers, Melbourne let them burn the first pick on Viney and GC and Melbourne can share Whitfield and whoever else between them.

I like it We should absolutely be looking at how we can screw the system to get our own back, given that we've been at the short end of the stick so often.

 

[Allefgib]

Effectively for Melb it's their second pick for Caddy isn't it? They are simply ensuring they only have to use their 2nd pick on Viney by ensuring someone else has their first pick which they traded for Caddy.

 

[Hodgy]

I feel Melbourne would want /need something more to make that deal happen.

I don't think Melbourne would be happy about that at all, they would feel as if they are getting screwed over and not gaining anything from their position.

We will be the big winner by gaining pick 4, GC will be a big winner by gaining Tippett - Melb would be bent over by gaining Caddy for pick 4 who is clearly not worth that. I feel the GC would ahve to chuck another player or 2nd or 3rd round pick in to even a few things up.

Melbourne would get Caddy and Viney for picks 4 and 26. Clearly better than now where they need to us picks 3 and 13, Hence why the AFL wouldn't let it happen.

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

The benefit for Melbourne is GC agreeing not to bid on Viney. Hence giving them an extra top 5 talent for pick 20 or so.

I know the benefits they will gain and they will even know these but still doesn't change the fact, they will feel cheated and demand something else to make the deal happen.

I like it We should absolutely be looking at how we can screw the system to get our own back, given that we've been at the short end of the stick so often.

I do as well but not 100% confident Melbourne will come to the party and simply agree with it.

 

[The_Answer3]

Considering the two players taken last year are of picks 1-5 quality this year, does that mean that the available talent this year is of 5-10 quality next year?

Because honestly, I'd take pick 5 for Tippett and run off cackling, even if I needed to wait a year to use it.

The two picks in this years MD will 95% sure be Jack Martin and Jesse Hogan. Both WA boys. Jack's father is a head case and has puled Jack out from playing WAFL Colts because the local league can pay him a few hundred a game.... Jesse is a man child at this stage and ready to play AFL right now. He's a touch short for a pure KPF at this stage, and despite being able to play anywhere on the ground, he's a touch of a tweener for everything. Will probably grow, but will he man child the AFL?

The two following are Kelly and Crouch.

Last year Jager and Crouch were the stand outs. These boys nominated:

Chase Bower, Adam Carter, Dayle Garlett, Brodie Grundy, Matthew Haynes, Riley Hutchinson, Emmanuel Irra, Ben Kennedy, Aaron Loccon, Sean Lynch, Todd McKay, Jonathan O’Rourke, Jason Pongracic, Mason Shaw, Josh Simpson, Jake Stringer, Shannon Taylor, Jimmy Toumpas, Nick Vlastuin, Matt Wallis, Laine Wilkins, Daniel Williamson, Christopher Yarran.

The bolded boys will go in the first, the underlined in the 10, Grundy and probably Toump top 5. Whit and Crouch definate top five. It's a decent selection, and based on what these lads were doing in comparrison to this years 17s, take 20% off.

Both stand outs are risks for different reasons, Crouch isn't ready and Kelly is raw. Just isn't as obvious as last year.

Apparently it is better according to AFL.com draft combine video day 1 (maybe not Jaeger and Crouch but overall).

Was that Shifter Sheahan saying that.....

 

[ams4crows]

So picks 4 and 13 were compensation for Scully. If they get say Caddy and Toy for pick 4 and Wellingham Dawes for Pick 13 plus Viney at only 26 + whoever they take at 3

That is a damn good draft trade period for Melbourne. They aren't being screwed overall when you look at the big picture.

 

[IddyBiddy]

The two picks in this years MD will 95% sure be Jack Martin and Jesse Hogan. Both WA boys. Jack's father is a head case and has puled Jack out from playing WAFL Colts because the local league can pay him a few hundred a game.... Jesse is a man child at this stage and ready to play AFL right now. He's a touch short for a pure KPF at this stage, and despite being able to play anywhere on the ground, he's a touch of a tweener for everything. Will probably grow, but will he man child the AFL?

The two following are Kelly and Crouch.

Last year Jager and Crouch were the stand outs. These boys nominated:

Chase Bower, Adam Carter, Dayle Garlett, Brodie Grundy, Matthew Haynes, Riley Hutchinson, Emmanuel Irra, Ben Kennedy, Aaron Loccon, Sean Lynch, Todd McKay, Jonathan O’Rourke, Jason Pongracic, Mason Shaw, Josh Simpson, Jake Stringer, Shannon Taylor, Jimmy Toumpas, Nick Vlastuin, Matt Wallis, Laine Wilkins, Daniel Williamson, Christopher Yarran.

The bolded boys will go in the first, the underlined in the 10, Grundy and probably Toump top 5. Whit and Crouch definate top five. It's a decent selection, and based on what these lads were doing in comparrison to this years 17s, take 20% off.

Both stand outs are risks for different reasons, Crouch isn't ready and Kelly is raw. Just isn't as obvious as last year.


Was that Shifter Sheahan saying that.....

Can't remember mate, but that's a great roundup, thanks.

 

[The_Answer3]

The benefit for Melbourne is GC agreeing not to bid on Viney. Hence giving them an extra top 5 talent for pick 20 or so.

And if GWS play silly buggers, Melbourne let them burn the first pick on Viney and GC and Melbourne can share Whitfield and whoever else between them.

I like it We should absolutely be looking at how we can screw the system to get our own back, given that we've been at the short end of the stick so often.

Very good idea in theory. Should be held in stead as a back up to getting #2 off GC.

 

[King Elvis]

I feel Melbourne would want /need something more to make that deal happen.

I don't think Melbourne would be happy about that at all, they would feel as if they are getting screwed over and not gaining anything from their position.

We will be the big winner by gaining pick 4, GC will be a big winner by gaining Tippett - Melb would be bent over by gaining Caddy for pick 4 who is clearly not worth that. I feel the GC would ahve to chuck another player or 2nd or 3rd round pick in to even a few things up.

They get Caddy (and maybe Toy or similar), for effectively #23; that's a good deal for them, I think...

 

[cmndstab]

Melbourne would get Caddy and Viney for picks 4 and 26. Clearly better than now where they need to us picks 3 and 13, Hence why the AFL wouldn't let it happen.

The AFL can't stop it. Unless they literally come in and change the rules at the last second, there is no obligation for GC to bid on a F/S player unless they feel it benefits them to do so.

I do as well but not 100% confident Melbourne will come to the party and simply agree with it.

Caddy and Toy for pick 20? Sounds pretty good to me. If it takes an extra third round pick, give it to them and run.

 

[King Elvis]

So picks 4 and 13 were compensation for Scully. If they get say Caddy and Toy for pick 4 and Wellingham Dawes for Pick 13 plus Viney at only 26 + whoever they take at 3

That is a damn good draft trade period for Melbourne. They aren't being screwed overall when you look at the big picture.

Spot on.

Viewed in it's entirety, Melbourne would do very well; provided Caddy has that much value (if not, throw Toy or somebody into the mix to try and even it out).

Melbourne still use #3, they get Caddy/Toy for #4 (which they couldn't use properly anyway), then Viney for #23, with #13 still up their sleeves.

So the question is whether Caddy/Toy represent better value than whoever MIGHT be available at #23; if they do, Melbourne do very well, if they don't, then not so much.

 

[Sekaj]

Video needs more "Friends for Life".

 

[ams4crows]

Spot on.

Viewed in it's entirety, Melbourne would do very well; provided Caddy has that much value (if not, throw Toy or somebody into the mix to try and even it out).

Melbourne still use #3, they get Caddy/Toy for #4 (which they couldn't use properly anyway), then Viney for #23, with #13 still up their sleeves.

So the question is whether Caddy/Toy represent better value than whoever MIGHT be available at #23; if they do, Melbourne do very well, if they don't, then not so much.


EDIT - Jeez Harper is a good bloke; no doubt flat out, and still finds the time to respond to emails from idiots

Get on this AFC!..... well Caddy and whoever would have to want to go to melbourne......

If GCS have picks 2 and 4 maybe they'd be more likely to give us 2...... if they have 4.

 

[Sekaj]

Melbourne won't have #4, they will be forced to spend that on Jack Viney in the F/S bidding

Actually, if they traded #4 for a later first round pick, would they then have to spend that later first round pick on Viney instead of #4?

Sounds like a plan, dunnit?

 

[The_Answer3]

Only allocated picks are used. Not picks traded in, not compo picks, not picking of the nose, not a pitch fork

 

[alex_is_on_fire]

The AFL can't stop it. Unless they literally come in and change the rules at the last second, there is no obligation for GC to bid on a F/S player unless they feel it benefits them to do so.

They get Caddy (and maybe Toy or similar), for effectively #23; that's a good deal for them, I think...

I hope you 2 are correct but it sounds too easy and too good to be true.

Lets cross our fingers and hope this deal gets up.

However, does Caddy even want to go to the Melbourne Football club? that could be the sticking point.

 

[supernova_]

Get on this AFC!..... well Caddy and whoever would have to want to go to melbourne......

If GCS have picks 2 and 4 maybe they'd be more likely to give us 2...... if they have 4.

Yeah I like this one.

Caddy + Toy -> Melb for Pick 4 (and a promise not to bid on Viney).

Allows Melb to get Viney at pick 26

Crows then get Pick 4, Suns get Tippett.

 

[The_Answer3]

Throw in Tape to be a good bunch of chaps as well