To put things in perspective

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FireKrakouer

Is now a leftie
Jul 5, 2011
12,851
18,911
AFL Club
Collingwood
Let's say hypothetically that we won today... we'd all be buzzing for a few hours. We'd buy the Herald Sun poster, and brag for a little while. But let's face it, after this weekend Australia doesn't give a sh*t about footy.

I recall after 2010, posters were desperate to celebrate a week later, and talking about pubs to catch up at etc... but it was fairly pointless. No one truly cared anymore.

My point is that footy is about the journey, not the destination. Think of how much enjoyment we've gotten out of the pies season, over the course of the whole year. The grand final really comes down to a post-game 3 hour dopamine rush for the winner vs 3 hours of feeling like sh*t for the loser. Then both sides come back to reality and move on.

I'm not saying that premierships are not important, or trying to take anything away from WC... I just see beloved posters like Dave truly struggling, and I think, isn't it better to come 2nd than to come 4th? Isn't it better to come 2nd than come 8th, or not make the 8 at all? This stings more in the short term than it would've to get knocked out earlier in the finals, but it shouldn't.

Another point: it IS just a game. My sister was called by a recently arrived Chinese colleague shortly after the game for something unrelated, and my sister mentioned how sad she was about the game... her colleague asked, "But you didn't play did you? And none of your friends or family are in the team? It doesn't affect your day to day life really? I don't understand why you care?"
It's a valid point to consider, for those of us who are super passionate about the team. Worry about the things that you have direct control over; it is irrational to worry about that which you have no control over.

Pardon my rambling, and I'm sure that I will cop plenty of hate from the haters, both internally from pies fans and externally from oppo supporters, but I'm just trying to help people feel better.

Ps we knocked richmond out of the finals.
 

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Hazz

Team Captain
Apr 9, 2018
457
567
AFL Club
Collingwood
Let's say hypothetically that we won today... we'd all be buzzing for a few hours. We'd buy the Herald Sun poster, and brag for a little while. But let's face it, after this weekend Australia doesn't give a sh*t about footy.

I recall after 2010, posters were desperate to celebrate a week later, and talking about pubs to catch up at etc... but it was fairly pointless. No one truly cared anymore.

My point is that footy is about the journey, not the destination. Think of how much enjoyment we've gotten out of the pies season, over the course of the whole year. The grand final really comes down to a post-game 3 hour dopamine rush for the winner vs 3 hours of feeling like sh*t for the loser. Then both sides come back to reality and move on.

I'm not saying that premierships are not important, or trying to take anything away from WC... I just see beloved posters like Dave truly struggling, and I think, isn't it better to come 2nd than to come 4th? Isn't it better to come 2nd than come 8th, or not make the 8 at all? This stings more in the short term than it would've to get knocked out earlier in the finals, but it shouldn't.

Another point: it IS just a game. My sister was called by a recently arrived Chinese colleague shortly after the game for something unrelated, and my sister mentioned how sad she was about the game... her colleague asked, "But you didn't play did you? And none of your friends or family are in the team? It doesn't affect your day to day life really? I don't understand why you care?"
It's a valid point to consider, for those of us who are super passionate about the team. Worry about the things that you have direct control over; it is irrational to worry about that which you have no control over.

Pardon my rambling, and I'm sure that I will cop plenty of hate from the haters, both internally from pies fans and externally from oppo supporters, but I'm just trying to help people feel better.

Ps we knocked richmond out of the finals.
Your sisters colleague sounds like a real doozy. Probably more used to a centrally planned view on emotion?
 

FireKrakouer

Is now a leftie
Jul 5, 2011
12,851
18,911
AFL Club
Collingwood
Your sisters colleague sounds like a real doozy. Probably more used to a centrally planned view on emotion?
If you think about the emotional investment in sporting teams purely rationally, it doesn't make any sense at all. Why take credit for the achievement of others? Why feel shame for the failure of others?
 

ottoman

Norm Smith Medallist
May 13, 2014
7,857
18,931
Istanbul
AFL Club
Collingwood
If you think about the emotional investment in sporting teams purely rationally, it doesn't make any sense at all. Why take credit for the achievement of others? Why feel shame for the failure of others?
It makes a lot of sense when the team you follow is Collingwood.
Instead of listening to your Chinese friends rational points FK, what you should be spending your energies on is converting her into a one eyed fanatical Collingwood supporters.

Never listen to people who speak rationally FK. There's a good chance they have been to school and read books and stuff like that. Nothing good can come from those types.

Now get to work on converting her into one of us.
 

JB1975

Norm Smith Medallist
Feb 26, 2015
8,858
23,138
Recovery
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If you think about the emotional investment in sporting teams purely rationally, it doesn't make any sense at all. Why take credit for the achievement of others? Why feel shame for the failure of others?
One thing to say is that a lot of things in this life are valuable without being entirely rational. Being emotional can itself be classed as a remove from 'rational', in which case I'm happier to live an irrational life.

But there's also something rewarding --as well as frustrating-- about being part of something bigger than yourself, even if you have no control over it. I'd suggest that most of the control people think they have over their own lives is a fiction, and that football tells us the truth of this in many and varied ways.
 

Hazz

Team Captain
Apr 9, 2018
457
567
AFL Club
Collingwood
If you think about the emotional investment in sporting teams purely rationally, it doesn't make any sense at all. Why take credit for the achievement of others? Why feel shame for the failure of others?
I understand what you’re saying, I’m pretty analytical minded myself.

But then to your point, and the Chinese colleague - Why do anything? Why feel anything any time? Why post on bigfooty? Who even reads this sh1t? Really, we are all just filling time until we pop back out of existence. There is no God and there is no point to existence.

Our own personal “achievements” are fleeting and extremely insignificant. We watch footy (or pray to our Gods, or polish up our cars, tend the garden) for the joy of it, and to the ops point I agree that the journey is better than the destination (is that why religion just won’t go away - you never see the destination???).

Without attachment of some sort we feel no joy or sadness whether that be through watching what we make grow, or seeing our friends, family, community succeed.

Supporting a team is about the growth and the community, the joy and the sadness.

For the ops sisters colleague (that’s a mouthful!) to not get it, shows a pretty shallow understanding of human emotion.
 

ottoman

Norm Smith Medallist
May 13, 2014
7,857
18,931
Istanbul
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One thing to say is that a lot of things in this life are valuable without being entirely rational. Being emotional can itself be classed as a remove from 'rational', in which case I'm happier to live an irrational life.

But there's also something rewarding --as well as frustrating-- about being part of something bigger than yourself, even if you have no control over it. I'd suggest that most of the control people think they have over their own lives is a fiction, and that football tells us the truth of this in many and varied ways.
Deep
 

ottoman

Norm Smith Medallist
May 13, 2014
7,857
18,931
Istanbul
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I understand what you’re saying, I’m pretty analytical minded myself.

But then to your point, and the Chinese colleague - Why do anything? Why feel anything any time? Why post on bigfooty? Who even reads this sh1t? Really, we are all just filling time until we pop back out of existence. There is no God and there is no point to existence.

Our own personal “achievements” are fleeting and extremely insignificant. We watch footy (or pray to our Gods, or polish up our cars, tend the garden) for the joy of it, and to the ops point I agree that the journey is better than the destination (is that why religion just won’t go away - you never see the destination???).

Without attachment of some sort we feel no joy or sadness whether that be through watching what we make grow, or seeing our friends, family, community succeed.

Supporting a team is about the growth and the community, the joy and the sadness.

For the ops sisters colleague (that’s a mouthful!) to not get it, shows a pretty shallow understanding of human emotion.
even deeper than the previous post
 

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domus

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 31, 2008
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If you think about the emotional investment in sporting teams purely rationally, it doesn't make any sense at all. Why take credit for the achievement of others? Why feel shame for the failure of others?
Because humans are deeply tribal and always will be. There are many pursuits and passions in life which can be dismissed as trivial or unimportant by those who are not invested in them and I do understand what you are saying, but the truth is, it does matter. Dermie was speaking on 360 on Thursday night and he said Allan Jeans rang him from his deathbed to thank him for all he had done for him and the Hawks in grand finals. He rang a number of his former players including Dunstall and literally died a few hours later. Other than family and friends it is the most important passion in countless people's lives and no amount of rationalization will ever change this fact.
 

domus

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 31, 2008
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I understand what you’re saying, I’m pretty analytical minded myself.

But then to your point, and the Chinese colleague - Why do anything? Why feel anything any time? Why post on bigfooty? Who even reads this sh1t? Really, we are all just filling time until we pop back out of existence. There is no God and there is no point to existence.

Our own personal “achievements” are fleeting and extremely insignificant. We watch footy (or pray to our Gods, or polish up our cars, tend the garden) for the joy of it, and to the ops point I agree that the journey is better than the destination (is that why religion just won’t go away - you never see the destination???).

Without attachment of some sort we feel no joy or sadness whether that be through watching what we make grow, or seeing our friends, family, community succeed.

Supporting a team is about the growth and the community, the joy and the sadness.

For the ops sisters colleague (that’s a mouthful!) to not get it, shows a pretty shallow understanding of human emotion.
You make some excellent points but the best anyone can say about God or gods is that they just don't know. Stating a hunch or opinion as though it is a fact is silly. Anyway, their is definitely a devil - he devises new and improved ways for us to lose Grand Finals and does not seem to be running out of ideas. I think the siren sounding as DeGoey charges into an open goal to win the game next year might be the next outcome on his agenda.
 

domus

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 31, 2008
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If you think about the emotional investment in sporting teams purely rationally, it doesn't make any sense at all. Why take credit for the achievement of others? Why feel shame for the failure of others?[/
I can't think of any hobbies, passions, pastimes that can't be reduced to being trivial or even absurd to someone who has no interest in them.
 

THATSGOLD

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 21, 2005
16,658
6,873
the G.. home of the pies!
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Let's say hypothetically that we won today... we'd all be buzzing for a few hours. We'd buy the Herald Sun poster, and brag for a little while. But let's face it, after this weekend Australia doesn't give a sh*t about footy.

I recall after 2010, posters were desperate to celebrate a week later, and talking about pubs to catch up at etc... but it was fairly pointless. No one truly cared anymore.

My point is that footy is about the journey, not the destination. Think of how much enjoyment we've gotten out of the pies season, over the course of the whole year. The grand final really comes down to a post-game 3 hour dopamine rush for the winner vs 3 hours of feeling like sh*t for the loser. Then both sides come back to reality and move on.

I'm not saying that premierships are not important, or trying to take anything away from WC... I just see beloved posters like Dave truly struggling, and I think, isn't it better to come 2nd than to come 4th? Isn't it better to come 2nd than come 8th, or not make the 8 at all? This stings more in the short term than it would've to get knocked out earlier in the finals, but it shouldn't.

Another point: it IS just a game. My sister was called by a recently arrived Chinese colleague shortly after the game for something unrelated, and my sister mentioned how sad she was about the game... her colleague asked, "But you didn't play did you? And none of your friends or family are in the team? It doesn't affect your day to day life really? I don't understand why you care?"
It's a valid point to consider, for those of us who are super passionate about the team. Worry about the things that you have direct control over; it is irrational to worry about that which you have no control over.

Pardon my rambling, and I'm sure that I will cop plenty of hate from the haters, both internally from pies fans and externally from oppo supporters, but I'm just trying to help people feel better.

Ps we knocked richmond out of the finals.
Kidding yourself. Collingwood have won 2 flags in 60 years if you think winning it meant that? 2 flags in 60 years. It’s everything you play for. We are chokers when it comes to Grand Finals.
 

barrackers

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 4, 2016
9,518
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Being close it's one of those grand finals where winning wouldn't change how I feel about the effort of the players, however I would much prefer to have still been around the sporting precinct celebrating now and again in a few hours. Five points is bugger all, but today it's the difference between disappointment and euphoria. For mine if I didn't have that difference of emotion there's no point following sport and Collingwood.

The question of why people get so emotionally invested in something as arbitrary sporting clubs is one for the ages and philosophers. To varying extents I suspect the sense of belonging to something bigger is a factor for most with the reasons behind that being unique and differing from individual to individual. As Hazz says the same could be said for a lot of other things in life too and it would be pretty boring if we as people didn't have highs, lows and something to invest passion in.
 

DWil6

Norm Smith Medallist
Feb 13, 2007
7,256
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We are all blessed and cursed that we chose Collingwood. I’d never change but imagine how we’d feel if we chose the hawks, for example. My Hawthorn supporting mate said he didn’t know you could actually lose a grand final when he was a kid. We could teach the Hawks supporters a thing or two about it.
 

Apples

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Aug 26, 2009
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I was devastated last night. So close! Then the long walk up Hoddle St passed the pubs with the gloating drunks looking for a fight. One drunken oaf of a Richmond supporter got a big spray from me.....I could see the cops walking up behind him, so gave him a bit more.

I woke up at 3am this morning going over the game again. Tried and tried to find sleep, but no luck. I started doing the sums.
I was born in a premiership year 1953 and vaguely remember 1958.
I sat in the kitchen disappointed in 1964.
I remember listening to 1966 on my first transistor radio. My first tears for Collingwood that day.
In 1971 I sat opposite the Greasy Joe's at Richmond station, in tears. I still haven't got over that one.
Then there was the draw of 1977 and the loss the week later.
1979, 1980 and 1981 are all forgotten. I have never watched them again.
The euphoria of 1990 was indescribable.
Then I suffered in hostile environments - 2001 in a colleague's apartment in Kuwait having to pretend I didn't know the result.....the game was on delay.
2002 was in a bar in Hong Kong with every person present actively barracking against us. The loneliest GF day for me.
2010 brought agony then ecstasy with more agony in 2011.
And then there was 2018.
That's 17 Grand Finals for 4 Wins, 2 Draws and 11 losses.
That's a bad strike rate in anybody's language. I can only remember 2 of those wins.

Can losses make us even more fanatical and rabid? I think they can. I watched the Hawthorn supporters of 2013-15 and just couldn't understand the lack of passion. So many, many flags; all celebrated for a day and then gone.

I saw two boys with their hurting parents on the train last night. One was a chirpy 6 year old I'd guess and the other was an upset 10 year old. I wanted to talk to them....of course you can't do anything like that these days, and tell them that it's hard work barracking for Collingwood and that there would be lots of agony for them in future with a little joy thrown in once in a while. That's what I was thinking.

That Mernda Line train was a tomb of the Collingwood devastated; it was really eerie.

Today I've tried to stay busy; I've avoided TV, the papers and the computer. I've been to the LaTrobe Market, done the housework, transplanted some cuttings, been shopping, strolled through Bunnings.......and it's still only bloody 4pm!

We'll all lick our wounds for the next few weeks and we'll gradually think about it less often.

Then there's the draft and before we know it, summer training will be back with all of its hope, intrigue and crazy predictions.

Be good to yourselves and your families Magpie people. Go Pies!
 

Pedro

Premium Platinum
Mar 15, 2003
9,614
7,740
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I was devastated last night. So close! Then the long walk up Hoddle St passed the pubs with the gloating drunks looking for a fight. One drunken oaf of a Richmond supporter got a big spray from me.....I could see the cops walking up behind him, so gave him a bit more.

I woke up at 3am this morning going over the game again. Tried and tried to find sleep, but no luck. I started doing the sums.
I was born in a premiership year 1953 and vaguely remember 1958.
I sat in the kitchen disappointed in 1964.
I remember listening to 1966 on my first transistor radio. My first tears for Collingwood that day.
In 1971 I sat opposite the Greasy Joe's at Richmond station, in tears. I still haven't got over that one.
Then there was the draw of 1977 and the loss the week later.
1979, 1980 and 1981 are all forgotten. I have never watched them again.
The euphoria of 1990 was indescribable.
Then I suffered in hostile environments - 2001 in a colleague's apartment in Kuwait having to pretend I didn't know the result.....the game was on delay.
2002 was in a bar in Hong Kong with every person present actively barracking against us. The loneliest GF day for me.
2010 brought agony then ecstasy with more agony in 2011.
And then there was 2018.
That's 17 Grand Finals for 4 Wins, 2 Draws and 11 losses.
That's a bad strike rate in anybody's language. I can only remember 2 of those wins.

Can losses make us even more fanatical and rabid? I think they can. I watched the Hawthorn supporters of 2013-15 and just couldn't understand the lack of passion. So many, many flags; all celebrated for a day and then gone.

I saw two boys with their hurting parents on the train last night. One was a chirpy 6 year old I'd guess and the other was an upset 10 year old. I wanted to talk to them....of course you can't do anything like that these days, and tell them that it's hard work barracking for Collingwood and that there would be lots of agony for them in future with a little joy thrown in once in a while. That's what I was thinking.

That Mernda Line train was a tomb of the Collingwood devastated; it was really eerie.

Today I've tried to stay busy; I've avoided TV, the papers and the computer. I've been to the LaTrobe Market, done the housework, transplanted some cuttings, been shopping, strolled through Bunnings.......and it's still only bloody 4pm!

We'll all lick our wounds for the next few weeks and we'll gradually think about it less often.

Then there's the draft and before we know it, summer training will be back with all of its hope, intrigue and crazy predictions.

Be good to yourselves and your families Magpie people. Go Pies!
Sounds very familiar with my story, albeit mine only commenced in 77.
 

FireKrakouer

Is now a leftie
Jul 5, 2011
12,851
18,911
AFL Club
Collingwood
There's a concept in psychology where you have your rational mind, your emotional mind, and your "wise mind" is where they overlap, using a bit of both.

I would assume that most of us here lean more towards our emotional mind, as it takes a certain degree of passion to follow a footy team enthusiastically enough to find BF, register an account, and start posting.

I agree with those stating that it's important to be able to not be rational at times, as life would be cold and boring without emotion. But I think that at times like this, the healthiest option is to try and connect more with our rational mind, try to accept that it's a game of football that we have no control over, maybe reflect on some of the true tragedies in life and compare them to this loss.

I'm hurting badly myself, but isn't this the epitome of "first world problems"?
 

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