Toby Greene makes contact with umpire - Update: Suspension Increased to 6 weeks on Appeal

What will happen to Toby?

  • Gone - 4 weeks or more

    Votes: 129 24.3%
  • Gone - 1-3 weeks

    Votes: 278 52.5%
  • Fine only

    Votes: 99 18.7%
  • Innocent - play on.

    Votes: 24 4.5%

  • Total voters
    530
  • Poll closed .

Remove this Banner Ad

HairyO

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 13, 2015
27,733
29,930
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Maybe Neale gets 2 weeks and Greene gets a 50% loading because of his record.

Why do you think courts take into consideration a guilty person's record before they hand down their sentence?

If you were an active participant in life then you'd know that is how the system works. And more importantly, how it also should work. Recidivists pay higher tolls for their crimes.
But Neale did make intentional contact and got a fine. Dusty made intentional contact and got a fine. If the AFL was serious, then any intentional contact (meaning anything beyond a pure accident) should be a 1 week minimum with no maximum.

Dusty made contact with an umpire twice in one year, Im pretty sure (certainly he has done it more than once). How many before he is a recidivist?

Buddy has a history of running through players to get the ball. I dont think he ever gets a penalty loading. If anything, he gets discounts because he is Buddy.
 

The Cryptkeeper

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 9, 2006
17,093
19,464
Left of centre.
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Super Tottenham....from the Lane.
But Neale did make intentional contact and got a fine. Dusty made intentional contact and got a fine. If the AFL was serious, then any intentional contact (meaning anything beyond a pure accident) should be a 1 week minimum with no maximum.

Dusty made contact with an umpire twice in one year, Im pretty sure (certainly he has done it more than once). How many before he is a recidivist?

Buddy has a history of running through players to get the ball. I dont think he ever gets a penalty loading. If anything, he gets discounts because he is Buddy.
Utter bullshit.

Every single word of it.

As you were.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

HairyO

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 13, 2015
27,733
29,930
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Utter bullshit.

Every single word of it.

As you were.
So Neale didnt intentionally make contact? Dusty didnt intentionally make contact? They were unable to stop their arms reaching out and making contact with the umpires? Was it that windy? Mind controlling satellites?

Dusty hasnt made contact with umpires more than once? Buddy hasnt charged through players who had their head over the ball more than once?

I guess my next question is: Do you actually watch football?

I probably should have started with that question. Would have saved me some time.
 

The Cryptkeeper

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 9, 2006
17,093
19,464
Left of centre.
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Super Tottenham....from the Lane.
So Neale didnt intentionally make contact? Dusty didnt intentionally make contact? They were unable to stop their arms reaching out and making contact with the umpires? Was it that windy? Mind controlling satellites?

Dusty hasnt made contact with umpires more than once? Buddy hasnt charged through players who had their head over the ball more than once?

I guess my next question is: Do you actually watch football?

I probably should have started with that question. Would have saved me some time.
Toby Green is a known grub who has been charged 22 times in his career. He got less than his right whack.

Deal with it.
 

WilloTree

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 16, 2015
5,464
6,033
Inside 50
AFL Club
Fremantle
Other Teams
Claremont Tigers
It wasn’t tolerated, they were punished. If either had infringed in such a disrespectful, confrontational and aggressive manner like Toby, they would have received a similar punishment.

I accept it can be argued that Neale probably deserved a greater sanction, but so can Greene’s incident.
this
 

z547043

Debutant
Aug 17, 2009
88
131
AFL Club
Geelong
So you agree that sometimes its okay to be grabbing the umpire? Or in Dusty's case give them a bit of a shove?
I don’t think it’s ok, neither does the AFL MRO or tribunal because all were sanctioned in some form.

What I think is ok is for the MRO and tribunal like any judicial body to punish actions that are deemed by most reasonable observers to be more severe with a more severe penalty.

Failing to indicate while driving and high range drink driving are both traffic offences. Why don’t they receive the same punishment?
 

HairyO

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 13, 2015
27,733
29,930
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I don’t think it’s ok, neither does the AFL MRO or tribunal because all were sanctioned in some form.

What I think is ok is for the MRO and tribunal like any judicial body to punish actions that are deemed by most reasonable observers to be more severe with a more severe penalty.

Failing to indicate while driving and high range drink driving are both traffic offences. Why don’t they receive the same punishment?
I would think its more driving at 0.15 and driving at 0.2. Stevic said he didnt really think about it until afterwards when he was asked (told) by the AFL. So clearly he didnt think it was an issue at the time. But the AFL decided that now is the time to stamp down on bad behaviour, despite having ignored bad behaviour for years. Is Week 1 of the finals really the right time for that?

Should they bring in some new rules for the Prelim?
 

Soggy2112

Club Legend
Aug 6, 2021
1,057
1,654
AFL Club
Adelaide
I would think its more driving at 0.15 and driving at 0.2. Stevic said he didnt really think about it until afterwards when he was asked (told) by the AFL. So clearly he didnt think it was an issue at the time. But the AFL decided that now is the time to stamp down on bad behaviour, despite having ignored bad behaviour for years. Is Week 1 of the finals really the right time for that?

Should they bring in some new rules for the Prelim?
Neale’s contact was a fairly light tap on the arm. He was also doing it to alert the umpire to the need for a blood rule. Although that is still not appropriate conduct it provides context. This means I would view the contact as neither disrespectful nor intimidatory.

Greene was in a heated exchange and intentionally walked into an umpire. That is both disrespectful and intimidatory, hence a much harsher penalty.

I can’t remember the Martin incident and whenever I search for it it just comes up with videos of him running into the goal umpire.

You claim they ignore this behaviour but they obviously don’t, both Curnow and Hawkins were suspended for very light touches, Hawkins had an argument that he didn’t even know who’s hand he was touching and may have thought he was touching a player.

Are you really incapable of seeing the different levels in each of these incidents and how Greene’s was worse, hence a worse penalty?
 

sherb

Hall of Famer
Sep 28, 2003
31,671
32,681
Western Sydney
AFL Club
Carlton
Other Teams
Swans
So Neale didnt intentionally make contact? Dusty didnt intentionally make contact? They were unable to stop their arms reaching out and making contact with the umpires? Was it that windy? Mind controlling satellites?

Dusty hasnt made contact with umpires more than once? Buddy hasnt charged through players who had their head over the ball more than once?

I guess my next question is: Do you actually watch football?

I probably should have started with that question. Would have saved me some time.
I think you need to understand that, even with intentional umpire contact, there can be different degrees of contact involved.

And, for that matter, different degrees of intent.
 

HairyO

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 13, 2015
27,733
29,930
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I think you need to understand that, even with intentional umpire contact, there can be different degrees of contact involved.

And, for that matter, different degrees of intent.
I do agree. But if umpires are untouchable, then any intentional contact should be at least 1 week, not a fine. The AFL uses the fine system to allow itself to protect potential Brownlow medallists. We see it over and over.

They will simply invent whatever excuse they want to get whatever outcome they want.
 

Hoops

Norm Smith Medallist
Jul 30, 2004
8,300
4,919
Danger! Ive got Wood
AFL Club
Geelong
Other Teams
Vixens
I do agree. But if umpires are untouchable, then any intentional contact should be at least 1 week, not a fine. The AFL uses the fine system to allow itself to protect potential Brownlow medallists. We see it over and over.

They will simply invent whatever excuse they want to get whatever outcome they want.
We also see the opposite - see Fyfe and Dangerfield recently in potential Brownlow years. Your issue is with the MRO inconsistency where there are plenty of other threads to post your banality on.
 

HairyO

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 13, 2015
27,733
29,930
AFL Club
Hawthorn
We also see the opposite - see Fyfe and Dangerfield recently in potential Brownlow years. Your issue is with the MRO inconsistency where there are plenty of other threads to post your banality on.
Fyfe had 4 chances one year. He got fine after fine and in one game the AFL even ignored a couple of incidents which often draw penalties (dropped a knee in to Taylor Duryea's head after laying a poor tackle). Sometimes if its impossible to not penalise they do, but if they see a chance they take it.

Like with Dusty and Neale making deliberate contact with umpires and the AFL deciding to have them be fines.

Like with dangerous tackles this year. Sometimes you do no damage and get a fine. Sometimes you do no damage and get a week. Sometimes you knock the person out and get no penalty at all. The rules dont say that sometimes dangerous tackles are okay. They list what constitutes dangerous. And the penalties which should apply.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Boston tiger

Norm Smith Medallist
May 10, 2010
6,568
4,692
Where it all began
AFL Club
Richmond
So if Neale had done what Greene did then it would be maybe just a week because he is a usually a good guy?

This is exactly the problem with the AFL. There are so many grey areas that they have built in to allow them to decide whatever outcome they want based on whatever they think will work best for them.

The AFLPA should be demanding clear and concise rules which treat every player equally. But they wont, because half their funding comes from the AFL.
Neale may have got more . Certainly no one would be getting less. Because we know Toby is a bit of spinner he may have got the benefit of the doubt on the aggressive side of things.
 

Mile High Tiger

Club Legend
Sep 16, 2008
1,376
1,581
Melbourne
AFL Club
Richmond
Other Teams
Liverpool, Denver, MVFC
bzzt
He is objective and most of the time right. He does go hard though on opinions.
I don’t like how he pretends to be a cats fan when he is clearly barracking for the Dees this year. Fake cat fan!

Now someone in the media has finally caught on to what I’ve been saying.
Whateley calling out the Toby Tax. It’s rubbish and he is the luckiest person in football who not only gets off most charges but gets them reduced.
Agreed. He gets away with so much and has had very few suspensions. Should be referred to as the Toby Tax Return.
 

OnlyPowerForever

Club Legend
Mar 22, 2021
2,680
3,814
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
And in rides Gil, on his white horse and shiny armour, ready to defend the rights of umpires against intentional contact....

.... at the eighth hour.

At least now everyone will know where the line is, not before time.
 

Sentinel

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 15, 2012
5,337
15,493
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
And in rides Gil, on his white horse and shiny armour, ready to defend the rights of umpires against intentional contact....

.... at the eighth hour.

At least now everyone will know where the line is, not before time.
The AFL already put forward a minimum 6 week suspension preference at the Tribunal. This isn't the AFL coming in late, nor is it a surprise.
 

HairyO

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 13, 2015
27,733
29,930
AFL Club
Hawthorn
And in rides Gil, on his white horse and shiny armour, ready to defend the rights of umpires against intentional contact....

.... at the eighth hour.

At least now everyone will know where the line is, not before time.
... until the next time a Brownlow favourite makes intentional contact with an umpire. Then it will be reset to a fine, not weeks.
 

Substance

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 6, 2012
8,716
13,929
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
How many times have we heard from Toby that he doesn't need to change the way he goes about it. Every time he gets a fine for kicking someone in the face, or for eye gouging, hair pulling thuggery, this idea was reinforced that he really doesn't need to change because the consequences aren't severe enough.

Far from a Toby Tax, the evidence shows he gets a Toby Tax Return, always a fine instead of a suspension, always a 1 week suspension when it should be 3. The fact that he was allowed to face the Lions in a semi final in 2019, only to repeat the previous games offence of eye gouging the oppositions best player proves the point. He should have copped 3 weeks, got off, does it again, should have copped 5+ since he didn't get the message from a $7,500 fine. This time I hope they give him 6+. Wouldn't change him though, the coach, the whole club won't tell him what he needs to hear.
 

Teal Leviathan

Debutant
Aug 14, 2020
66
242
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Toby Greene was lucky to only be given three weeks for his actions and should be prepared to wear a greater penalty following the AFL's reasonable appeal. However, I do think that what we are looking at is the end product of a much broader atmosphere of disrespect towards umpires that the AFL has allowed to fester for many years now, including their leniency regarding previous incidents such as Lachie Neale's and the general tolerance of players talking back to umpires. That's not a reason to give Toby fewer weeks, but rather for the AFL to also reflect more broadly on how it regulates, or fails to regulate, player-umpire interactions. These issues don't begin with Toby Greene, and attention to them shouldn't end with him, and if they do.... well, one can understand why Toby, his family, supporters, etc. would be frustrated at wearing a heavy individual penalty for what is really a systemic problem within the game.
 
Last edited:

Remove this Banner Ad

Remove this Banner Ad