Autopsy Tom Hawkins Vs Tom Lynch (Richmond)

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mc snooza

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#30
Well in the next two years they should retain simular form for the purposes of this thread.Hawkins has 498 goals from 232 games, Lynch has 254 goals from 131 games.
If Hawkins played for the sun's he would be lucky to have 98 goals..


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Milanista28

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#31
Yeah we've all seen milk turn faster than Tommy but that shouldn't take anything away from how good a player he is, Lynch should have a better year in a better side but Tom is still performing at a high level.

This thread will be bumped a few times throughout the year.
 

catstorm

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#33
Ok now show me what Hawkins' numbers are at 131 games (same amount of games as what Lynch has played)?
Rather than go off just games I think seasons are a better measure, durability is also a category that should be considered so I’ll show Hawkins stats at the end of his 8th season as that is where Lynch is now.

Games: 147
Goals: 286 goals 1.95 per game
Behinds: 160 1.09pg
Marks: 803 5.46pg
C marks: 263 1.79pg
I50 marks: 404 2.75pg
Disposals: 1713 11.65pg
Tackles: 244 1.66pg
I50: 260 1.77pg
 

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#38
So your argument is that Lynch is younger and therefore a better choice. Fine. I would choose the better proven player.
No, my argument is that Hawkins took a long time to become the player he is today.
And when you say proven, just remember this is a guy who has averaged 4.3 marks and 1.4 goals in the finals throughout his career.
 

Bojangles17

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#39
Lets say you can take one for the next few years , who would you take?According to some, Lynch (Richmond not the Crows one) is one knee injury away from a wheelchair and can't play well in big games when the pressure is on.On the other hand people are saying that Hawkins has the turning circle of a Mack truck and is nothing more than an accurate kick with a big behind.
I didn’t know lynch had played in a big game , hawkins has been on the way out for a while doesn’t worry too many good sides these days



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Carl Spackler

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#40
No, my argument is that Hawkins took a long time to become the player he is today.
And when you say proven, just remember this is a guy who has averaged 4.3 marks and 1.4 goals in the finals throughout his career.
Yes, ok. But Hawkins is the player he is today. While Lynch is not the player that Hawkins is today. And Lynch lacks the evidence to prove he will become the player that Hawkins is today (being he's been at Gold Coast his whole career, which is no one's fault, not even the Romans). So I would take Hawkins. I know what I get. Lynch is an expensive gamble.
 

winty

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Moderator #41
I didn’t know lynch had played in a big game , hawkins has been on the way out for a while doesn’t worry too many good sides these days



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Hawkins actually had his career best season in terms of possessions, marks and goals per game in 2018, but let's not let the facts get in the way of a good story, shall we?
 
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#42
Yes, ok. But Hawkins is the player he is today. While Lynch is not the player that Hawkins is today. And Lynch lacks the evidence to prove he will become the player that Hawkins is today (being he's been at Gold Coast his whole career, which is no one's fault, not even the Romans). So I would take Hawkins. I know what I get. Lynch is an expensive gamble.
You make Tom Lynch out to be Levi Casboult or similar.
That's the price of talented key forwards in today's market. They are worth over a million per season. I don't see any gamble at all unless he has underlying health concerns because as a footballer, he is one of the best forwards in the country.

And as good as Hawkins was last year, Lynch has already matched that kind of output as recently as 2016

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy...&pid1=3457&pid2=1759&fid1=P&fopt1=2016&fid2=S

I'm not sure where this bashing of Lynch is coming from. and I can't believe I am one of a few who would take him over Hawkins if I had to pick today.
I guess we will wait and see what happens but I feel pretty good about Lynch's chances of having a superior season to Hawkins.
 

Fadge

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#43
No, my argument is that Hawkins took a long time to become the player he is today.
And when you say proven, just remember this is a guy who has averaged 4.3 marks and 1.4 goals in the finals throughout his career.
You might want to check out Hawkins' last quarter in the 2011 Grand Final.

Again, don't let stats get in the way when assessing on field performance....
 

adammania9

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#44
Lynch’s 2016 season was absolutely sensational, and one of the best this decade, comparable to one of Nick Riewoldt’s best, but his 2018 was so bad that you can’t possibly take Lynch ahead of Hawkins without seeing him play for Richmond beforehand.

Lynch’s potential at Richmond is sky high but I’d prefer the more proven, more durable Hawkins.
 

Fadge

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#45
I would have liked to have Lynch at Collingwood but he chose the Tigers despite the fact they clearly have an inferior list to Collingwood.

He should have spoken to Adam Treloar before he made his decision...
 
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#47
You might want to check out Hawkins' last quarter in the 2011 Grand Final.

Again, don't let stats get in the way when assessing on field performance....
I posted this already in another thread.
Hawkins has played two standout games in September.
The 2011 grand final where he monstered Ben Reid and a semi final against North Melbourne where he almost won us the game but the rest have been pretty mediocre.
I'd give a pass mark to someone 194cm/95kg but not this guy as he is 198cm/108kg so he his bigger and stronger than all defenders but still comes up short far too often in September.

Completely understand stats can be misleading but Geelong people like to knock Billy Brainless for his reputed lackluster performances in September, yet this guy continually gets a pass despite being one of the highest paid at the club and enters almost every final series in red hot form (except for 2013 due to back stiffness).
 

Dr Tigris

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#48
On recent performance (especially 2018) Hawkins is better.

On proven potential I'd have them relatively even, with Lynch ahead because he's more versatile.

Age is important only is that Lynch has years left of top level play and Hawkins doesn't (hope he proves me wrong I like him).

Comparison between 2 top line KPFs is more a matter of taste and which club you barrack for.
 

Fadge

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#49
I posted this already in another thread.
Hawkins has played two standout games in September.
The 2011 grand final where he monstered Ben Reid and a semi final against North Melbourne where he almost won us the game but the rest have been pretty mediocre.
I'd give a pass mark to someone 194cm/95kg but not this guy as he is 198cm/108kg so he his bigger and stronger than all defenders but still comes up short far too often in September.

Completely understand stats can be misleading but Geelong people like to knock Billy Brainless for his reputed lackluster performances in September, yet this guy continually gets a pass despite being one of the highest paid at the club and enters almost every final series in red hot form (except for 2013 due to back stiffness).
Is a key forward meant to dominate every game in September?

Wayne Carey is generally regarded as one if the greatest, if not the greatest, in the game.

How does his finals record, and in particular his Grand Final record, stack up?
 
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#50
Wayne Carey is generally regarded as one if the greatest, if not the greatest, in the game.

How does his finals record, and in particular his Grand Final record, stack up?
Are you joking?
Carey's disposal averages never dropped in finals. He was just as consistent as he was in round 22.
He averaged 17 disposals, 7 marks, 2.5 goals in September.
He kicked 5+ goals in a final on five separate occasions.

Hawkins has only done it once and he has only kicked 3 goals or more once!
I cannot think of another dominant forward who has managed 500 career goals but stunk it up so consistently as what he has. And it's not like he hasn't had enough opportunities. He's played in 20 finals.
 
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