sr36
Hall of Famer
I'm not a good judge of kids - I get a heap wrong, but I saw him in one reserves game and called myself Pendlebury on a different site. He was just obviously on another level.
Player Watch Tom Wilson (Delisted 2023)
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Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
IMO, Madgen was the big winner out of Howe going down and Langdon not making it back. Now that Howe’s back he’s no longer a lock and given 2021 will be a year of transition I think he’ll lose out to the likes of Wilson, Reef and Keane when it’s a 50/50 call which it will only be when two of Howe, Moore and Roughead are unavailable.
Murphy is more intriguing to me. I’m a big fan because of how he attacks the ball in the air, how sticky his hands are and how well he reads it coming in. I scratch my head when posters talk him down for his leg speed because I don’t see it, but what I do see is a guy that is often injured and is never talked up as one to watch in 2021 by the club. That says to me that something isn’t adding up and others will get a look in first unless something changes. Once you move down the pecking order as a defender there’s no coming back (just look at Scharenberg).
IMO, clearing players out had little to do with development. We had Varcoe, Reid, Beams, Langdon and Dunn retire, Treloar and Phillips were salary dumped, Atu, Appleby and Wills were marginal talents who’s time had run out and Scharenberg and Broomhead were too injury prone. The one that strikes me as a cross for our development was Stephenson because if it clicks for him we won’t live that one down for a decade, but he went into the wrong environment (thankfully it wasn’t Sydney or Hawthorn that were interested). I suspect too that North were the only one’s that were seriously interested and there’s an underlying reason for it. Time will tell though.
In terms of a clean out I feel I could make a strong case that we could have gone much deeper with Greenwood, Lynch, WHE, Mayne, Tohill and Cox all borderline calls for me in 2020 and needing something big to be retained beyond 2021 (although Cox holds on because of our list management). By borderline calls I mean had the club moved them on I’d have supported it. That also doesn’t include guys that you could make a “hard” call on in Elliott, C Brown, JT (excluding Madgen and Murphy) who have played a lot of footy across 19-20, but things could go either way.
None of that first group of guys have been developmentally challenged by being in our system they’re either no longer up to it or never were. Unfortunately the list had run its race beyond the first 10-15 so it needs refreshing. The tricky part is we got 5 good assets to start with in the 2020 draft, but because we’re chips in on Daicos (rightfully so) we need to find a way to get back into the 2021 draft after he receives a bid in order to”thicken the soup”.
All in all I just don’t see the talent being there that we had in 15-19 and I think we’ll see the magnets thrown around in 2021.
Edit: as the dust is settling on 2020 if we’re even close to a 50/50 record this year then Buckley’s retained. We’ve always been able to cover injuries because the list went 30+ deep and that’s no longer the case. That means that we could once rely on talent alone to be competitive and system to be a contender. It’s now flipped and our competitiveness hinges on system which means if we play like it’s 2020 then we’ll be bottom 6 in 2021...
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Tom Wilson hasn’t played a game yet though.
They were natural footballers allowed to play with flair, it's not always about physical attributes, you have to know how to find the ball and what to do with it and those 4 players had it in spades, even in the under 18's, it was the foolish clubs who overlooked them because of physical attributes that lost out in the end.
Some players don't even need to.
Lebron James famously said that Tom Wilson is probably the most talented sportsman he's ever played on in college basketball.
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I saw Chapman through little athletics and junior football. Anyone who saw him compete knew he was remarkable. Remove him from that list.
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I guess what I'd be interested to understand from you then (or anyone) is how do you see him getting the ball? Regardless of weapons apparent now.
Will he be an intercepting HB? Will be be a handball-receiving wingman? Will he be an uncontested marking forward? Or a contested marking forward? Will he be a first or second possession inside mid? How do we think he will actually get it?
You won’t get that from me, I’ve never seen him play. Hoping he can bring the standard basketball attributes...good in traffic, good vision, good decision making and skills. Those attributes can be used anywhere win the field and particularly with some height and agility.
Except for the recruiters that let him slip to pick 31
He also said that about me
No idea, we've been talking about Lebron James
sr36
Hall of Famer
Remove the whole list. Stevie J not obviously talented? James Bartel? If you're including Bartel, you may as well throw in Luke Hodge.
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Yep, Danny Roach was a better player than Paul Chapman because he was picked at #7 in that draft, it doesn't matter that Chapman won 3 flags, a Norm Smith and played 279 more games
You’re sort of missing the point of the sequence of comments.Yep, Danny Roach was a better player than Paul Chapman because he was picked at #7 in that draft, it doesn't matter that Chapman won 3 flags, a Norm Smith and played 279 more games
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As soon as you said that Stevie J, Chapman and Bartel were unremarkable (all Norm Smith medal winners mind you), you lost all credibility.
is this one of those riddles... b/c lebron never played college basketball...................!
I also had high hopes for Murphy, but his defensive game may be lacking. JDG kicked 6 on him in last pre-season's first praccy match, and he never seemed to recover...
Apex36
Hall of Famer
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He did get the best 2nds player award, so there must be something there to work with.
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I don't want to labour the point, but those attributes are only relevant when the player has the ball in their hands. I'd expect that Wilson has these as well, as well as being a good user by foot both sides. That isn't my question mark - my question mark is how does he get the ball in his hands. Will he win it in the contest? Will he take contested marks, or marks in space by outworking his opponent? Or intercept marks in defence? They are probably the four most realistic options.
TradeDraft
Post-Human
Try Murphy on the Wing?
Agree. If you are playing league football you are a very good athlete.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
I personally hope he doesn’t have a black mark against him for that. JDG is a nightmare match up for guys that are suited to him let alone one who isn’t like Murphy. I’m sure we all remember what he did to a similarly rangy ball hunting defender in the 18 PF?..
The only guy on our list currently capable of standing a JDG, Dangerfield, Zurhaar, Rayner or Martin is Howe. Murphy, like Langdon, isn’t strong enough one on one for it.
Apex36
Hall of Famer
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Would have thought Maynard would be a more suitable matchup for those guys tbh.
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I don't think practice match form counts for too much - and certainly not a black mark that stains an entire future career.
The bigger issue for Murphy is that he hasn't had much development time because of injuries, and when he has played he has been only okay.
The bigger issue for Murphy is that he hasn't had much development time because of injuries, and when he has played he has been only okay.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
IMO, they’d get him in the air (aside from Martin) because Maynard is a beast at ground level. It’s why he struggles with Ryan. I also think we prefer him on guys that are physically smaller than so he can bully them. Think your Cameron, Betts, Stephenson, Ryan and Butler. In terms of like for like, Howe aside, until McInnes comes on I agree he’s the best suited to it, but I doubt we’ll see him v those mid sized types.
