Opinion Top 10 players from 1987 to now?

[The Swert]

struggling to think of a better ruckman than primus in the 90s (apart from maybe salmon, already mentioned)

Rehn, Everitt, McKernan, White?

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Please get back to me when you have a valid argument and some statistics to back up Archer being even close to the top 10 players of the last 20 years. Oh, and a made up award such as Shinboner of the century doesn't count.

Oh, statistics!

Let me just go and check Glenn Archer's official awesomeness rating and get back to you.

You're the one carrying on like a clown in this thread, suggesting that the mere mention of Glenn Archer is some kind of heinous oversight.

Get over yourself. He was a champion who played 300+ games. We can disagree over where he sits, but to suggest he's not even in the mix is wide of the mark.

 

[DG-Man]

1. Ablett Snr
2. Williams
3. Voss
4. Silvagni
5. Carey
6. Hird
7. Judd
8. Lockett
9. Dunstall
10. Harvey

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

I see a few people are mentioning Judd, and I definitely condsidered it.

But do you reckon he's played enough footy?

Most of the other blokes mentioned in this thread played 250 games.

Is Judd maybe a few years off really commanding a spot in this kind of list?

Don't get wrong, the standard of footy he's produced is up there with the best, but has he sufficiently ticked the longevity box?

 

[In And Under Tiger]

Of course Judd is in the top 10.

Quality >>> Quantity

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Of course Judd is in the top 10.

Quality >>> Quantity

I dunno.

I don't think it's that cut and dry.

That quality >>> quantity line overlooks the fact that longevity counts. Great players are great for a long time.

I'm not 100% convinced that Judd has been doing it long enough to be considered an automatic selection. Certainly, he's in the mix, but I reckon he's a few more good seasons away from being a walk-up start.

If you're totally committed to that quality >>> quantity, then you have to start considering Gary Ablett Jr and Buddy Franklin. The standard of footy they've produced in recent times puts them right in the mix. But, as with Judd, I would question whether they've been doing it long enough. Judd has more runs on the board than either of those guys, but still, my point is that longevity counts.

If you really believe that quality >>> quantity, then you should have Kouta in your list because, for about two seasons at the end of last decade, Kouta was as dominant as any player I've seen. But he won't get mentioned because, as I've suggested, longevity counts.

 

[X_box_X]

1) Carey
2) Ablett SNR
3) Dunstall
4) Lockett
5) R. Harvey
6) G. Williams
7) Buckley
8) Hird
9) Voss
10) Silvagni

Surely Stynes and Wynd deserve more recognition for best ruckmen of the last twenty years?

 

[pacemaker]

22 years and in that time there would of been about 3 different era's of footy players, and only can select a top 10. This can not be done with huge disagreement amoungst others. The gap is too huge.

I dont think i saw A.Goodes in anyones top 10. he is player who would have achieved equal to many individuals top 10. 2 brownlow's, premiership, number of all australian selections/ B+F awards, NAB Raising star award.

I cant believe Judd is being missed in most of the top 10. Brownlow, norm smith, premiership captain, number of all australian selections/ B+F awards

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Surely Stynes and Wynd deserve more recognition for best ruckmen of the last twenty years?

I guess people just don't remember them as having the same impact as the guys named.

Probably fair enough too.

The reality is that Dean Cox is a better player than either.

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

I dont think i saw A.Goodes in anyones top 10. he is player who would have achieved equal to many individuals top 10. 2 brownlow's, premiership, number of all australian selections/ B+F awards, NAB Raising star award.

Do you take these awards seriously?

I reckon Brownlows should basically be ignored when assessing players.

Does anyone actually think that Goodes was the best player in the comp when he won those Brownlows?

And NAB Rising Star? Who cares?

I'm not at all surprised that Goodes hasn't been mentioned.

I cant believe Judd is being missed in most of the top 10. Brownlow, norm smith, premiership captain, number of all australian selections/ B+F awards

As a truly elite player, how many games do you reckon Judd has played?

You'd be talking about 2004 to present, with a year or so in the middle when he was nowhere near his best.

So maybe 120 games as an absolute top-liner?

For mine, that's simply not enough footy for him to be a walk-up start against guys who played 250+ games.

 

[In And Under Tiger]

Once a player has player 150 games as Judd and Ablett have and had 2-3 years at the peak of the game I think that is enough to warrant selection. Sure Franklin has a way to go, but 150 games is plenty IMO. It is not like they have just fluked a good season, both have been at the top for a while.

 

[In And Under Tiger]

Remember Coleman only played 98 games and was selected as full forward in the team of the century.

 

[X_box_X]

I guess people just don't remember them as having the same impact as the guys named.

Probably fair enough too.

The reality is that Dean Cox is a better player than either.

You're not going to get any argument from me in regards to Cox. He is the best ruckman I have seen. But I just think Wynd and Stynes both deserve more recognition - both were better than Salmon and Primus, for example.

 

[X_box_X]

Remember Coleman only played 98 games and was selected as full forward in the team of the century.

Doesn't mean it's right, though. It just means the selection panel don't rate longevity. I certainly rate longevity, and so do a lot of other people. That's the beauty about having differing opinions - lists will always be different.

No argument that Coleman was a great player going by stats and limited footage, but can you honestly rate him ahead of Dunstall and Lockett based on stats alone? Longevity should get the latter two home.

 

[gandd]

Have you ever read Greg Williams' autobiography.His stated desires as a footballer were to be in the top ten in possessions,top ten in the Brownlow,B+F ect. Not one mention of team.He probably belongs in the ten but what a ****​

 

[Smell The Glove]

Really, there is a list of about 15-20 players you could name, and then list depending on your individual criteria and their weight.

In no particular order:

Lockett, Ablett, Dunstall, Williams, Carey, Hird, Voss, Silvagni, Buckley, Judd, Williams, Kernahan, Harvey, Matera, Riccuito and probably a few others I've missed.

 

[Damon_3388]

Have you ever read Greg Williams' autobiography.His stated desires as a footballer were to be in the top ten in possessions,top ten in the Brownlow,B+F ect. Not one mention of team.He probably belongs in the ten but what a ****​

I think that's an example of what Sam Newman was saying on The Footy Show a little while back. It seems selfish on face value, but him doing his best to reach those milestones ultimately helped his team win games, because he had the talent to actually get lots of possessions, and do something good with them, and in turn he was recognised as a great player. Regardless of whether people deem him selfish or whatever, he's the best footballer I've seen in my lifetime.

Gary Ablett Snr. wasn't exactly a great team man either. Whether it was going walkabout, or not training hard, or his general aloof nature, I wouldn't imagine he would have exactly endeared himself to teammates over the years. If he wasn't among the greatest players ever, his behaviour probably would have never been tolerated.

 

[lose]

little surprised not to see gary lyons name thrown up at all... surely he is at least on the edge as he is the best player melbourne has had throughout this time... also rate dustin fletcher right up there with the best... is/was a star of the competition...

 

[doggiesin08]

Dissapointing Chris Grant hasn't recieved more recognition. Was awsome in 90's especially. 1 vote off the Brownlow in '96, probably would've won it if Mecuri or Misiti I think didn't kick a last minute goal against the Dogs in the last round (Hird got 3 votes and won, Grant got 2 votes). Then he followed up with the most votes in 1997. Not too many key position players have fared well in the Brownlow in the last 20 years so a good effort to be right up there for a few years.

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Looks like this thread is about to devolve into "what about this bloke from my team?".

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Once a player has player 150 games as Judd and Ablett have and had 2-3 years at the peak of the game I think that is enough to warrant selection.

Well, why didn't you pick Ablett Jr?

Why didn't you pick Kouta?

Bottom line is, not enough top notch footy. Same with Judd.

 

[In And Under Tiger]

1. Wayne Carey
2. Gary Ablett Sr
3. Nathan Buckley
4. Chris Judd
5. James Hird
6. Jason Dunstall
7. Tony Lockett
8. Gary Ablett Jr
9. Michael Voss
10. Greg Williams

Well, why didn't you pick Ablett Jr?

Why didn't you pick Kouta?

Bottom line is, not enough top notch footy. Same with Judd.

I did pick Ablett Jr. His last 50 games have been as good as anyone over that period of time, and even his 50 before that were of a pretty high level.

Kouta's best was only 20-30 games, and to be honest the rest of his career was pretty ordinary.

Bottom line is, it is enough top notch footy. Same with Judd.

 

[monty1104]

1. Wayne Carey
2. Ablett Snr.
3. Mark Ricciuto
4. James hird
5. Robert Harvey
6. Michael Voss
7. Tony Modra
8. Greg Williams
9. Tony Lockett
10. Peter Matera

Modra Deserves to be in there just on goals per game. He was probably the most exciting player ive ever seen, but he didnt have the longevity of others.

Tried to find spots for Kouta, Scott West, John Platten, Tony Liberatore Jason Dunstall just to name a few, but there were only 10 spots.

 

[RangaInTeal]

Seriously?

Wouldn't be top 20.

How many ruckmen have dominated so much, rules were changed to stop the influence of one?

 

[Weiterbot23]

Judd wouldn't be in that top 10 yet, but by the end of his career his credentials will hold him higher than Voss, Buckley and Hird.