Good list but obviously easier for defenders and mids than forwards.
Breust kicked more than 50 goals and may end up with 60+ and just scrapes in.
Breust kicked more than 50 goals and may end up with 60+ and just scrapes in.
Opinion Top 50 2014
- Thread starter eaglespremiers
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- #128
I agree that this year has been one for the def/mids rather than one for the forwards.
So my list of forwards at the moment:
1. Franklin
2. Gunston
3. Riewoldt
4. Roughead
5. Breust
----------------
6. Ballantyne
7. Hawkins
8. Schulz
9. Elliott
How do you rate Breust compared to his teammates Gunston, Hodge and Roughead? Has he had a better year than any of them?
If he's below Roughead then he's in the 40-50 range according to my calculations.
- Thread starter
- #129
You'll notice that Ballantyne was in my Round 16 version (just).
Since then he's had the following games:
Rd 17 - 13 touches, 5 goals
Rd 19 - 8 touches, 3 goals
Rd 20 - 10 touches, 1 goal
It was a hard choice but I decided to drop him out of the 50.
Like I mentioned above he's my next choice for forward and it was an oversight him not being on the unluckies list.
I'm not convinced that he has been your second best player. Obviously I still rate Sandilands year and then have a whole host of players who have played well this year including Mundy, Barlow, Hill and Ballantyne. Why do you think he's "clearly been [y]our 2nd best player this year"?
- Thread starter
- #130
Jones and Priddis are hard to rate because they have such poor players around them.
Truth be told I don't really rate Priddis' contribution this year. However, it is hard to mount an argument that he shouldn't be on the list at all.
Would you then suggest that he be in the 40-50 range?
Jones is interesting when you compare players around him. I think it is arguable that he has had a comparable season to the following players - Selwood and Treloar.
Obviously Selwood tends to have the bigger games, yet his season has been marred by games where he has been well held and relatively ineffective.
Treloar and Jones' stats compare quite well.
Treloar vs Jones
27.6 disp 27.7 disp
6.1 cl 6.1 cl
12.3 disp 11.3 disp
5.7 tackles 5.2 tackles
0.6 goals 0.3 goals
Based on that information (even though stats aren't the be-all-and-end-all determinant) a good case can be made that Jones should be in the 22-27 range rather than at 17.
Sloane and Cunnington are difficult to place. Often their influence on a game defies their stats. I've seen games where Cunnington has 20 touches and is quite clearly the dominant midfielder on the ground. Perhaps Sloane could be pushed behind Parker, Prestia and Martin but I'd be loath to push him much further than that.
You're right about Stokes. Since Round 14 when he was injured he has been pretty poor and I will consider whether to keep him for my next list.
McGlynn is a very tricky one. Again his impact belies his stats. On face value 20.9 disp, 3.7 clearances and 9.5 cont disp aren't particularly good in terms of general stats. 6.8 tackles, however, puts him in the top 3 for midfielders and 19 goals for the season places him only behind Harvey, Gray, Martin, Ablett, D. Smith, Bennell, Duncan, Beams, Fyfe and I. Smith for goals kicked by a midfielder. As it stands I'm torn as to how I should rate his season.
Talia I rate as the 2nd best defender (arguably best) and have accordingly placed him a couple of spots behind Mackenzie.
My list at this point in time is:
1. Mackenzie
2. Talia
3. Hooker
4. Taylor
5. Rance
6. Carlile/Thompson
I'd love to know the actual break down of goals kicked on every player but only have that break down on Mackenzie because I've done it myself. I simply don't trust the tallies concocted for the television. I consider them very inaccurate.
I think you've answered most of your questions. I think it's more that you have the best KPD in the competition ranked at 27 and next best at 32. You have 3 KPF before McKenzie and at least 20 pure mids. It's a hard task to compare the worth of a KPD to a midfielder, but surely you wouldn't say that there have been 31 better players than THE BEST backman in the competition.
You're totally right in terms of how it's hard to compare stats to actual impact. It's why you have McGlynn higher than say Priddis. I think in a situation like Nat Jones, it's just so hard to determine the impact of his stats due to the poor quality of the players around him. That said, I agree with him being more in the middle of the table.
- Thread starter
- #132
Westhoff obviously had a great start to the season but has not been as good since IMO. In fact if you look at his really good games a trend starts to appear - round 1 v Carl, round 4 v Bris, round 11 v Melb, round 14 v WB, round 18 v Melb, round 19 v Coll and round 21 v GC.
Westhoff has kicked 22 goals for the year (#43), averages 18.2 disposals (#1 for key forwards), 6.9 marks (#2 for key forwards) and 1.3 contested marks (#16 for key forwards).
Compare that to some other key forwards I have on my list (or just outside):
Franklin has kicked 61 goals for the year (#1), averages 16.3 disposals (#3 for key forwards), 5.9 marks (#9 for key forwards) and 1.9 contested marks (#3 for key forwards).
Riewoldt has kicked 47 goals for the year (#8), averages 16.6 disposals (#2 for key forwards), 8.5 marks (#1 for key forwards) and 1.5 contested marks (#12 for key forwards).
Hawkins has kicked 52 goals for the year (#4), averages 12.2 disposals (#x for key forwards), 6.5 marks (#5 for key forwards) and 2.2 contested marks (#2 for key forwards).
If he's not classified as a key forward, but instead is seen as a utility then I'd have to favour players like Fyfe, Hanley, Bartel, Burgoyne and Duncan over him (who each would classify as utilities at some point IMO).
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Good point. I didn't realise that Westhoff beat up on weak teams.
- Thread starter
- #136
It's tough. I've faced criticism before when I rated Mackenzie's year (pre-Hawthorn game) in the teens.
So some people believe that the backmen, at their best, should only rate 40 onwards whereas others believe they can rate as high as 15.
IMO the backs start about right. Mackenzie has been our best player this year but they've been about 25 players probably better than him as well.
- Thread starter
- #137
Would this be a view held by many Freo supporters?
Personally I don't watch enough of every other club to do a league top 50, but I'd have Rance ahead of Cotchin for us this year. If Cotchin slips in, I reckon Rance does too, but that's just my team only ratings.
Yes. For me I rate the top 5 key backs
1. Mackenzie
2. Rance
3. Taylor
4. Talia
5. Hooker
Rance is the best one on one defender in the AFL. http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl...layer-in-the-afl/story-e6frf3e3-1226978113033 These are slightly older statistics, but at one point he conceded 13 goals in 9 games and lost only 7 of 43 contests he had been in. On top of that, he is a great rebounder for us and creates problems for the opposition offensively too. (2nd at Richmond for Avg. Rebound 50's)
He's also number 1 in the AFL for intercepting opposition forward moves. http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-08-15/the-inquirer-setting-the-trap
Mazkenzie goes ahead of Rance due to playing more games and being a better rebounding defender.
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If Ablett drops spots due to missing games, Rance missing 5 is enough to keep him out.
With Fyfe missing another two games coming up will it be enough to knock him from top spot?
With Fyfe missing another two games coming up will it be enough to knock him from top spot?
- Thread starter
- #142
It's an interesting dilemma.
Kennedy could but he's no guarantee to be back before finals. If Gray has two blinders I suppose I'd consider him.
As a general rule of thumb I usually allow about four games grace before considering lowering a player for games missed (over the entirety of the season).
Usually I don't drop a player near the top until other players have played well enough to pass them by.
In the case of Ablett I have adjudged Fyfe's, Kennedy's and Gray's seasons to justify putting them higher.
In the next two weeks I will consider Rockliff and Heppell though I doubt it as I think Fyfe, Kennedy and Gray have been the three standouts this year.
Good list and good question. Breust is so important to our forward line obviously due to his accuracy and his smarts.
Not sure he's been better than the 3 above but probably more consistent, he also gives off goals I wish he'd kick.
