Trade and Draft Rating

[Brant]

I still don’t get why we loaded up on so many draft picks next year. Even for matching bids.

I don’t think there’s been a DRAFT like that of 2020 before, with regard to how ‘compromised’ it stands to be. This creates opportunity.

Clubs are going to want/need Picks for points. Multiple clubs will be chasing them, so they’ll be in demand & we’ll be able to charge a premium price.

It appears as though Downie will be a relatively high Pick, so we may need a couple of Picks ourselves, to match.

 

[Bumps"N"Grins]

I don’t think there’s been a DRAFT like that of 2020 before, with regard to how ‘compromised’ it stands to be. This creates opportunity.

Clubs are going to want/need Picks for points. Multiple clubs will be chasing them, so they’ll be in demand & we’ll be able to charge a premium price.

It appears as though Downie will be a relatively high Pick, so we may need a couple of Picks ourselves, to match.

This

Will probably trade picks to needy academy laden clubs for future 2021 picks

 

[Gralin]

It's amazing people think missing on Cogs is a failure given the circumstances.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

It's amazing people think missing on Cogs is a failure given the circumstances.

It was if we were serious about being a real premiership threat immediately. Will take a little longer now.

 

[Brant]

It was if we were serious about being a real premiership threat immediately. Will take a little longer now.

Having a shot at something achievable & missing might be considered a failure.

'Achievable'...

 

[Aramis]

When you look across all those players they're all quick (all 4 broke 3 seconds for the 20s sprint IIRC) and they're all touted to have strong hands in the marking contest.

Speaking of horrifically premature...

Could this be representative of where Clarko is heading tactically?

Back to the future in that, we are now looking for speed in players to get to uncontested marking opportunities again? Maybe add in the Stamina to maintain it over 4 quarters...., Might seem simple but that's how we've typically operated.

 

[threesixpio]

Does anyone else think that Frost is essentially the long term replacement for Frawley? Both players have similar attributes in that they're fast, strong and can be absolutely chaotic if given too much time to think about what they're doing. I feel that both need simple game plans or a better system to flourish.

I wonder it Hartley can play CHB and if that's something the club may have an eye out for.

Nope - Kosi will be playing at CHB and another guy whose name I can’t quite recall will play at FB

(Better Brant ?)

 

[KermitJagger]

Speaking of horrifically premature...

Could this be representative of where Clarko is heading tactically?

Back to the future in that, we are now looking for speed in players to get to uncontested marking opportunities again? Maybe add in the Stamina to maintain it over 4 quarters...., Might seem simple but that's how we've typically operated.

I mean there are a few obvious ways to beat Richmond's game style that are easier said than done. You want to limit ground ball by marking it, but you don't want players who are hopelessly outmatched if they can't mark it. Traditionally our forwards, tall or short, are elite in ground ball work for their position.

Hawthorn clearly rate those two traits, as forward pressure and limiting defensive rebound has always been a cornerstone. There is clearly a greater focus on the marking aspect of it now, because other teams have caught up on the ground ball stuff and we don't have a clear advantage with ground ball considering we lost Cyril who was amongst the best the AFL has ever seen in that area.

 

[Brant]

Nope - Kosi will be playing at CHB and another guy whose name I can’t quite recall will play at FB

(Better Brant ?)

Sure man, sounds good

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Nope - Kosi will be playing at CHB and another guy whose name I can’t quite recall will play at FB

(Better Brant ?)

Maybe longer term, but right now there's no way Kosi is playing CHB. That's probably part of the reason why Hartley was brought in, because we need KPD. Frost and Frawley are more FB's.

 

[threesixpio]

Maybe longer term, but right now there's no way Kosi is playing CHB. That's probably part of the reason why Hartley was brought in, because we need KPD. Frost and Frawley are more FB's.

I agree Kosi won’t be playing at CHB Kosi will be playing at full back instead

(I think my dad joke existence is making me socially isolated)

 

[Aramis]

I mean there are a few obvious ways to beat Richmond's game style that are easier said than done. You want to limit ground ball by marking it, but you don't want players who are hopelessly outmatched if they can't mark it. Traditionally our forwards, tall or short, are elite in ground ball work for their position.

Hawthorn clearly rate those two traits, as forward pressure and limiting defensive rebound has always been a cornerstone. There is clearly a greater focus on the marking aspect of it now, because other teams have caught up on the ground ball stuff and we don't have a clear advantage with ground ball considering we lost Cyril who was amongst the best the AFL has ever seen in that area.

I dont think we are looking to "beat Richmonds game plan".. I think we are looking a little past their current dominance while seeking to set ourselves as the game plan to beat.

Quite frankly, if you try and beat Richmond using an appropriation of Richmonds gameplan, they will beat you 9 times out of 10... they are simply just that much better at it... Thats why I laugh when I see teams trying to copy the flavour of the month, your perennial pretender-types.

 

[cryptor]

It's amazing people think missing on Cogs is a failure given the circumstances.

In the context of getting him across it certainly wasn't a success. The scales were stacked against us but there remained a chance of him turning his back on the AFL money. The fact he didn't and we missed out is a failure. The fact that those circumstances exist simply means there's no shame in that failure.

 

[mustang]

I dont think we are looking to "beat Richmonds game plan".. I think we are looking a little past their current dominance while seeking to set ourselves as the game plan to beat.

Quite frankly, if you try and beat Richmond using an appropriation of Richmonds gameplan, they will beat you 9 times out of 10... they are simply just that much better at it... Thats why I laugh when I see teams trying to copy the flavour of the month, your perennial pretender-types.

That’s how we starting winning in 2012-2015 we had a game plan that could beat Collingwood then because all the other teams were playing the same way as them we started beating all them and they didn’t have the personal to beat us as they had been recruiting to play the same way as Collingwood. As now all the teams are doing the same with Richmond.

 

[Gralin]

In the context of getting him across it certainly wasn't a success. The scales were stacked against us but there remained a chance of him turning his back on the AFL money. The fact he didn't and we missed out is a failure. The fact that those circumstances exist simply means there's no shame in that failure.

I don't rate our period on could haves though.

The failure to land Cogs is like the failure to keep Buddy. Someone else was willing to pay a bigger price than we were.

Like missing out on a house that someone else is willing to pay more for. You've got to have your limits.

Hard to beat the bloke who is bidding with someone else's chequebook and trying could bankrupt you.

 

[Easy Slips Catch]

That’s how we starting winning in 2012-2015 we had a game plan that could beat Collingwood .....

We started to get a hold on the Pies in 2011. Remember how filthy Clarko was when they beat us in the Prelim. We (Clarko) still have the wood over the Pies. Tigs have troubled us for a while cos we can't slow em down. As we did against the pies and Freo we gotta find a way to outscore them.

We drafted four kids all of whom have an offensive background. Hopefully, we'll start winning games rather than choking the opposition.

 

[Simon Crawshay]

We started to get a hold on the Pies in 2011. Remember how filthy Clarko was when they beat us in the Prelim. We (Clarko) still have the wood over the Pies. Tigs have troubled us for a while cos we can't slow em down. As we did against the pies and Freo we gotta find a way to outscore them.

We drafted four kids all of whom have an offensive background. Hopefully, we'll start winning games rather than choking the opposition.

I agree, we wont win a flag trying to choke teams and winning games by under 11 goals a game.
Look at the recent flag winners, all of them have been potent offensive teams who can routinely rack up scores over 100 (bit like Golden State Warriors in the NBA).
If we can move the ball quicker into our forward line I like our chances of becoming an offensive force again.

 

[Brant]

In the context of getting him across it certainly wasn't a success. The scales were stacked against us but there remained a chance of him turning his back on the AFL money. The fact he didn't and we missed out is a failure. The fact that those circumstances exist simply means there's no shame in that failure.

Not quite.

He was a RESTRICTED FA - all they had to do was match.

Wanna guess how they were gonna pay for it?

 

[Brant]

If we can move the ball quicker into our forward line I like our chances of becoming an offensive force again.

I don't mean to brag, but I just heard Admiral Motti concede that our forwardline is now the ultimate power in the universe.

Later, some dude in a bath robe choked him...

 

[KermitJagger]

That’s how we starting winning in 2012-2015 we had a game plan that could beat Collingwood then because all the other teams were playing the same way as them we started beating all them and they didn’t have the personal to beat us as they had been recruiting to play the same way as Collingwood. As now all the teams are doing the same with Richmond.

That's pretty much how it worked, but it wasn't to beat Collingwood specifically. It was a game plan to move the ball through the defensive zones and press that Malthouse and Lyon were pioneering at the time. Then our style became the emulated, and some teams copied it and others set out to defeat it. Ultimately I think our style was not a thing that could be overcome by anything other than the time it took for us to regress through age.

It was a true synthesis which combined the clean and attacking ball movement of Geelong with the stifling pressure of St Kilda and Collingwood by focusing the pressure in the right part of the ground. The forward press had a flow on effect for us as Geelong didn't have the forward pressure to contain teams that rebounded as efficiently as they did, where we needed to due to Sydney's slingshot style of play.

 

[cryptor]

Not quite.

He was a RESTRICTED FA - all they had to do was match.

Wanna guess how they were gonna pay for it?

True. But I don't think they would have matched if he made his intention to leave public. Far too messy to make the guy who actually made the move to leave stay with you on more money than pretty much everyone else on the list.

 

[Brant]

True. But I don't think they would have matched if he made his intention to leave public. Far too messy to make the guy who actually made the move to leave stay with you on more money than pretty much everyone else on the list.

Yeh, I don't think that playing it out in public is his thing.

 

[cryptor]

Yeh, I don't think that playing it out in public is his thing.

He should have re-signed 12 months earlier than he did if he didn't want his future contract to be played out in public. Anyway, it's done now. We move on and I think we've done quite well despite not getting him - and that's what matters most.

 

[Brant]

He should have re-signed 12 months earlier than he did if he didn't want his future contract to be played out in public. Anyway, it's done now. We move on and I think we've done quite well despite not getting him - and that's what matters most.

I don't think he could've conceived the Gillion$ & that GilWS would be cap-less 12 months short earlier.

The fact that he didn't sign earlier suggests that he wanted to test (maybe exercise) his RFA option, but that was taken away from him by the endless bag of money that allowed GilWS to sign Toby Greene to a 6yr deal, Kelly to a 2+8 yr deal, Cogs to a 7yr deal + Whitfield to a 7yr deal, all within the same 12 month period & all at or above $1m; with Cameron yet to come.

 

[Turly]

I don't think he could've conceived the Gillion$ & that GilWS would be cap-less 12 months short earlier.

The fact that he didn't sign earlier suggests that he wanted to test (maybe exercise) his RFA option, but that was taken away from him by the endless bag of money that allowed GilWS to sign Toby Greene to a 6yr deal, Kelly to a 2+8 yr deal, Cogs to a 7yr deal + Whitfield to a 7yr deal, all within the same 12 month period & all at or above $1m; with Cameron yet to come.

Bang on.

Say what you want but the AFL(Gillionaire) had a massive part in this.