Mega Thread Trade and List Management discussion

Status
Not open for further replies.

dergert

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Jun 17, 2014
Posts
5,816
Likes
5,760
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I think it's the classic "bulldogs need a tall let's link them to one available." I would be very surprised if we were interested in tarrant.
In my honest opinion, we need to keep Roberts. In my view he will be a vital cog in our backline for our flag tilt. I neatly rate him as much as talia, early days still.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Dogsman16

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Oct 19, 2012
Posts
8,162
Likes
7,460
Location
Minas Morgul
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
He's an utterly hopeless forward so I'm assuming that, if we were interested, it would be to play back.

It's becoming clearer to me that a key defender is our #1 priority and we're formulating a number of 'backup' plans. We've heard tidbits about us approaching May, Carlisle, Henderson, Tarrant (maybe), Schade...we definitely do seem intent on bringing one over this year. I agree with it, but know a lot don't.
Carlisle, May and Rance are the only ones who really take my interest and the ones who I would use a first rounder on (Carlisle suspension withdrawn).

Henderson is a B grade utility player and hasn't shown the AA form that all three of the others have in patches.

The others really are just depth and I'd prefer to just use Roberts, Talia, Hamling/Z.Cordy as the defensive unit and look to trade our first rounder for an outside reciever.

I like the Roberts, Talia, May tall trio combination just as much as Carlisle, Talia/Roberts, Hamling/Z.Cordy.

Roberts/Talia/May is ideal.
 

Mutt

Moderator
Joined
Aug 16, 2008
Posts
7,715
Likes
14,232
Location
Mildura
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Footscray; Lakers
Moderator #40,353
Carlisle, May and Rance are the only ones who really take my interest and the ones who I would use a first rounder on (Carlisle suspension withdrawn).

Henderson is a B grade utility player and hasn't shown the AA form that all three of the others have in patches.

The others really are just depth and I'd prefer to just use Roberts, Talia, Hamling/Z.Cordy as the defensive unit and look to trade our first rounder for an outside reciever.

I like the Roberts, Talia, May tall trio combination just as much as Carlisle, Talia/Roberts, Hamling/Z.Cordy.

Roberts/Talia/May is ideal.
I'm pretty sure from all I've heard that May has been close to (if not) our first recruiting choice for a couple of years... but looks the least likely.
 
Joined
Aug 24, 2012
Posts
33,816
Likes
43,533
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
T'Wolves, Renault F1, Footscray
Moderator #40,354
Get the feeling that if we are looking for a KPD one could be forced out. Both IMO are good enough in our best 22. Carlisle or the like forces one out. Going to be tough to convince both to stay.
I was thinking about this the other day. Hypothetically if Carlisle wants in and Talia wants out (and both Roberts and Hamling continue to build in form) it could end up looking fairly good for us. Carlisle for a first; package Talia and a second for a mid first rounder. Ergo we've upgraded a key defender for a slight drop in our first rounder, and a second rounder. Still have Cordy developing (and as depth), Roughead with the capability to move back into defence if needed, Wood with the ability to play tall, R. Smith developing into a utility defender that can play tall or small, and potentially Morris if he doesn't retire.

All of that said, keeping Talia is still my #1 priority. Just suggesting that, as things look right now, and assuming the Carlisle talk isn't all smoke and mirrors, we could potentially cover the loss of Talia if he does end up wanting to leave. There's a chance we come out of it having immediately improved our defence without sacrificing a first rounder.
 

Dogsman16

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Oct 19, 2012
Posts
8,162
Likes
7,460
Location
Minas Morgul
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I was thinking about this the other day. Hypothetically if Carlisle wants in and Talia wants out (and both Roberts and Hamling continue to build in form) it could end up looking fairly good for us. Carlisle for a first; package Talia and a second for a mid first rounder. Ergo we've upgraded a key defender for a slight drop in our first rounder, and a second rounder. Still have Cordy developing (and as depth), Roughead with the capability to move back into defence if needed, Wood with the ability to play tall, R. Smith developing into a utility defender that can play tall or small, and potentially Morris if he doesn't retire.

All of that said, keeping Talia is still my #1 priority. Just suggesting that, as things look right now, and assuming the Carlisle talk isn't all smoke and mirrors, we could potentially cover the loss of Talia if he does end up wanting to leave. There's a chance we come out of it having immediately improved our defence without sacrificing a first rounder.
Yeah thought long and hard about this too. Both sid and Tals are out of contract this season. Certainly not out of the question that one leaves if Carlisle/Rance/May/Henderson etc joined us.

Its a question of combinations also. With Carlisle one of Talia or Roberts wouldn't be best 22. I like having Moz/Hamling/Z.Cordy as that 3rd tall who covers the midsized player. But if we got May our flexibility increases IMO with Roberts/Talia/May as the defensive trio. Negatives include Moz is forced out of best 22/not given a 2016 contract but Roberts and Talia would be both kept.

Carlisle + Talia/Roberts + Moz

or

Roberts + Talia + May
 
Joined
Aug 24, 2012
Posts
33,816
Likes
43,533
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
T'Wolves, Renault F1, Footscray
Moderator #40,356
Yeah thought long and hard about this too. Both sid and Tals are out of contract this season. Certainly not out of the question that one leaves if Carlisle/Rance/May/Henderson etc joined us.

Its a question of combinations also. With Carlisle one of Talia or Roberts wouldn't be best 22. I like having Moz/Hamling/Z.Cordy as that 3rd tall who covers the midsized player. But if we got May our flexibility increases IMO with Roberts/Talia/May as the defensive trio. Negatives include Moz is forced out of best 22/not given a 2016 contract but Roberts and Talia would be both kept.

Carlisle + Talia/Roberts + Moz

or

Roberts + Talia + May
I think May is a pipe dream unfortunately.

So it's essentially Carlisle + Roberts/Talia + Talia/Hamling/Wood/Morris/Cordy/Roughead vs. Roberts + Talia + Hamling/Wood/Morris/Cordy/Roughead. I know which I'd choose - even if the first scenario does involve Talia walking out.
 

Dogsman16

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Oct 19, 2012
Posts
8,162
Likes
7,460
Location
Minas Morgul
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I think May is a pipe dream unfortunately.

So it's essentially Carlisle + Roberts/Talia + Talia/Hamling/Wood/Morris/Cordy/Roughead vs. Roberts + Talia + Hamling/Wood/Morris/Cordy/Roughead. I know which I'd choose - even if the first scenario does involve Talia walking out.
Yep agree. Although if we are ever to get May it would be end of this offseason. Carlisle more realistic though.
 

Dog 36

Club Legend
Joined
Oct 4, 2004
Posts
2,165
Likes
1,808
Location
Essendon
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
MAN U
Interesting times with players out of contract year end and many of them seeming to be considered in our top 22 this year, after been in the wilderness last couple of years.

I am keen to keep Talia, FR and Grant.

I think Grant is so important to the side because of some unique attributes he brings to the team.
 

stefoid

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Mar 8, 2002
Posts
15,323
Likes
4,960
Location
home
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I think it's the classic "bulldogs need a tall let's link them to one available." I would be very surprised if we were interested in tarrant.
In my honest opinion, we need to keep Roberts. In my view he will be a vital cog in our backline for our flag tilt. I neatly rate him as much as talia, early days still.
Any reason why Roberts couldnt play forward?
 

VitalDread

The Unofficial Face of Bigfooty Bulldogs-NGA & VFL
Joined
Oct 9, 2011
Posts
18,892
Likes
22,996
Location
Cranbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Chicago Bulls
Any reason why Roberts couldnt play forward?
He can play forward and was a gun forward during his tac career and development career while we were allinged to Williamstown
Prefer him as a back man since he reads the play so well and can out mark most forwards but still crafty enough to play forward
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

SeaWind

Team Captain
Suspended
Joined
May 5, 2015
Posts
533
Likes
412
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Ever since we hired McCartney, we've had a no bad eggs policy, and I highly doubt that's about to change under Beveridge. It's already backfired twice in the last 5 years for us with Sherman and Veszpremi.

With this in mind, I doubt the recruiting staff are even thinking about recruiting guys like Yarran and Dixon.
 

doggies ftw

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Sep 22, 2008
Posts
15,199
Likes
11,576
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
People are going early on FR, Hamling, and Talia. Let's see how they go and if they can even hold their spot in the team.
No ones saying they're already guns but Fletch and Talia have shown as much as pretty well any defenders in the league their age. Let's not pay a big premium to push one of them out of the team. They both suit our style and compliment each other.
 

Dogsman16

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Oct 19, 2012
Posts
8,162
Likes
7,460
Location
Minas Morgul
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
No ones saying they're already guns but Fletch and Talia have shown as much as pretty well any defenders in the league their age. Let's not pay a big premium to push one of them out of the team. They both suit our style and compliment each other.
My earlier post (certainly not directed towards you) but others who thought I was for pushing one of Fletch or Talia out for trade, well its certainly not the case. 1 or 2 pages earlier I said if we lost one I wouldn't be pleased and losing both would be diabolical in my eyes. But both are out of contract this season and both are talented defenders that no doubt are being thrown offers their way.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...et-for-a-healthy-pay-day-20150427-1muabc.html

Like this article suggest Talia's currency is rising and no doubt the more Fletch plays in the ones the more his will rise too. We are at risk of losing one and I hope we can retain both, hence why I have suggested we should go all out for someone like Steven May (who we have gone after before), because he can play on the 195cm guys (Cameron, Hogan) and also the tall-medium guys (Stringer, Darling etc) and we could keep Roberts and Talia in the best 22.
 

stefoid

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Mar 8, 2002
Posts
15,323
Likes
4,960
Location
home
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
He can play forward and was a gun forward during his tac career and development career while we were allinged to Williamstown
Prefer him as a back man since he reads the play so well and can out mark most forwards but still crafty enough to play forward
Just thinking ahead if we are in the inconceivable position of having too many key backs, who do we move out of defence? Roughie and Roberts seem most likely to me
 

Dogsman16

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Oct 19, 2012
Posts
8,162
Likes
7,460
Location
Minas Morgul
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Just thinking ahead if we are in the inconceivable position of having too many key backs, who do we move out of defence? Roughie and Roberts seem most likely to me
Surely we persist with Roughy as a ruck forward. I agree though Roberts is one we could push forward. Although I like the Boyd, Stringer, Resting ruck combo, we shouldn't go any bigger IMO.
 

threenewpadlocks

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Sep 10, 2012
Posts
10,623
Likes
13,258
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Never been a fan of Roberts up forward, just seems meh to me. Really lacks the physical presence of a big forward and he's too slow with limited endurance to play as a leading forward. The only way I can see him making it is as a back.
I love how everybody's saying that Roberts could be a forward with no basis for it. Sure, he might have kicked a few in the TAC Cup Grand Final, but what I've seen is the few times that he's played forward at AFL level he's been very average. In defense he looks at home.
He's a defender and a defender only. Period.
 

doggies ftw

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Sep 22, 2008
Posts
15,199
Likes
11,576
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
My earlier post (certainly not directed towards you) but others who thought I was for pushing one of Fletch or Talia out for trade, well its certainly not the case. 1 or 2 pages earlier I said if we lost one I wouldn't be pleased and losing both would be diabolical in my eyes. But both are out of contract this season and both are talented defenders that no doubt are being thrown offers their way.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-ne...et-for-a-healthy-pay-day-20150427-1muabc.html

Like this article suggest Talia's currency is rising and no doubt the more Fletch plays in the ones the more his will rise too. We are at risk of losing one and I hope we can retain both, hence why I have suggested we should go all out for someone like Steven May (who we have gone after before), because he can play on the 195cm guys (Cameron, Hogan) and also the tall-medium guys (Stringer, Darling etc) and we could keep Roberts and Talia in the best 22.
Yeah that'd be a disaster, I'm pretty confident in keeping Fletch, not as much in Talia but still confident I guess. Agree someone like May would be perfect, someone who compliments those two not replaces them. In saying that I like both Hamling and Cordy in that role but if a ready made quality one came along you wouldn't pass them up, but I still wouldn't give up a huge amount because Moz can still hold down that spot until their ready, Hamling is like 22 or close to it if he's any good he will be ready soon. I guess I rate all those guys enough to not see it as a huge need like most around here, either way we will know a lot more by the end of the year, if 3 of those guys hold down the spots to a competent level for the rest of the year at this age, well we're looking good and can focus elsewhere IMO.

In saying that I always rated Fletch forward, not fussed that he doesn't really have a presence he doesn't need to, that's what Boyd and Stringer are for. As long as he can get a decently big tank then his speed doesn't worry me either, if he can then we have a CHF who reads the play well, can make repeat leads up the ground, is a fantastic contested mark and has great skills. That's what we're looking for IMO. Just depends on the tank though, I wouldn't know if he has that in him.

I know you don't want to add any more talls to forward line and I understand why but with a bit of restructuring that set up could be pretty effective.

Carlisle, Talia and Moz/Hamling/Cordy down back

Rough in the ruck

Boyd, Stringer, Fletch, Crameri up forward. Fletch and Boyd can share pinchhitting duty in the ruck, I'm quite happy using Boyd in the ruck as it allows us to restructure our forward line leaving us more unpredictable and isolating Stringer deep where he is a defenders nightmare. This would probably also require Stringer and Crameri to do more work up the ground but I'm okay with that.

So really with that set up I dont think we're top heavy at all considering how mobile a lot of those talls are, and the flexibility is ridiculous. Also long term I think that leaves us with an A grade defender in Carlisle, B grade (possibly higher) in Talia, 2 A grade forwards in Boyd and Stringer and a B grade in Fletch and a B grade athletic ruck in Rough (honestly believe he could be an A grade too tbh, impressed me so much lately)

Now that's one hell of a spine, to think our smalls is where we really shine...
 

Pannalstaroz

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
May 4, 2014
Posts
8,129
Likes
17,240
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I'd be keen. He'll never be a number 1 but a more than handy number 2 and exactly what we need for Boyd. North won't trade though with Petrie and Waite a year or 2 away from retirement. He's a nice age for a KPP too which is something we don't have any of on our list at all - like, not even 1. (Although I'm aware his best footy, at least this year, has been as a defender)
Less than zero. He's a spud. If we don't have players better than him, I'll go he.
 

Pannalstaroz

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
May 4, 2014
Posts
8,129
Likes
17,240
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Anyone keen on Steven Motlop?? Cats fans seem pretty keen to see the back of him.

Thought he'd be worth a first rounder, but most seem to think he's worth second rounder + fringe player.

I'd do our second pick and Hunter for him.
He's enigmatic. He can look like a star, but look poor as well. BUT in our team he'd look amazing. Just depends where you'd want him to play.
 

Dogsman16

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Oct 19, 2012
Posts
8,162
Likes
7,460
Location
Minas Morgul
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Jake with our first, Motlop for Hunter and our second.. I don't think Dalrymple is gonna be happy come draft night, lol.
Daly has done it all for our club but if I had one final task for him to complete our list it would be to find a tall late in the draft who turns into a best 22 player (like Ben brown for instance, he did have that chance though) and a best 22 wingman (like a Brad Hill) with a later pick.

If we are serious we shouldn't have early picks in this years draft (Unless we can find a gun F/A)
 

TBOW

Club Legend
Joined
Aug 9, 2012
Posts
2,305
Likes
2,271
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom