Strategy Trade and List management Thread Part 2 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

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Pugz89

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I’d be asking for Darcy back and bettering our draft position. A big solid ruckman wouldn’t be the end of the world.
You don't let a generational ruckman, picked at number 18 in the draft, walk out the door for a "big solid ruckman" and bettering our draft position. English should be on the untouchable list.
 

Virgin Dog

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You don't let a generational ruckman, picked at number 18 in the draft, walk out the door for a "big solid ruckman" and bettering our draft position. English should be on the untouchable list.
Unfortunately, there's no such thing as an "untouchable" player. If they want out, and their contract is coming to an end (for English, next year) then there's not much we can do. If a Fremantle trade was to happen, I'd hope we ask for an incredible amount in return (something like Darcy and a 1st) because English should be one of our most valuable players when you consider club needs
 

Pugz89

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Unfortunately, there's no such thing as an "untouchable" player. If they want out, and their contract is coming to an end (for English, next year) then there's not much we can do. If a Fremantle trade was to happen, I'd hope we ask for an incredible amount in return (something like Darcy and a 1st) because English should be one of our most valuable players when you consider club needs
There has been plenty of talk that English will re-sign a longer term deal later in the year. Seems happy, is playing regular senior football and homesickness doesn't seem an issue. Can't see any reason why the Dogs can't keep him tbh.
 

Mattdougie

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There has been plenty of talk that English will re-sign a longer term deal later in the year. Seems happy, is playing regular senior football and homesickness doesn't seem an issue. Can't see any reason why the Dogs can't keep him tbh.
Has there?

Along who because I have not heard anything either way
 

Bemoreboyddog

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You don't let a generational ruckman, picked at number 18 in the draft, walk out the door for a "big solid ruckman" and bettering our draft position. English should be on the untouchable list.
First up, where he was drafted means bugger all. Secondly, how confident are we as a club in him though? How much longer is he going to take until he hits generational ruckman status? For all of the **** Schache cops, he’s almost got more runs on the board than English does at the moment.

I’d like to keep him and have high hopes for him. But that’s all it is at the moment, hope. Had it for Boyd, have it for Schache.

All of this is moot if English decides he wants out. In saying that I’d ask about Alex Pearce as well but given his injury history I’m apprehensive about his services.
 

Mattdougie

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First up, where he was drafted means bugger all. Secondly, how confident are we as a club in him though? How much longer is he going to take until he hits generational ruckman status? For all of the **** Schache cops, he’s almost got more runs on the board than English does at the moment.

I’d like to keep him and have high hopes for him. But that’s all it is at the moment, hope. Had it for Boyd, have it for Schache.

All of this is moot if English decides he wants out. In saying that I’d ask about Alex Pearce as well but given his injury history I’m apprehensive about his services.

You just compared Schache and English?

That’s like comparing Bont to Liam Jones
 

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Bemoreboyddog

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You just compared Schache and English?

That’s like comparing Bont to Liam Jones
I did. Everyone talks about English being the great white hope. All the hype, all the build up but really, what have we seen so far? Honestly? Schache hasn’t set the world on fire but has had a couple good games along the journey. What has English accomplished? Hopefully, in a few years we can say a lot, and for us but right now he hasn’t delivered much at all.

Premierships aren’t won by how much potential you have. Actually need to deliver at some point and after going through what we did with Boyd (high expectations - low output) I’m starting to worry about English.
 

Mattdougie

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I did. Everyone talks about English being the great white hope. All the hype, all the build up but really, what have we seen so far? Honestly? Schache hasn’t set the world on fire but has had a couple good games along the journey. What has English accomplished? Hopefully, in a few years we can say a lot, and for us but right now he hasn’t delivered much at all.

Premierships aren’t won by how much potential you have. Actually need to deliver at some point and after going through what we did with Boyd (high expectations - low output) I’m starting to worry about English.
Schache is done he will not make it just doesn’t have the desire

English will be a very competent ruckman.
 

Dogsman16

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I did. Everyone talks about English being the great white hope. All the hype, all the build up but really, what have we seen so far? Honestly? Schache hasn’t set the world on fire but has had a couple good games along the journey. What has English accomplished? Hopefully, in a few years we can say a lot, and for us but right now he hasn’t delivered much at all.

Premierships aren’t won by how much potential you have. Actually need to deliver at some point and after going through what we did with Boyd (high expectations - low output) I’m starting to worry about English.
I’m not convinced he will be the main ruck. But I am convinced he would be a very capable KPF/2nd ruck. One that would be in the top 6 in the comp.

I don’t think he has the strength to absorb the impacts that the ruckman do. But player on smaller opponents where he has a distinct height advantage would allow him to do damage. His skills and athleticism speak for themselves.

Schache can’t play another position nor does he have a way to find the football. It’s lace out to him or he doesn’t impact. That just doesn’t stack up.
 

Bemoreboyddog

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Schache is done he will not make it just doesn’t have the desire

English will be a very competent ruckman.
You’re probably completely right. I hope you’re wrong and they both become great players for us.

If I’m completely honest, I thought Tom Boyd was a sure thing and his path has made me very skittish.
 

Bemoreboyddog

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Also it would be a disaster if we lost English right now. If we lose him now, I’m not sure what currency he has. Yes he was a high draft pick, but it was 3 years ago and hasn’t done much so far. One of those situations where you’d rather play it safe and find out after a few more years that he will or won’t make it than lose him on the cheap and watch him become a superstar elsewhere. At least if he becomes a superstar first and leaves, we’d be more adequately compensated.
 

Mattdougie

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You’re probably completely right. I hope you’re wrong and they both become great players for us.

If I’m completely honest, I thought Tom Boyd was a sure thing and his path has made me very skittish.
Boyd really never showed much at senior level except for a handful of games and obviously those two finals. Apart from his mental health issues he also looked like he lacked desire to my eye. I don’t see that in English just a ruckman with Jarryd Grants body that simply isn’t ready yet.

As you said let’s hope they both make it but I have a lot more faith in Tim than Josh
 

Dogsman16

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Also it would be a disaster if we lost English right now. If we lose him now, I’m not sure what currency he has. Yes he was a high draft pick, but it was 3 years ago and hasn’t done much so far. One of those situations where you’d rather play it safe and find out after a few more years that he will or won’t make it than lose him on the cheap and watch him become a superstar elsewhere. At least if he becomes a superstar first and leaves, we’d be more adequately compensated.
He’s contracted for next season. Not as if Fremantle would offer jack to get him.

Darcy + fre 1st is what it would have to be near.
 

JTCWBFC

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Purely my gut & no fact but with our poor performance, English getting **** all support in the Ruck this year, Freo on the rise & if a big offer comes I feel like he'd go.

Was always a risk drafting KPP from the other side of the country.

Hopefully if it happens we don't get fisted at the trade table (again).
 

Bemoreboyddog

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Boyd really never showed much at senior level except for a handful of games and obviously those two finals. Apart from his mental health issues he also looked like he lacked desire to my eye. I don’t see that in English just a ruckman with Jarryd Grants body that simply isn’t ready yet.

As you said let’s hope they both make it but I have a lot more faith in Tim than Josh
You’ve probably just brought up another sore point. Look at the ability that Jarryd Grant and Ayce Cordy had. Just struggled to produce an AFL body to use that talent. Don’t think Tim is as bad as either of those two but would have liked a bit more meat on his bones at this point in time.

The one thing I see common in Schache, Boyd and English is a lack of aggression. Doesn’t mean they can’t play but I certainly don’t mind players with a little of the third letter in them.
 

Mattdougie

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You’ve probably just brought up another sore point. Look at the ability that Jarryd Grant and Ayce Cordy had. Just struggled to produce an AFL body to use that talent. Don’t think Tim is as bad as either of those two but would have liked a bit more meat on his bones at this point in time.

The one thing I see common in Schache, Boyd and English is a lack of aggression. Doesn’t mean they can’t play but I certainly don’t mind players with a little of the third letter in them.

I see hesitation in English

I see “timidness” in Schache

One can be worked on, the other is ingrained
 

Bemoreboyddog

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He’s contracted for next season. Not as if Fremantle would offer jack to get him.

Darcy + fre 1st is what it would have to be near.
Maybe they wouldn’t, but what happens if he doesn’t make the progress we hope for between now and the end of next year? Might be Darcy and a first this year, I honestly don’t know what English is worth right now, I’m just spitballing. But if he becomes the ruckman we all hope he can and then asks to go home, he’s at least provided us some real quality games and a return on investment maybe somewhat similar to what’s Grundy would net the Pies this year should he leave. (Highly doubt Grundy leaves)
 

Dogsman16

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Maybe they wouldn’t, but what happens if he doesn’t make the progress we hope for between now and the end of next year? Might be Darcy and a first this year, I honestly don’t know what English is worth right now, I’m just spitballing. But if he becomes the ruckman we all hope he can and then asks to go home, he’s at least provided us some real quality games and a return on investment maybe somewhat similar to what’s Grundy would net the Pies this year should he leave. (Highly doubt Grundy leaves)
Worse case scenario is what you said. Doesn't progress in 2020 and seeks a trade as an uncontracted player.
 
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