Strategy Trade and List management Thread Part 4 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

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ScragCity

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 7, 2015
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Happened at the top end of the draft recently, North didn't strictly need a JHF or Phillips, nor did GWS need a Callaghan.

What are you actually claiming here? I said needs based drafting doesn't happen in the first round. You're saying that it happened recently, then provide two examples of it not happening.
 

weltschmerz

Norm Smith Medallist
May 23, 2019
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What are you actually claiming here? I said needs based drafting doesn't happen in the first round. You're saying that it happened recently, then provide two examples of it not happening.

I miscommunicated, was trying to add examples of clubs going best available at the top end when it was someone they didn’t need, but was pre-coffee.
 

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Virgin Dog

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Im not so sure. The KPD issue was pretty glaring need at the time.

I think the club would've had a pretty good idea that our defensive half was being shored up by a banged up Dale Morris who's career was coming to an end. They would've also been fully aware of the issues that ultimately saw the departure of Marcus Adams and Jordan Roughead at the end of Naughtons first season.

I doubt that they had a lot of faith in a defensive half that was going to be led by Dale Morris and backed up by Jackson Trengove, Fletcher Roberts and Lewis Young going forward.

It may not fit the recruiters narrative of best available, but in this case I think they definitely went with best fit.
I think it's difficult to know what approach we took with Naughton, as I feel it was a clear case of both best available and suiting our needs.
 

Virgin Dog

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Happened at the top end of the draft recently, North didn't strictly need a JHF or Phillips, nor did GWS need a Callaghan.
Even more telling than Phillips was the fact North took another midfielder (Powell) at Pick 13. They clearly went with best available at that second pick since they ended up with 2 midfielders when they didn't really "need" a young mid at either pick.
 

weltschmerz

Norm Smith Medallist
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Even more telling than Phillips was the fact North took another midfielder (Powell) at Pick 13. They clearly went with best available at that second pick since they ended up with 2 midfielders when they didn't really "need" a young mid at either pick.

GWS drafting three mids in the first round in 2018 and having two of them leave ASAP for more opportunity was quite fun.
 

Virgin Dog

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GWS drafting three mids in the first round in 2018 and having two of them leave ASAP for more opportunity was quite fun.
Yeah that was probably one step too far with the "best available" approach. Caldwell was a reasonable pick (it was probably between him and Butters), but it's surprising they took Hately ahead of Clark. O'Halloran was one where there weren't too many obvious good picks ahead of him there. If anything, they should probably have traded down or out. Unfortunate for them since it was such a midfield heavy draft, and they had waayyyy too many mids as it is
 

Mofra

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Thanks Mofra. Jordan hasn't been in any rep teams as far as I can tell. Do you know if he will be playing tac cup this year?
I want to get excited but it's pretty unusual for players to get drafted without playing the highest level state competitions.
I honestly don't know.
The lack of rep footy doesn't bother me - Ewan Macpherson captained u16s and went undrafted. Cal Ward came from the clouds to get drafted, and Clayton Oliver didn't even play champs mid-year in his draft year. For a while we drafted more on rate of improvement than we did on output.
 

Mofra

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Yeah that was probably one step too far with the "best available" approach. Caldwell was a reasonable pick (it was probably between him and Butters), but it's surprising they took Hately ahead of Clark. O'Halloran was one where there weren't too many obvious good picks ahead of him there. If anything, they should probably have traded down or out. Unfortunate for them since it was such a midfield heavy draft, and they had waayyyy too many mids as it is
O'Halloran was the best kick in his draft year which is a fairly good building block to build a utility footballer from.
Agree Hately was the real head scratcher
 

Northernsoul74

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I’ve been watching most of the trial games for a bit of SuperCoach research. Was pretty impressed with Meek yesterday as one of the up and coming rucks in the league. Hard to see him getting a full time ruck gig with Darcy there. Contracted until
2023 and his future could rest on Lobb’s future.
 

eastfreo75

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Feb 11, 2011
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I’ve been watching most of the trial games for a bit of SuperCoach research. Was pretty impressed with Meek yesterday as one of the up and coming rucks in the league. Hard to see him getting a full time ruck gig with Darcy there. Contracted until
2023 and his future could rest on Lobb’s future.
Most of us Docker fan see Meek going for more opportunities somewhere else.

We wouldn’t blame the guy for leaving.

Lobb asked for a trade in the trade period and wanted Fremantle to pay a percentage of his wage for a second round pick. Giants.

Lobb still contracted until 2023.

Can Meek and Darcy play in the same team?

Meek needs to improve his forward craft to make it work.

English, Jackson and McDonald are uncontracted for next season which makes it interesting.
 

Northernsoul74

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Most of us Docker fan see Meek going for more opportunities somewhere else.

We wouldn’t blame the guy for leaving.

Lobb asked for a trade in the trade period and wanted Fremantle to pay a percentage of his wage for a second round pick. Giants.

Lobb still contracted until 2023.

Can Meek and Darcy play in the same team?

Meek needs to improve his forward craft to make it work.

English, Jackson and McDonald are uncontracted for next season which makes it interesting.
Yeah he seems a ruck first, forward second. Could work nicely with English if he stays. We will be pretty desperate for a ruck. Some would say we already are.
 

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ossie_21

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NthBondiDoggies

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Key defence will become a bigger problem for us. Was really surprised we didn’t go hard for someone (that we know anyway).

Keith is in the top few in the competition and still has a year or two but given you need 3-4 years to develop someone.

The only replacement we have for him on the list is Schache - I am OK with this and would give him every opportunity to own this.

I hope we develop Darcy for this role - this will depend on whether we can re-sign English and he plays forward ruck. We need talent coming through much more in defence than attack. While I understand Hawthorns dynasty - which we seem most closely aligned in tactics did not have a lot of stars in defence but did have a star defence - I think this is more because you don’t have two star KPDs and two mobile talls like what has worked for Melbourne and Richmond.

Up forward we are set for talls. Bruce has 3 to 4 years left, Naughton is the game breaker at the start of his career. These two kicked 100 goals last year - this has to be the best duo on the league?

And then add JUH as the third tall with English rotating is the best tall combo in the comp for a good period. When Bruce is dropping away Bont will move there so we effectively are set for 10 years.

I am also a fan of Bedendo - something about him and the vision of pre-season loos like he has put on some size - at 193 with his speed and leap he could be anything. May also go back to HBF like Howe.

Recruiting will focus on a crumbing forward though I hope one of: West, Wallis, McNeil, García can grab this in their own way or classy small in the Breust mould (JJ holding this down for now I’m his own way and Anthony Scott recruited for this). So we can bring through top kids like Croft and give them time.

Back to defence - At 2nd Tall we have Gards and Cordy - who as much as I love them are statistically way down the bottom end of talent. This is a clear weakness. And I don’t think we have a decent plan to address this.

Teams playing even two good talls can stick it to us in this area

Kennedy, Darling and Allen (used to get us and have a few to replace Darling);

Brown, MacDonald, Weideman/Jackson

Charlie, Marshall, Georgiadas

Hawkins, Cameron, Rohan

Third tall was a problem last year - Wood was one of my favourite players but he knew he was getting beaten too often. The intercept defender is a gaping hole for us and we is so damaging-watching Ridley last week was a great example.

OBrien was a smart pick but he has had half a dozen good games as a defender. And is not young. This is a stop gap that could be brilliant - his game against us was outstanding. We do seem to have a plan for this - with four options in the future. Khamis, Cleary, Parker and Raak. None of these are KPF but we just need one to nail the intercept defender position.

If I could waive my magic wand - the other one - I would have another solid second KPF and a young big in development and less in a couple of the obvious areas we have excess.
 

Virgin Dog

Cancelled
Oct 29, 2017
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Key defence will become a bigger problem for us. Was really surprised we didn’t go hard for someone (that we know anyway).

Keith is in the top few in the competition and still has a year or two but given you need 3-4 years to develop someone.

The only replacement we have for him on the list is Schache - I am OK with this and would give him every opportunity to own this.

I hope we develop Darcy for this role - this will depend on whether we can re-sign English and he plays forward ruck. We need talent coming through much more in defence than attack. While I understand Hawthorns dynasty - which we seem most closely aligned in tactics did not have a lot of stars in defence but did have a star defence - I think this is more because you don’t have two star KPDs and two mobile talls like what has worked for Melbourne and Richmond.

Up forward we are set for talls. Bruce has 3 to 4 years left, Naughton is the game breaker at the start of his career. These two kicked 100 goals last year - this has to be the best duo on the league?

And then add JUH as the third tall with English rotating is the best tall combo in the comp for a good period. When Bruce is dropping away Bont will move there so we effectively are set for 10 years.

I am also a fan of Bedendo - something about him and the vision of pre-season loos like he has put on some size - at 193 with his speed and leap he could be anything. May also go back to HBF like Howe.

Recruiting will focus on a crumbing forward though I hope one of: West, Wallis, McNeil, García can grab this in their own way or classy small in the Breust mould (JJ holding this down for now I’m his own way and Anthony Scott recruited for this). So we can bring through top kids like Croft and give them time.

Back to defence - At 2nd Tall we have Gards and Cordy - who as much as I love them are statistically way down the bottom end of talent. This is a clear weakness. And I don’t think we have a decent plan to address this.

Teams playing even two good talls can stick it to us in this area

Kennedy, Darling and Allen (used to get us and have a few to replace Darling);

Brown, MacDonald, Weideman/Jackson

Charlie, Marshall, Georgiadas

Hawkins, Cameron, Rohan

Third tall was a problem last year - Wood was one of my favourite players but he knew he was getting beaten too often. The intercept defender is a gaping hole for us and we is so damaging-watching Ridley last week was a great example.

OBrien was a smart pick but he has had half a dozen good games as a defender. And is not young. This is a stop gap that could be brilliant - his game against us was outstanding. We do seem to have a plan for this - with four options in the future. Khamis, Cleary, Parker and Raak. None of these are KPF but we just need one to nail the intercept defender position.

If I could waive my magic wand - the other one - I would have another solid second KPF and a young big in development and less in a couple of the obvious areas we have excess.
Melbourne went balls deep recruiting May and Lever (May came at the expense of Ben King). Worked out pretty well for them in the end, no reason we can't recruit an injury prone player like Pearce and hope to turn them into a star the way the Demons did with Lever
 

Bulldogs85

Premiership Player
Sep 25, 2016
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Melbourne went balls deep recruiting May and Lever (May came at the expense of Ben King). Worked out pretty well for them in the end, no reason we can't recruit an injury prone player like Pearce and hope to turn them into a star the way the Demons did with Lever
Pearce is not leaving Western Australia loves it over their
 

footscray1973

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May 17, 2004
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IF we draft Croft junior, and IF all those young talls are good - Naughton already there, JUH, Darcy, Croft - one of them might have to go back. We know Naughton can play defence, Darcy has played there as a junior, not sure JUH can or will be tried in defence. I wonder how Croft senior would feel if his son is forced to play defence like his old man!
 

doggie dog

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Sep 21, 2016
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IF we draft Croft junior, and IF all those young talls are good - Naughton already there, JUH, Darcy, Croft - one of them might have to go back. We know Naughton can play defence, Darcy has played there as a junior, not sure JUH can or will be tried in defence. I wonder how Croft senior would feel if his son is forced to play defence like his old man!
If the doggies love him, gives him opportunities at multiple premmies and pay him handsomely i'd bee a happy father.
 

Libbaaaa

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Jun 1, 2021
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Lever was already a more established player than Pearce ever will be, didn’t he sign for something like $800k per year?
 

Mofra

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IF we draft Croft junior, and IF all those young talls are good - Naughton already there, JUH, Darcy, Croft - one of them might have to go back. We know Naughton can play defence, Darcy has played there as a junior, not sure JUH can or will be tried in defence. I wonder how Croft senior would feel if his son is forced to play defence like his old man!
I'm a big fan of Darcy going back to start his career. May end up as a forward who chops out in the ruck for 5 minutes a quarter as his career develops
 

dergert

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Jun 17, 2014
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Can we sink the last knife into Gold Coast and poach Ben King?
 
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