Strategy Trade and List management Thread Part 4 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

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We would have given up our pick for Bailey Smith so he did us a favour by selecting the hawks.
This statement keeps coming up. I'm not the authority on it but it has been repeatedly refuted on this board.
 

glenashley

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What an awful idea.
Look at the melts. Just a discussion but once more for the slow ones. Hypothetical anyway.

Lose Smith, pick 18.

Gain pick 1 (Horne) and effectively 23 (no bid on Darcy at 1).
You're all forgetting the gain in no bid on Darcy by us taking 1.

So all up gain Horne and Darcy. Lose pick 18 and Smith.

Bit of Sam power tactical work. Push our 1st to before a bid. Take a leaf out of demons and GWS books.


AwFUl iDEa.....
 
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doggy_dog

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Look at the melts. Just a discussion but once more for the slow ones. Hypothetical anyway.

Lose Smith, pick 18.

Gain pick 1 (Horne) and effectively 23 (no bid on Darcy at 1).
You're all forgetting the gain in no bid on Darcy by us taking 1.

So all up gain Horne and Darcy. Lose pick 18 and Smith.

Bit of Sam power tactical work. Push our 1st to before a bid. Take a leaf out of demons and GWS books.


AwFUl iDEa.....
Ok but we can just trade say our future second into this year to get points for Darcy. I really don’t think we need to do anything too crazy to get enough points to match.

The strategy of getting ahead of a bid is a good one, but not when you’re parting with someone like Baz to do it. If we could do our firsts this year and next, then it might work because it’s just picks for picks and the net result is still bringing in two highly rated youngsters, earlier than you otherwise would have thanks to the bidding system. That’s how GWS have done it in the past.

We would be insane to swap for Baz for unproven 18 year old, I don’t care how highly rated Horne is. Plenty of ‘sure things’ have turned out to be busts. We’d be trading a guy who is already an above average AFL player with genuine top 5 midfielder in the league potential for some magic beans. Not to mention even if Horne is a Smith level player we’d still be setting ourselves back 3 years on physical development alone.
 

flipper83

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I really don’t care if our ruck plays 70% TOG and can’t do anything other than ruck and sit on the bench. We can cover the rest. Imagine our midfield with a dominant ruck. We would genuinely never lose. If he could take a couple of marks around the ground well that’s a bonus but we need a first ruck whose a ruckman
Not sure that would work out as well as you imagine. We regularly get smashed in hitouts but win clearances. Teams can plan around and counter a dominant tap ruckman. Hitouts are meaningless and even hitouts to advantage aren't valuable if the player who received the tap is immediately tackled which is often the case.

Occasionally you'll see a beautiful tap to a midfielder running into space and it looks amazing but it usually only happens a couple of times a game. Carrying a player in your 22 for these couple of instances probably isn't worth it.

Even worse, if they are playing on a competent opponent, their opponent could murder us around the ground or push forward to kick goals.

I know people have different opinions on the value of rucks but I'd rather a good footballer who is a lousy ruck rather than a good ruck who is a lousy footballer
 

LittleG

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Look at the melts. Just a discussion but once more for the slow ones. Hypothetical anyway.

Lose Smith, pick 18.

Gain pick 1 (Horne) and effectively 23 (no bid on Darcy at 1).
You're all forgetting the gain in no bid on Darcy by us taking 1.

So all up gain Horne and Darcy. Lose pick 18 and Smith.

Bit of Sam power tactical work. Push our 1st to before a bid. Take a leaf out of demons and GWS books.


AwFUl iDEa.....

Ok, I see the logic.
It’s basically Smith for pick 1…. And we lose a pick that we could have turned into points but now don’t need to.

Let’s talk about Horne. His best assets are defensive work and work rate around stoppages. People talk about his high footy IQ and his overhead ability (which I think is good but not elite). His kicking is good but not elite.
Basically he is a balanced midfielder, probably the best defensive work at u18 I have seen. Is that worth swapping for Smith?
IF we got some late third round picks back & we bid on Daicos at Pick 1, then I would probably do it IF Smith wanted to go there. I like Smith BUT I now understand your logic.
 

glenashley

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Ok, I see the logic.
It’s basically Smith for pick 1…. And we lose a pick that we could have turned into points but now don’t need to.

Let’s talk about Horne. His best assets are defensive work and work rate around stoppages. People talk about his high footy IQ and his overhead ability (which I think is good but not elite). His kicking is good but not elite.
Basically he is a balanced midfielder, probably the best defensive work at u18 I have seen. Is that worth swapping for Smith?
IF we got some late third round picks back & we bid on Daicos at Pick 1, then I would probably do it IF Smith wanted to go there. I like Smith BUT I now understand your logic.
Good pickup.

But we wouldn't bid on Daicos at pick 1. Cause that would push the Darcy pick up the order. Let the Daicos bid fall to pick 2 then Darcy would have to fall to pick 3 or later. Later the better for points.

Anyway. My head hurts now.....
 

LittleG

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Good pickup.

But we wouldn't bid on Daicos at pick 1. Cause that would push the Darcy pick up the order. Let the Daicos bid fall to pick 2 then Darcy would have to fall to pick 3 or later. Later the better for points.

Anyway. My head hurts now.....

No.
IF we bid on Daicos, then take Horne at pick 2, then Darcy has to be pick 3 or later.
IF we don’t bid on Daicos, then Darcy could be bid on pick 2…. Which cost us a lot of points unnecessarily.
 

doggiesin08

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No.
IF we bid on Daicos, then take Horne at pick 2, then Darcy has to be pick 3 or later.
IF we don’t bid on Daicos, then Darcy could be bid on pick 2…. Which cost us a lot of points unnecessarily.
Also if Pies need to use multiple picks to match Daicos then it can push our later picks very slightly up the points order.

I assume if we had pick [41] which became pick [39] post Collingwood matching, then that pick would have the points associated with pick [39] when it came time for use points on a Darcy bid.
 

Golden_6

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This is going to sound ridiculous but Alex Rance? He might be getting the itch back again.

Potentially playing for Essendon in the VFL this weekend.
 

adogsfan5

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Does Daniel Talia still hate us?
 
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Does Daniel Talia still hate us?

Hard to work out if he does or doesn’t as he won’t take our calls but that maybe due to the fact he’s lost his phone.
 
Aug 24, 2012
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Are our key back stocks better NOW or in 2016?
Our best kpd now is better than our best kpd then (Keath vs 2016 version of Morris), but the depth in 2016 is far and away better than it is now (Morris, Roberts, Hamling, Cordy, Adams, Wood, Collins).
 
Jun 19, 2016
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I'm not convinced Rance would be the great saviour we're crying out for. He was obviously a star at his best, but he's now 31 years old, basically hasn't played in 3 years and has come off an ACL. I could see him struggling.
He also likes to play loose and really benefited from some others around him doing the dirty work. Very good at what he did though.
 
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Oct 19, 2012
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Patrick ambrose is one that I think would be an ideal low cost option for us. Free agent.

I'd much rather him than say Will Hayes on the list for 1-2 seasons.
 
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