Strategy Trade and List Management Thread Part 8 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[_Mike_]

Opposition supporters coming to troll , you have been warned

 

[Snarls Barkley]

No idea how you can say that given Weitering played 49 more AFL games at this stage of his career and was used forward a lot from memory. I get you are trying to be optimistic, but this doesn't make any sense to me.

Only had half a season forward in year two I think

Weitering definitely had a big jump in year four but I remember him being pretty good down back in his first three years. Did not look a natural when he played forward but always looked competent in his preferred position. Took 7 intercept marks as an 18yo in game 9

 

[lachy]

Always enjoy the angst with those posters for whom the club can do no right at this time if the year and are not serious.

Why, because trading is yet to even start and is 2 weeks away from finishing.

Last season we traded in the player without doubt in the top 3 trades in the year. We also drafted players in who have shown a hell of a lot already.

This year development is crucial with our younger group and we have strengthened our coaching group already with 1 more likely.

The post a d pre season has many different phases, this just being the first of them.

If we are using first round picks make sure it is for quality, better than we have by a margin or we don't improve. Be cognisant of changes for F&S and NGA coming up when looking at future firsts.

One player rarely moves the dial, collective improvement always has. We are close and were alot closer this year than last .

We need to improve our list via all mechanisms like we did last year and develop over pre season better than last year and we have a genuine chance

 

[lachy]

Regarding the 3 pronged attack, it’s totally normal to win it with two full time KPFs and a resting ruck.

Collingwood won it with Cox, Mihocek and Frampton (in for McStay). Geelong won it with Cameron and Hawkins, with Blicavs and Stanley floating forward. West Coast won it with Darling, Kennedy and Vardy.

There’s been discussion about Brisbane this year above but they also had Morris, Daniher and Hipwood the previous year.

I think as long as there is flexibility (ie Darcy goes into the ruck for a bit or Croft swings back if things are top heavy) it’s fine. With five on the bench you have options regardless.

What you don’t necessarily want across a whole game (and a whole season) is three 198cm plus players in the forward line.

I agree with the majority of this post the only part I disagree with is the 198cm part. Height is irrelevant as long as the player has the ability to pressure as good as any player. Darcy, Croft amd Naughts all pressure well and are strong with ground balls

 

[threenewpadlocks]

I cannot have watched the same Buss season as people posting in this thread (evidenced by the fact that Bevo subbed and dropped him several times in this year), the fact that he's hardly young or inexperienced as people are making him out to be.

I'm not saying I think he won't have a good AFL career. I just find the level of certainty strange. He's only played 7 very average games at AFL level. Generally how good a player will be in the future we judge by how well they've played in the AFL in the past.

 

[adogsfan5]

I cannot have watched the same Buss season as people posting in this thread (evidenced by the fact that Bevo subbed and dropped him several times in this year), the fact that he's hardly young or inexperienced as people are making him out to be.

I'm not saying I think he won't have a good AFL career. I just find the level of certainty strange. He's only played 7 very average games at AFL level. Generally how good a player will be in the future we judge by how well they've played in the AFL in the past.

Never done a pre season at the club for multiple reasons. Give it one more summer mate.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Never done a pre season at the club for multiple reasons. Give it one more summer mate.

Sure. I'm optimistic just like I'm optimistic that any young player breaks in and his injury history has had a factor.

But he's also played 49 VFL games and been fit when the season actually begins without any in-season injury whatsoever for three years, which for development purposes cancels out some of the lack of preseason (games at any level make you a better player).

Again, I still think on the balance of probabilities, he becomes a good positive value player in the future. But it's just that - on the balance of probabilities. I would give it a 55% or whatever chance, not the 95% certainty language that people are using.

 

[Munnez]

Why doesn’t Darcy get injured and miss the combine if we are guaranteed to pick him??

Why on earth would he advertise the goods to other teams!!??

Doesn't have to perform to max capacity

 

[Anja_Nees]

I agree with the majority of this post the only part I disagree with is the 198cm part. Height is irrelevant as long as the player has the ability to pressure as good as any player. Darcy, Croft amd Naughts all pressure well and are strong with ground balls

Naughton I think is legitimately almost as good as most small forwards for pressure. I was talking in the abstract about tall players.

With Darcy, while his pressure is outstanding for a 208cm player, he’s not going to be running down many rebounding defenders.

I think players like West (and even McNeil and VDM) would make opposition smalls more nervous about being caught than Darcy would.

That’s fine, but if you had three players with similar defensive capabilities in the same forward line your ability to lock the ball in would be reduced. The talls also start on the back foot if they’re competing for marks.

I think it’s a bit of an albatross for Adelaide. None of Thilthorpe, Fogarty or Walker are as good pressure wise as Naughton.

 

[Doggies7]

I cannot have watched the same Buss season as people posting in this thread (evidenced by the fact that Bevo subbed and dropped him several times in this year), the fact that he's hardly young or inexperienced as people are making him out to be.

I'm not saying I think he won't have a good AFL career. I just find the level of certainty strange. He's only played 7 very average games at AFL level. Generally how good a player will be in the future we judge by how well they've played in the AFL in the past.

Absolutely entitled to your opinion and if you didn't think he showed much this year in your eyes, definitely fair enough. But blatantly untrue to say hes hardly young or inexperienced. Hes a 21 year old KPD that hasn't had a full pre-season with the club, and had missed a ton of his first season with a shoulder reconstruction.

We have heard a million times from very smart football people that these young talls take at least 4-5 full years to really show what they have, let alone a 21 year old with fewer years development than that, and interrupted development also. There are other Sam Collins' and Liam Jones' who are struggling on other teams or playing a handful of games that will come from clouds over the next few years and we will say wow where was he hiding!

Now Buss may never develop into a great KPD or be a Sam Collins himself, but we just dont know yet because he hasn't had the time and crucial pre-seasons to develop. We have been spoiled by some talls recently coming along very quickly that we forget thats not the norm.

 

[BLACAE]

• Naughts is great in terms of pressure.
• Darcy is excellent for his size, but his Go-go Gadget arms smothering the ball is awesome.
• Croft, like Darcy is aggressive and genuinely quick with a good leap and good hands.
• West is a great pressure player who can tackle.
• Hopefully Flea comes back well, as he can apply pressure, plus he's good for a couple of goals.
• Dolan reckons he bases his game on pressure, so hopefully we see more of that next year.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

these young talls take at least 4-5 full years to really show what they have,

It doesn't meant though that there's zero valuable information about how good they're likely to be in the future on the basis of what they show in those 4-5 years, or that a standard aging curve applies 100% of the time. There's numerous of AFL key defenders that have looked even better than Busslingher has had over a first three years of his career, and yet, didn't even play another 10 or 20 AFL games beyond year 3.

That statement doesn't mean "the first 4-5 years has no relevance or information into how good they're likely to be in the future".

but we just dont know yet because he hasn't had the time and crucial pre-seasons to develop.

I would argue 49 games at VFL level and some pre-season is enough time to give us the information.. I've made this point before but surely the lack of pre-season is somewhat balanced out that in none of the three seasons has he had any injury for any extended period of time that would also setback his development? I could agree more with people's arguments if he'd only played 35 or 40 or whatever games at either VFL or AFL level over the three years. But he's played 55. That's significant enough time on the park.

Again, I'm not arguing against a belief or faith. Just the certainty. Saying he "will" be good or he "will" be a best 22 player or whatever last year just doesn't align with the 55 games I have watched him play at VFL and AFL levels.

 

[Mofra]

I like Buss as a prospect but I also think he's years away from being an automatic selection.
I'm not expecting a massive improvement next year. He's a KPD. With rare exceptions, they just take time.

 

[Mojorisin]

I like Buss as a prospect but I also think he's years away from being an automatic selection.
I'm not expecting a massive improvement next year. He's a KPD. With rare exceptions, they just take time.

 

[LondonBulldog]

The three talls isn’t our issue, especially considering there are only usually two on the field at any given time. The issue is the players at their feet. Smalls with genuine forward craft and defensive pressure are nearly as much a need as a key defender.

I’ll back you up Danny boy. When you have dominate forwards such as Darcy and Naughton you don’t need a 3rd, too many running in the same direction. Premierships aren’t won with dominant tall forwards, haven’t been for years. Two tall forwards works best in my opinion and we need more quality smalls.

 

[VitalDread]

After the Grand Final

We can all agree that Bevo will use Buss as a key forward

 

[JohnnySteel]

After the Grand Final

We can all agree that Bevo will use Buss as a key forward

In all seriousness, If anything it gives Bev more ammo to play him, loves a swingman.

 

[adogsfan5]

Have heard from a close source that we’ve reached out to Melicans manager. We also did a few years back which I posted about also. Not sure we’re gonna die wondering this off season.

 

[VitalDread]

Shocked we haven't expressed interest in Ryan Burton

3

Ryan Burton

Age

28

Ht

191cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.5

5star

K

12.1

4star

HB

6.3

4star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.1

4star

MG

277.3

4star

D

16.8

4star

K

12.3

5star

HB

4.5

3star

M

5.0

5star

T

1.0

2star

MG

277.3

4star

D

13.4

4star

K

9.0

4star

HB

4.4

4star

M

4.8

5star

T

2.2

4star

 

[Mojorisin]

Shocked we haven't expressed interest in Ryan Burton

His body has really let him down.

 

[Golden_6]

Have heard from a close source that we’ve reached out to Melicans manager. We also did a few years back which I posted about also. Not sure we’re gonna die wondering this off season.

Not the worst option. He's very much a Butts style player so we've clearly identified that we need a genuine full back type to allow JOD & Lobb to move down the chain into more suited roles.

He's also been a genuine AFL player for 2 years now and hasn't played VFL since 2023.

 

[Redders98]

Have heard from a close source that we’ve reached out to Melicans manager. We also did a few years back which I posted about also. Not sure we’re gonna die wondering this off season.

Big fan of him, very strong in the contest but his body has constantly let him down over the years, plus he’s still contracted for 2 more seasons.

 

[lachy]

I cannot have watched the same Buss season as people posting in this thread (evidenced by the fact that Bevo subbed and dropped him several times in this year), the fact that he's hardly young or inexperienced as people are making him out to be.

I'm not saying I think he won't have a good AFL career. I just find the level of certainty strange. He's only played 7 very average games at AFL level. Generally how good a player will be in the future we judge by how well they've played in the AFL in the past.

As has been pointed out to you on a number of occasions he was not subbed because he was the worst tall he was subbed for team balance. Otherwise how do you explain him getting as many or more votes than other KPD's in the 2 games he was subbed off

 

[Testekill]

Shocked we haven't expressed interest in Ryan Burton

Think the big problem is that his body has broken down.

 

[Foxman98]

Have heard from a close source that we’ve reached out to Melicans manager. We also did a few years back which I posted about also. Not sure we’re gonna die wondering this off season.

Why would the Swans trade him? McCartin is there only other genuine KPD outside of a 33 year old Hamling, Mac Andrews shit brother and some bloke by the name of Patrick Snell

 

[Anja_Nees]

Have heard from a close source that we’ve reached out to Melicans manager. We also did a few years back which I posted about also. Not sure we’re gonna die wondering this off season.