List Mgmt. Trade & F/A - 2018/2019 - Part 3

[The Plowking]

Speed is overrated and short lived.

Besides which you need to win the bluddy ball in the first place.

 

[Proud 2 Be Ur New Dad]

I'll have a meltdown if we lose Sier.
So creative. So much potential.

Reminds me of a young Swan

 

[ClaytonM]

Speed is overrated and short lived.

No way. Speed is such a great asset. It is just one of many important attributes, but good players with genuine speed are game changes.

 

[ClaytonM]

Besides which you need to win the bluddy ball in the first place.

Easier to win the ball if you get there first. Besides only half the game is about getting the ball. The other half is defending and pace is a great asset there as well.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Ability to run all day is far more important than what top speed you can reach, is what I meant

 

[Scodog10]

Sier is a gun, I reckon we will do what is needed to keep him. We are showing him some tough love this year to get the best out of him but I think everyone's knows he's a big part of our midfield future and if he had ticked all the right boxes over preseason and been healthy he would have been in our midfield this year despite all the big names in there. Sier has a big future ahead of him and I'll be severely disappointed if he goes...

I think you’ve thoroughly encapsulated my POV. The only point I’d disagree with is that Sier is a gun. He has the talent to be one, but it’s a while off.

Unfortunately we have to factor in that all clubs are aware of this and if they think their tough love can sought him out big offers will come. Unlike opposition supporters and media nuffies sniffing out a story my hope is they realise he isn’t the one to throw a big offer at yet because it won’t end well for any of the three parties, IMO.

1. I don’t think Sier is ready for a big deal and all that comes with it.

2. We lose a guy we rate highly (I assume judging by how Buckley bristles every time his name comes up).

3. His new club traded heavily for a guy that isn’t ready to be a big time player.

Despite my overwhelming positivity toward what he can become he’s little better off than Freeman ATM.

 

[Thefly38]

What would we need to give up for Langdon from freo

 

[Scodog10]

Ability to run all day is far more important than what top speed you can reach, is what I meant

Yeah just ask Mitch Grigg and Jye Bolton

To be clear for those playing at home this is 100% false.

 

[Proud 2 Be Ur New Dad]

Not really hot on Ed Langdon. We have a bloke in Shaz waiting in the wings along with a plethora of midfielders who can roll back if need be to play a similar role.

Having a great year but not sold, and at 23 he isn't exactly a young project player.

 

[sr36]

Yeah just ask Mitch Grigg and Jye Bolton

To be clear for those playing at home this is 100% false.

I'd say it depends on what AFL role your other attributes are suited to.

 

[jackcass]

Pendlebury Sidebottom Treloar Beams Phillips all average more clangers than Ed, Treloar has almost twice as many, that's just the modern game when you are getting so much of it. You're NQR tag just doesn't sit with a player that's quick, tough, yet to enter his prime and on the way to averaging 30+ a week.

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy...d2=9&type=A&pid1=3791&pid2=4080&fid1=S&fid2=S

5 clubs are reported to be clamouring for him and we'd be the pick if he wanted a flag, the other 4 (Melb Stk WB North) are not really in the gun like we are, so I'd be quietly confident based on that even without the brotherly love connection.
But in the end it doesn't really matter what you and I think, if we are chasing him the club disagrees with your point of view and obviously has a way of getting him if he chooses us. If we aren't chasing him then they don't agree with me or can't do a deal.
Did I mention he's quick?

LOL, comparing coal face centre square mids with a guy who plays the game like Tom Phillips. That's certainly relevant. He isn't half the player any of Pendles, Sidey, Treloar and Beams are and has nowhere near their level of impact. Feel free to check my posting history on Phillips. Ed Langdon as an outside mid who burns the footy >8 times a game, has 3 tackles for the year, and wins less contested footy than Tom Phillips this year off more possession. Definitely NQR.

Happy for him to go to go to any of those other clubs or stay at Freo.

 

[nahnah]

LOL, comparing coal face centre square mids with a guy who plays the game like Tom Phillips. That's certainly relevant. He isn't half the player any of Pendles, Sidey, Treloar and Beams are and has nowhere near their level of impact. Feel free to check my posting history on Phillips. Ed Langdon as an outside mid who burns the footy >8 times a game, has 3 tackles for the year, and wins less contested footy than Tom Phillips this year off more possession. Definitely NQR.

Happy for him to go to go to any of those other clubs or stay at Freo.

His contested numbers are around the same mark as Adams, Sidebottom and Beams

 

[sr36]

His contested numbers are around the same mark as Adams, Sidebottom and Beams

No idea about Langdon. I haven't tuned into any Freo games, because I still think of them as unwatchable, but contested possession stats aren't necessarily what we imagine. They include loose ball gets, so don't treat them as a definitive insight into where and how the bloke gets the ball or think that it should correlate closely with or explain disposal efficiency.

 

[nahnah]

No idea about Langdon. I haven't tuned into any Freo games, because I still think of them as unwatchable, but contested possession stats aren't necessarily what we imagine. They include loose ball gets, so don't treat them as a definitive insight into where and how the bloke gets the ball or think that it should correlate closely with or explain disposal efficiency.

Was simply replying to a post that had already brought them up, from what I have seen Ed doesn’t have a disposal issue, nothing close to Phillips/Adams at least

 

[Baltimore Jack]

We might get better trade value with Wills getting a senior game or two

 

[sr36]

Was simply replying to a post that had already brought them up, from what I have seen Ed doesn’t have a disposal issue, nothing close to Phillips/Adams at least

I suspect you're right. Because he is Tom's brother, I watched him a bit when he first came into the AFL and he looked a good prospect with a touch of awareness and neat disposal to me, but as I don't often tune into Freo games, I've got no idea what he's become.

I just don't think contested possession stats say much about where and how the bloke gets the ball or what you'd expect their disposal to be like. When a bloke is playing towards the inside of the contest, their contested possessions are more likely to be highly pressured and you'd expect them to be scrubbier than a bloke who keeps space from the contest and thus collects more loose ball gets where he has more time and space to use them.

 

[jackcass]

His contested numbers are around the same mark as Adams, Sidebottom and Beams

I restate from my post.... LOL, comparing coal face centre square mids with a guy who plays the game like Tom Phillips.

I compared him very specifically with Phillips because they both play the same way and they're both playing (predominantly) the same position and both very outside.

Of the players you've listed, Sidebottom is the only other player who has played as much wing and been more outside this year, but he goes at 80%DE compared to Langdon at 75%DE, Sidey lays more tackles, has more scoreboard impact both personally and in the build up, and has about 50% more PA's a game. All off less possessions. In short, Sidey is an absolute gun, a match turner, a match winner, Langdon isn't even in the same discussion. If Langdon gets to that level then I'd be very happy to throw big money and draft picks at him.

 

[jackcass]

Was simply replying to a post that had already brought them up, from what I have seen Ed doesn’t have a disposal issue, nothing close to Phillips/Adams at least

Exactly like Phillips from what I've seen.

 

[nahnah]

I restate from my post.... LOL, comparing coal face centre square mids with a guy who plays the game like Tom Phillips.

I compared him very specifically with Phillips because they both play the same way and they're both playing (predominantly) the same position and both very outside.

Of the players you've listed, Sidebottom is the only other player who has played as much wing and been more outside this year, but he goes at 80%DE compared to Langdon at 75%DE, Sidey lays more tackles, has more scoreboard impact both personally and in the build up, and has about 50% more PA's a game. All off less possessions. In short, Sidey is an absolute gun, a match turner, a match winner, Langdon isn't even in the same discussion. If Langdon gets to that level then I'd be very happy to throw big money and draft picks at him.

In terms of actual ball use I think he is better than Beams and Adams, don’t think he is a better player overall. He doesn’t spend time at centre bounces like Adams and Beams but he’s only averaging 1.5 less clearance than Beams and is averaging 1 more than Sidebottom so he gets the ball in tight during a match, I wouldn’t be painting him as a purely outside type much like I don’t think you’d paint Sidebottom as purely outside
I think him and Phillips are fairly similar level of player although very different players, if you that makes sense.

 

[jackcass]

In terms of actual ball use I think he is better than Beams and Adams, don’t think he is a better player overall. He doesn’t spend time at centre bounces like Adams and Beams but he’s only averaging 1.5 less clearance than Beams and is averaging 1 more than Sidebottom so he gets the ball in tight during a match, I wouldn’t be painting him as a purely outside type much like I don’t think you’d paint Sidebottom as purely outside
I think him and Phillips are fairly similar level of player although very different players, if you that makes sense.

He's a speedier version of Phillips, play the same style of game, outside and contact averse, played similar game numbers, same age, similar disposal issues, but Langdon has had an additional year in the AFL system. If he was already a Pies player I'd be saying exactly the same things I currently say about Phillips insomuch as he has elite traits but the positive-negative impact on games pendulum swings pretty wildly week to week and within games.

 

[Thatsmyname]

LOL, comparing coal face centre square mids with a guy who plays the game like Tom Phillips. That's certainly relevant. He isn't half the player any of Pendles, Sidey, Treloar and Beams are and has nowhere near their level of impact. Feel free to check my posting history on Phillips. Ed Langdon as an outside mid who burns the footy >8 times a game, has 3 tackles for the year, and wins less contested footy than Tom Phillips this year off more possession. Definitely NQR.

Happy for him to go to go to any of those other clubs or stay at Freo.

Your first stat was garbage, almost our entire midfield averages more clangers.
The club is reportedly chasing him so they don't share your view and your stats kinda backfired.

 

[jackcass]

Your first stat was garbage, almost our entire midfield averages more clangers.
The club is reportedly chasing him so they don't share your view and your stats kinda backfired.

Clangers are part and parcel of the game including such indiscretions as frees against. I certainly don't expect any player to not have them, but I do have higher expectations when discussing an outside player who plays such an uncontested bruise free brand of footy. Same as I express when discussing Phillips. And lets just ignore that 5.6 of that >8 footy burning activity is actually turnovers, not clangers, and Langdon and Phillips are clubhouse leaders for their respective clubs at that.

I'm still yet to see any official announcement from the club declaring their interest. I'm more than happy for you to base your entire argument on some bullshoit media speculation and rumours but to me it means 3/5's of FA. According to that sort of speculation we're generally chasing about 1/2 the league listed players so I guess it's going to get crowded at training in 2020 given it now forms the basis of fact.

 

[Thatsmyname]

Clangers are part and parcel of the game including such indiscretions as frees against. I certainly don't expect any player to not have them, but I do have higher expectations when discussing an outside player who plays such an uncontested bruise free brand of footy. Same as I express when discussing Phillips. And lets just ignore that 5.6 of that >8 footy burning activity is actually turnovers, not clangers, and Langdon and Phillips are clubhouse leaders for their respective clubs at that.

I'm still yet to see any official announcement from the club declaring their interest. I'm more than happy for you to base your entire argument on some bullshoit media speculation and rumours but to me it means 3/5's of FA. According to that sort of speculation we're generally chasing about 1/2 the league listed players so I guess it's going to get crowded at training in 2020 given it now forms the basis of fact.

You are throwing cliches like NQR 'bruise free' 'poor disposal' around and it's all pretty much like your clanger stat, garbage.

 

[jackcass]

You are throwing cliches like NQR 'bruise free' 'poor disposal' around and it's all prettty much like your clanger stat, garbage.

As is your committed belief that we're chasing him. I'll leave it there. You think he's a champion and A. interested in moving, B. we're interested, C. worth every cent the speculation suggests we'd offer, D. he select to come to us with so much other (apparent) attention, and E. that we'd find a way to secure a trade despite the fact we're compromised in terms of what we have to offer. Based on a rumour and your inflated assessment of his worth. Good on ya. Who am I to argue with such sound reasoning.

 

[Thatsmyname]

As is your committed belief that we're chasing him. I'll leave it there. You think he's a champion and A. interested in moving, B. we're interested, C. worth every cent the speculation suggests we'd offer, and D. that we'd find a way to secure a trade despite the fact we're compromised in terms of what we have to offer. Based on a rumour. Good on ya. Who am I to argue with such sound reasoning.

5 clubs are reportedly chasing him so the industry disagrees with you, and anyone that has seen him play knows the labels you are desperately throwing at him in the hope one sticks is complete garbage. He's a longshot at this stage so I have no idea why you'd have to invent stuff to make a point over a hypothetical.