Hot Topic Trade/Free Agency Talk 2021 edition

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footyfan1978

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Aug 27, 2014
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This is from last year around the Betts & Kennedy moves to rookie list.
Mentions rule change.

"Carlton’s list announcements come after the AFL confirmed clubs would be able to move two senior players to their rookie list effective immediately.

“It is also a terrific result that we have been able to re-contract Matthew now, without having to endure the wait until the rookie draft,” Lloyd said. “Matthew was keen to stay at the club and we wanted to keep him, so to have that finalised now is a great outcome for all parties.

“We would like to acknowledge the AFL for delivering a rule this off-season that removes that unnecessary anxiety that can exist in the lead up to a draft for uncontracted players.”

Edit AFL source

Yeah, that was just for 2020 because of list reductions from 38 to 36 for primary list.
That was not held over for 2021 though. An article in August of this year said that temporary condition was for last year.
I posted the bit below last week sometime but probably in another thread..
The bolded bit below covers LOB as would assume the reason they already saying he going on rookie list is some contract for 2022 at rookie list conditions been agreed

"But the rule that allowed clubs to move primary-listed players to the rookie list between the first and second list lodgment periods to open up senior spots will not be permitted this off-season.

In a memo to clubs, the AFL said that there is "no forecast changes to list sizes for 2022" and that the one-off rule was brought in last season due to the changes that came late in the piece with list sizes and structures.

They will, however, be able to shift players on the senior list to the rookie list in the time between the national and rookie drafts if the player is contracted for 2022.

Meanwhile, clubs have been told they will have to again select a minimum of three players at the NAB AFL Draft after last year only needing to take one because of list reductions. The three live picks can include promoted rookies (before or after the national draft), national draft picks and pre-season draft selections."

Full article can be found on the link:
 

Bletch

Senior List
Dec 8, 2020
243
590
AFL Club
Carlton
So they can be drafted in ND but not DFA?
Ok, will try and work through this...

Right now, we have 39 contracted players for 2022 on the Senior List (33) and Rookie List (6). We also have Owies on the Cat-B Rookie List contracted.

This list of 39 does not include LOB or Cotts. But we have committed to picking both of these players up at the Rookie Draft. This would take us to a total of 41 players, maximum is 42. We'll very likely use pick #25 at the National Draft to bring that total up to the maximum.

So, what is the status now of LOB & Cotts? Both show up on the AFL site as "Delisted". Others here have confirmed that is their status. I haven't seen anything official from Carlton on that, but have no reason to disbelieve it. I'm just not sure why.

Perhaps there is a rule that says we must have 3 spare slots across both the Primary and Rookie lists prior to the National Draft. As the maximum places for these lists combined is 42, that would mean we'd be limited at 39, hence why we'd have to Delist LOB & Cotts. So that would make sense. However, I can't find any such rule. The only rule I've seen is that for list lodgment on 31-Oct, the PRIMARY list must have 3 places available. As we've only got 33 on the Primary List at the moment (and max. is 38), I don't see why we couldn't keep LOB there till after the ND. But I guess there must be a reason, and it's likely to do with the combined list size.

So, assuming they are indeed delisted, what next?
1. DFA's can be picked up by other clubs during a Free Agency period. There are three of these, the first is from Nov 3 to Nov 9. So another club could pick up either player during that period.
2. National Draft. To be eligible for the ND, a player must not be bound to a club. As they're delisted, they could nominate for the draft and be picked up there. Doubt this will happen, given they have a commitment from Carlton.
3. Pre-Season Draft. Again, could nominate for the PSD, which occurs just prior to the Rookie Draft. Again unlikely this will happen.
4. Rookie Draft. Both will nominate for the Rookie Draft, and could be picked up by any club, however, most likely will end up back at Carlton.
5. If for some reason they are not picked up at the RD, could later be picked up via the Supplementary Selection Period (by March), or later in the Mid-Season draft. But this won't happen, Carlton won't reneg on their commitment.

So, most likely, both will end up back at Carlton for 2022. However, it's possible another club might pick them up during the Free Agency periods, or with an earlier Rookie pick. In this case, it would open up an extra slot (or two) on Carlton's list. I just don't think that will happen.

Happy to be corrected on any of this, just my reading of the AFL Rules. There is also a really useful thread on this topic here.
 

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Bletch

Senior List
Dec 8, 2020
243
590
AFL Club
Carlton
Ok, will try and work through this...

Right now, we have 39 contracted players for 2022 on the Senior List (33) and Rookie List (6). We also have Owies on the Cat-B Rookie List contracted.

This list of 39 does not include LOB or Cotts. But we have committed to picking both of these players up at the Rookie Draft. This would take us to a total of 41 players, maximum is 42. We'll very likely use pick #25 at the National Draft to bring that total up to the maximum.

So, what is the status now of LOB & Cotts? Both show up on the AFL site as "Delisted". Others here have confirmed that is their status. I haven't seen anything official from Carlton on that, but have no reason to disbelieve it. I'm just not sure why.

Perhaps there is a rule that says we must have 3 spare slots across both the Primary and Rookie lists prior to the National Draft. As the maximum places for these lists combined is 42, that would mean we'd be limited at 39, hence why we'd have to Delist LOB & Cotts. So that would make sense. However, I can't find any such rule. The only rule I've seen is that for list lodgment on 31-Oct, the PRIMARY list must have 3 places available. As we've only got 33 on the Primary List at the moment (and max. is 38), I don't see why we couldn't keep LOB there till after the ND. But I guess there must be a reason, and it's likely to do with the combined list size.

So, assuming they are indeed delisted, what next?
1. DFA's can be picked up by other clubs during a Free Agency period. There are three of these, the first is from Nov 3 to Nov 9. So another club could pick up either player during that period.
2. National Draft. To be eligible for the ND, a player must not be bound to a club. As they're delisted, they could nominate for the draft and be picked up there. Doubt this will happen, given they have a commitment from Carlton.
3. Pre-Season Draft. Again, could nominate for the PSD, which occurs just prior to the Rookie Draft. Again unlikely this will happen.
4. Rookie Draft. Both will nominate for the Rookie Draft, and could be picked up by any club, however, most likely will end up back at Carlton.
5. If for some reason they are not picked up at the RD, could later be picked up via the Supplementary Selection Period (by March), or later in the Mid-Season draft. But this won't happen, Carlton won't reneg on their commitment.

So, most likely, both will end up back at Carlton for 2022. However, it's possible another club might pick them up during the Free Agency periods, or with an earlier Rookie pick. In this case, it would open up an extra slot (or two) on Carlton's list. I just don't think that will happen.

Happy to be corrected on any of this, just my reading of the AFL Rules. There is also a really useful thread on this topic here.
Expected timeline of events from here:
Now:
Primary List (contracted) - 33 players
Cat-A Rookie List (contracted) - 6 players
Cat-B Rookie List (contracted) - 1 (Owies)

Free Agency Period 1 (3-9 Nov): No action.
Free Agency Period 2 (11-15 Nov): No action.

AFL National Draft (24-25 Nov):
Pick #25 - add 1 player
Pick #64 - upgrade Matt Kennedy to Primary List
Pick #82 - upgrade Josh Honey to Primary List

Status:
Primary List (contracted) - 36 players
Cat-A Rookie List (contracted) - 4 players
Cat-B Rookie List (contracted) - 1 (Owies)

Pre-Season Draft (26-Nov): No action.

Rookie Draft (26-Nov):
Pick#6 - Lochie O'Brien
Pick #25 - Matt Cottrell
Option - second Cat-B Rookie (e.g. Dom Akeui)

Status:
Primary List (contracted) - 36 players
Cat-A Rookie List (contracted) - 6 players
Cat-B Rookie List (contracted) - 1 or 2 (Owies + ?)

Supplementary Selection Period (closes mid-Mar):
If any player added to LTI, may replace with an SSP Rookie.

Mid-Season Draft (June/July):
If any player added to LTI, may replace with a MSD Rookie.

Same disclaimer as previous post:
Happy to be corrected on any of this, just my reading of the AFL Rules. There is also a really useful thread on this topic here.
 

Stamos

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 30, 2010
16,236
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AFL Club
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The only rule I've seen is that for list lodgment on 31-Oct, the PRIMARY list must have 3 places available. As we've only got 33 on the Primary List at the moment (and max. is 38), I don't see why we couldn't keep LOB there till after the ND. But I guess there must be a reason, and it's likely to do with the combined list size.
Without looking it up, there's no way they would make a rule enforcing 3 primary list vacancies, but allow more than the maximum rookie list spots so that there's less than 3 total vacancies.
 

TENACIOUS

Club Legend
Aug 16, 2008
1,300
5,671
AFL Club
Carlton
LOB would have to agree to go to a club as a DFA, which is entirely up to LOB..

Otherwise he can nominate for the rookie draft and hope he gets to our pick 6,
and that other clubs uphold the gentleman's agreement between the club..
But in reality he can be taken in rookie draft by Nth, Pies, Suns, Crows or Hawks, all before us...

If he has been told 100% one of those clubs are going to pick him up,
his better of going as a DFA at least he has some say on terms and he would be on a main list...
 

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