List Mgmt. Trade & Free Agency talk Pt 2

[_RT_]

1st and a 2nd at worst surely.

Unbelievably rude by freo otherwise

If the roles were reversed would you give up a first and second for Bolton

 

[Marcel Proust]

If the roles were reversed would you give up a first and second for Bolton

Too hard a hypothetical for a variety of factors

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Did I suggest we take the result away? What I'm suggesting is that with a number of proven vote getters missing or performing below normal levels that the result shouldn't be proof that the likes of Bolton are up there with the out and out champions of the game. If he was to leave for Fremantle the best we could expect is a first round pick

Or maybe the likes of Short/Bolton/Baker have improved their game.lol

 

[_RT_]

Too hard a hypothetical for a variety of factors

Not that hard to reverse the situation. If we were an up and coming side like Fremantle and were raiding a 2 time premiership side for a young potential gun would you give up your first and second round pick for them?

Or maybe the likes of Short/Bolton/Baker have improved their game.lol

Not saying they haven't improved, more that the B&F result is a little skewed when proven vote getters aren't there or aren't performing at the their usual level to take votes away. As I said earlier Ellis finished 2nd in the B&F in a year we played finals and beat a host of stars in the count, but nobody was going to give up a couple of first round picks for him based on a breakout year. Let Bolton and co finish top 5 in the B&F for multiple years and then we can label them as being out and out champions.

 

[Marcel Proust]

Bolton has showed higher ceiling than b Ellis ever displayed imho

So teams would potentially give more to acquire

Not that hard to reverse the situation. If we were an up and coming side like Fremantle and were raiding a 2 time premiership side for a young potential gun would you give up your first and second round pick for them?

Not saying they haven't improved, more that the B&F result is a little skewed when proven vote getters aren't there or aren't performing at the their usual level to take votes away. As I said earlier Ellis finished 2nd in the B&F in a year we played finals and beat a host of stars in the count, but nobody was going to give up a couple of first round picks for him based on a breakout year. Let Bolton and co finish top 5 in the B&F for multiple years and then we can label them as being out and out champions.

I was happy to give 2 first for trelol

So yeah

 

[Stan Judkins]

100% agree. Who’s to say Balta will be any good as a fwd. he has the all the attributes to an elite back and has proven he can play there. I’m glad we didn’t go with Chol who is a list clogger. Prefer to try Miller or CCJ in that fwd role and let Balta continue to shine down back and occasionally through the ruck. Same with Baker. He plays to his strengths down back no point moving him for the sake of it.

Yeah i'm in the keep him (Balta) in the backline movement
Astbury FB and Balta CHB, same with Baker he's a lock to be a great backline player
why shuffle the cards when we have a winning hand as it is

 

[_RT_]

Bolton has showed higher ceiling than b Ellis ever displayed imho

So teams would potentially give more to acquire



I was happy to give 2 first for trelol

So yeah

Ellis was a B&F runner up, AA40 member and multiple time 22U22 pick early in his career, unfortunately he never kicked on as was expected. Bolton has had 1 breakout season, lets not get carried away with hype versus performances.

 

[Marcel Proust]

Ellis was a B&F runner up, AA40 member and multiple time 22U22 pick early in his career, unfortunately he never kicked on as was expected. Bolton has had 1 breakout season, lets not get carried away with hype versus performances.

Imho bolton has displayed significantly better output and potential than young Brando

 

[Marcel Proust]

Yeah i'm in the keep him (Balta) in the backline movement
Astbury FB and Balta CHB, same with Baker he's a lock to be a great backline player
why shuffle the cards when we have a winning hand as it is

Cause the winning hand is getting older and won't be around forever

Especially the book ends

Furthermore it's hard to find elite key forwards and they are more valuable

 

[Phar Ace]

I was happy to give 2 first for trelol

So yeah

So you have just withdrawn your case then?

 

[box070]

I reckon Freo will throw the kitchen sink at Bolton this year.
With Carr as his manager, the Dockers will see him as gettable.
Worst case scenario, 2 first rounders for Shai.
Best case, he signs a 5 year deal with us for less than Fremantle offer.

If Carr is calling the shots he’ll stay. Carr is an astute operator who would be looking at his off field interest. He’ll be playing there are more opportunities to make more money away from the field in Melbourne rather then Perth.
Besides when a player plays in a flag or 2 it build a a massive affinity with the club and the group that makes it hard to leave.

 

[Marcel Proust]

So you have just withdrawn your case then?

Tbf Treloar at 22/23 was a different model to the current edition.

Good player and strong upside. Like bolton...

 

[Stan Judkins]

Cause the winning hand is getting older and won't be around forever

Especially the book ends

Furthermore it's hard to find elite key forwards and they are more valuable

Yeah agree the age thing, but were talking 2022/2023 timeline surely
Most of our recent success has been built on strong Backline players, Rance, Astbury, Grimes and now Balta
We got Lynch to build the next generation around him when JR retires
all i'm saying is we're better served with Balta at CHB
He kicks 60+ metres consistently from HB to HF, that's a weapon if i ever saw one
yes the only hole is a JR replacement ATM, but we have time to draft, trade or RFA/FA one
If we can stay in the hunt like Geelong for up to 10+ years i would be rapt, why do we necessarily have to bottom out?

 

[Marcel Proust]

Yeah agree the age thing, but were talking 2022/2023 timeline surely
Most of our recent success has been built on strong Backline players, Rance, Astbury, Grimes and now Balta
We got Lynch to build the next generation around him when JR retires
all i'm saying is we're better served with Balta at CHB
He kicks 60+ metres consistently from HB to HF, that's a weapon if i ever saw one
yes the only hole is a JR replacement ATM, but we have time to draft, trade or RFA/FA one
If we can stay in the hunt like Geelong for up to 10+ years i would be rapt, why do we necessarily have to bottom out?

I can see upside to the arguments for balta back. Fwd. Mid.

A chf that can kick that far could also be very handy

 

[Stan Judkins]

If Carr is calling the shots he’ll stay. Carr is an astute operator who would be looking at his off field interest. He’ll be playing there are more opportunities to make more money away from the field in Melbourne rather then Perth.
Besides when a player plays in a flag or 2 it build a a massive affinity with the club and the group that makes it hard to leave.

I'd say Carr is a shrewd operator
He told Dusty to stay with us when Dusty wanted to leave for big $$$$ (10 million over 7 years by Norf and Crows)
Carr said to Dusty he'd earn a hell of a lot more being at a successful club and getting endorsement/sponsorship coin, which he is
Bolton from all reports is tight with Rioli, Pickett, Edwards all the indigenous guys and has been quoted as saying he and his girlfriend are very happy in Victoria/Richmond, so would take some sort of turn around for that to change
Balta is tight with Maric, Soldo and now Colina so for all assumptions he's a lock to stay long term
All the players keep saying how they are brothers and the only players we have lost have been given away, not left for $$$$ (Even B.Ellis was told to look elsewhere as we couldn't guarantee a spot in the best 22)
I'd guess all the players know the deal, we can only pay so much to keep the list together and it's a once in a lifetime to be a part of such a strong dynasty

 

[Stan Judkins]

I can see upside to the arguments for balta back. Fwd. Mid.

A chf that can kick that far could also be very handy

Mason Cox?????
I'll see myself out

 

[4tune8]

I think that we've already had a glimpse of what the coaching staff want to do with Balta.

Will be utilised where he is needed depending on rotations. If Nank is on the bench then he will be used at centre bounces as a ruck but with the added advantage of being an extra mid/clearance player. Astbury helps with the defence stoppages with Balta rolling back for cover, Lynch to cover forward stoppages with Balta rolling forward as an extra mobile tall, effectively the 2nd tall. A similar plan is in effect when Nank is rucking/following on the ground to extend his effectiveness and of course when needed Nank can 'rest' as an intercepter in defence allowing Balta to be the Follower.

It's much more complicated than my simplified analysis but it is what we've already seen to a small degree.

 

[dusty1234!]

I know he has only had 1 reallly good season, but I would still be upset if we do a trade for him. 2 1st rounders is great but drafting can be hit and miss. here we have a brilliant player who is still very young and learning his craft. If he manages to build up his tank more than he could be in consideration for one of the best mids in the comp once the superstars of now fall away. Yes Freo will throw the kitchen sink at him, as they should, but I think we should be looking to keep him unless and absolutely ridiculous offer comes in.

 

[Marcel Proust]

I know he has only had 1 reallly good season, but I would still be upset if we do a trade for him. 2 1st rounders is great but drafting can be hit and miss. here we have a brilliant player who is still very young and learning his craft. If he manages to build up his tank more than he could be in consideration for one of the best mids in the comp once the superstars of now fall away. Yes Freo will throw the kitchen sink at him, as they should, but I think we should be looking to keep him unless and absolutely ridiculous offer comes in.

It's a great draft apparently.

Four first rounders and two 2nd sounds handy...

 

[4tune8]

It's a great draft apparently.

Four first rounders and two 2nd sounds handy...

and 2 x 3rd rounders

 

[Phar Ace]

I think that we've already had a glimpse of what the coaching staff want to do with Balta.

Will be utilised where he is needed depending on rotations. If Nank is on the bench then he will be used at centre bounces as a ruck but with the added advantage of being an extra mid/clearance player. Astbury helps with the defence stoppages with Balta rolling back for cover, Lynch to cover forward stoppages with Balta rolling forward as an extra mobile tall, effectively the 2nd tall. A similar plan is in effect when Nank is rucking/following on the ground to extend his effectiveness and of course when needed Nank can 'rest' as an intercepter in defence allowing Balta to be the Follower.

It's much more complicated than my simplified analysis but it is what we've already seen to a small degree.

Agree, Balta's little time on the ball when he went into the ruck was energising, not just for him but for the whole team. When he went back after that he played with more dash and a bit more dare like Rance did. I think that might be what they try a bit more of when required.

 

[Stan Judkins]

It's a great draft apparently.

Four first rounders and two 2nd sounds handy...

So was 2004, 4 x 1st rds (Deledio, Tambling, Myers, Pattison)

 

[Phar Ace]

So was 2004, 4 x 1st rds (Deledio, Tambling, Myers, Pattison)

And let's not forget Dean Polo the first pick in the 2nd round at Pick20. Oh hang on again, let's forget that after all.........

 

[4tune8]

Agree, Balta's little time on the ball when he went into the ruck was energising, not just for him but for the whole team. When he went back after that he played with more dash and a bit more dare like Rance did. I think that might be what they try a bit more of when required.

He did present well when moved forward too.

 

[Phar Ace]

He did present well when moved forward too.

When he's allow to run unrestricted, man does he cover some ground and have a HUGE side step.