List Mgmt. Trade & Free Agency talk Pt 5

[Livonski]

Ffs what is going on here?
Short, Jack Dyer medalist, being cast aside…and on par with Ellis? Wut?
Anyone see his metres gained in the 2020 flag? Like 800! Absolutely pivotal and covered for Bachar all that year. $800…of course not but a rebounder that covers serious ground is not that easy to replace

 

[boxxie2022]

Ffs what is going on here?
Short, Jack Dyer medalist, being cast aside…and on par with Ellis? Wut?
Anyone see his metres gained in the 2020 flag? Like 800! Absolutely pivotal and covered for Bachar all that year. $800…of course not but a rebounder that covers serious ground is not that easy to replace

It was mentioned that a major offer could/may come for him. If it’s major then we don’t match. I think he is very replaceable. Winning the b and f in a flag year adds value to his price tag but we won’t keep him at any cost

 

[Livonski]

It was mentioned that a major offer could/may come for him. If it’s major then we don’t match. I think he is very replaceable. Winning the b and f in a flag year adds value to his price tag but we won’t keep him at any cost

A big “if”.
Let’s deal with that if it happens. Until then he’s a champion of the club…this replaceable talk is a bit disrespectful. IMO.

 

[boxxie2022]

A big “if”.
Let’s deal with that if it happens. Until then he’s a champion of the club…this replaceable talk is a bit disrespectful. IMO.

It’s a trade thread and a hypothetical was put forward. Hardly disrespectful. More an observation.

 

[Livonski]

It’s a trade thread and a hypothetical was put forward. Hardly disrespectful. More an observation.

OK. Then let’s start at #1 Nick Vlaustin…he’ll get an offer, replaceable? Of course.
#2. Dylan Grimes …etc etc

 

[captain blood 17]

Im starting to feel that we will lose player to free agency this year and will be Jayden Short

He did take slight unders last contract but will be looking at big $$$ to be thrown at him at the end of the year
$800k x 4/5 years would not be out of the question from a club like Norf

Do we match ?
With the players we have drafted this year in Brown/Banks

There are alot of players getting paid what they are not worth

Williams , McGovern , Polec , Sheil etc etc

Free agency adds $150-$200k onto salaries when low clubs are involved

TPP has been reduced due to covid. i doubt those numbers will be thrown around for a flanker.

 

[GhostofJimJess]

Don't think Butler would have been on very much when he left. Ellis left for a deal we could not match, which was fair enough, but to describe that as easing pressure wouldn't be accurate. We would have been at or near the maximum at that stage.

I think what I'm worried about is that there are quite a few blokes that I would describe as essential out of contract at either the end of this season (as I put in my previous post) or the year after including Bolton, Balta, Nankervis, Graham and a number of the new draftees over the past few years. That is going to cause a bit of stress and I just don't see the Jack + Cotch = free agent math working without losing someone like Baker/Short/Bolton. Keeping those blokes and trying to build from the draft in my view is going to be more important than the sugar hit of getting someone like a Taranto on overs.

I think you're catastrophising.

We'll be fine.

Im starting to feel that we will lose player to free agency this year and will be Jayden Short

Nope. Required player. We'll keep him. No-one's offering him $800k/year after 2022. North would've 2-3 years ago, but they've suddenly got a few bigger issues inhouse to attend to.

I don't think you're allowed to alter the contract conditions of a free agent. But there are plenty of others we could have paid with Rance's money.

Absolutely you can. As long as the balance of the contract is honoured the distribution over the allotted years is not relevant. The AFL demand that the contract is honoured, but whether it's front- or back-loaded is something for the club and the player/agent to agree to.

I think what we overlook is that there are also a bunch of other players such as Grigg, Lloyd, Lennon, Hampson, Griffiths, Miles, Conca etc that we've also moved on over the last 3-4 years (each of which would've been on $300-500/year) that have opened up some coin for the current 1st XXII, as well as Ellis and Butler. I haven't even included Higgins, Towner and Markov because they'd have each been on sub $200k/year. Add to that now Astbury and Houli, without any big recruits bar Lynchy since 2016,I think our playing list is very sustainable.

 

[boxxie2022]

It’s a trade thread and a hypothetical was put forward. Hardly disrespectful. More an observation.

OK. Then let’s start at #1 Nick Vlaustin…he’ll get an offer, replaceable? Of course.
#2. Dylan Grimes …etc etc

Are they free agents? If so then absolutely let’s talk about them. Short isn’t untouchable especially if a large offer rolls in.

 

[Livonski]

Are they free agents? If so then absolutely let’s talk about them. Short isn’t untouchable especially if a large offer rolls in.

Point is, anyone on the list can be poached. Contracted or not.

 

[boxxie2022]

Point is, anyone on the list can be poached. Contracted or not.

That’s right. A poster brought up Short and the comments followed. No disrespect just hypothetical observations

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Point is, anyone on the list can be poached. Contracted or not.

As i've stated in the past.I wouldn't begrudge any of our premiership heroes leaving too set themselves up as they head towards retirement.Even Dusty(Not that he has any such issues).Has happened with Ellis & Butler.

 

[Frank Grimes]

Im starting to feel that we will lose player to free agency this year and will be Jayden Short

He did take slight unders last contract but will be looking at big $$$ to be thrown at him at the end of the year

If the club did ask him to take a pay cut promising that we would make it up to him in the next contract then the club needs to honour that.(within reason).

If the club doesn't then it would be harder to get players to help the club out in the future when asking them to take a pay cut.

However if it something ridiculous like 800k over 4/5 years as mentioned and another club is offering that to him, then I wish him all the best.

 

[Rich01]

Im starting to feel that we will lose player to free agency this year and will be Jayden Short

He did take slight unders last contract but will be looking at big $$$ to be thrown at him at the end of the year
$800k x 4/5 years would not be out of the question from a club like Norf

Do we match ?
With the players we have drafted this year in Brown/Banks as well as having Rioli moved back and Stack/Baker im thinking Shorty may take the deal and move but would also strengthen our draft hand again to bring in more young talent whilst giving more cap relief

Yeah you would let him go at that price.
But don’t even think North would give him stupid money.

 

[Simche]

I think you're catastrophising.

We'll be fine.


Nope. Required player. We'll keep him. No-one's offering him $800k/year after 2022. North would've 2-3 years ago, but they've suddenly got a few bigger issues inhouse to attend to.


Absolutely you can. As long as the balance of the contract is honoured the distribution over the allotted years is not relevant. The AFL demand that the contract is honoured, but whether it's front- or back-loaded is something for the club and the player/agent to agree to.

I think what we overlook is that there are also a bunch of other players such as Grigg, Lloyd, Lennon, Hampson, Griffiths, Miles, Conca etc that we've also moved on over the last 3-4 years (each of which would've been on $300-500/year) that have opened up some coin for the current 1st XXII, as well as Ellis and Butler. I haven't even included Higgins, Towner and Markov because they'd have each been on sub $200k/year. Add to that now Astbury and Houli, without any big recruits bar Lynchy since 2016,I think our playing list is very sustainable.

I try and temper my expectations and be realistic.

If I'm really honest I'm also not that thrilled with the idea of Taranto (particularly based on his output last year). Strikes me as a Zac Williams type acquisition where you're paying overs and hoping he gets back to great form. I also worry about blokes that have never been the first or second tagged and he falls into this category.

Similarly with Green, I know everyone loves to link him based on the links to the club, but I reckon he's happy up there and they'd rather move on someone like Coniglio to let him take over. Would take a kings ransom to get him out of there that may cost us two players in the draft that cumulatively would see the club better off.

There's a price to be paid with trying to short circuit the normal draft-develop-contend cycle that often leaves clubs worse off when they try and do so. Not even going to get into some of the posts I've seen re Ben King which are hugely fanciful!

 

[RJKTiger]

If Short was offered $800k then he would be a massive chance of being the next Polec. He can be an excellent player in a winning side, but last year showed he is fairly toothless in a team that is struggling to be a 50/50 side, or worse. He did not impact winning last year i thought. He is most valuable to a "contender" than a rebuilder, due to his style.No contender would pay him $800k , so he would want to be very careful to take an offer like that, i think it would end poorly for the 2nd half of his career

 

[Tiger1974]

Ffs what is going on here?
Short, Jack Dyer medalist, being cast aside…and on par with Ellis? Wut?
Anyone see his metres gained in the 2020 flag? Like 800! Absolutely pivotal and covered for Bachar all that year. $800…of course not but a rebounder that covers serious ground is not that easy to replace

Yep, laughable but not overly surprised. Given our most recent draft additions I think we now really value foot skills. Also, we can’t afford to lose a 26yr old player due to age gap in list profile.

 

[boxxie2022]

Yep, laughable but not overly surprised. Given our most recent draft additions I think we now really value foot skills. Also, we can’t afford to lose a 26yr old player due to age gap in list profile.

At what price? You don’t over pay to keep flankers.

 

[Sol23]

Rioli in and out of the side for the last few seasons and now people think he’s an integral part of the back 6……

 

[beema limapep]

Short was dissapointing last year. He needs to get his head in the game this year.

Elite long kick. Id be stunned if we let him go. Would be a big loss.

Trade Rioli and Castagna instead.

 

[tiger_tough]

With the emergence of Rioli and Mansell down back I really hope Short is tried on a wing. If only he was a touch taller.

 

[Bojangles17]

With the emergence of Rioli and Mansell down back I really hope Short is tried on a wing. If only he was a touch taller.

Would depend on a change in game plan as dimma uses the wingers as very much two way runners who pressure hard ,,,Pickett and Macca are both fit AF and go both ways. Shorty is very offensive and is a diff type to the profile used in 3 successful campaigns

 

[Bojangles17]

I think you're catastrophising.

We'll be fine.


Nope. Required player. We'll keep him. No-one's offering him $800k/year after 2022. North would've 2-3 years ago, but they've suddenly got a few bigger issues inhouse to attend to.


Absolutely you can. As long as the balance of the contract is honoured the distribution over the allotted years is not relevant. The AFL demand that the contract is honoured, but whether it's front- or back-loaded is something for the club and the player/agent to agree to.

I think what we overlook is that there are also a bunch of other players such as Grigg, Lloyd, Lennon, Hampson, Griffiths, Miles, Conca etc that we've also moved on over the last 3-4 years (each of which would've been on $300-500/year) that have opened up some coin for the current 1st XXII, as well as Ellis and Butler. I haven't even included Higgins, Towner and Markov because they'd have each been on sub $200k/year. Add to that now Astbury and Houli, without any big recruits bar Lynchy since 2016,I think our playing list is very sustainable.

You wouldn’t think so but Zac Williams says hello , who’s not fit to tie shortys bootlaces, bf in premiership year , whisker off a norm smith . He could easily attract a decent offer 650-700

 

[GhostofJimJess]

You wouldn’t think so but Zac Williams says hello , who’s not fit to tie shortys bootlaces, bf in premiership year , whisker off a norm smith . He could easily attract a decent offer 650-700

Yep, totally. I'm not seeing anyone offering him $800k. Maybe West Coast if they have a few retirees and could chuck up $2M over three years to get him out of Tigerland, but I doubt any other team in need would have the coin.

 

[RJKTiger]

Rioli in and out of the side for the last few seasons and now people think he’s an integral part of the back 6……

I personally think his form down back is pretty overrated & his biggest upside value to us is as a forward, but i do think based on the clubs words and handling of him, they are going in 2022 with Dan a lock down back for round 1. He is a "Dimma favourite", recently signed a new contract, and they have asked him to embrace the new role & he appears to have done so like a pro. I think they will give him first and every chance down there before resorting to a "plan B" - so it appears the reality of him being "integral" down back is not a matter of "if" - the club has committed to his role

 

[sregit]

Have cash once jack and cotch retire this year. I’d take a guess and say cotch is still on big money this year.

Jack will play in 2023