List Mgmt. Trade Hypotheticals (opposition posters post here)

[Giant Strides]

Thanks. That's some excellent insight.

I don't think Carlton would be worried about the 'GWS offcuts' tag. If CFC can turn offcuts into players then so be it. Things that make another CFC/GWS deal likely are that (a) SOS knows the list, and (b) there might be some pull in fringe GWS players coming to Carlton being able to reunite with some familiar GWS faces. My only reservation is that Carlton might not have something to offer GWS this year. I assume points, but we will all be watching to see how GWS needs pan out. I suspect also that a number of other clubs will be interested in trading with GWS which will allow GWS to sell their stock to the highest bidder.

As for the mega deal last year - you have to wonder what would have happened to Lamb, Phillips and Sumner if they were not part of that deal. I am not too sure (as I didn't see any of those three play all that much) but my understanding was that they were moved for list space, because they were significantly down the pecking order.

Agree with the above. My point in respect of the 4 players - I would have thought that we could trade them separately, as 4 x third/fourth rounders would have totalled more than pick 28. But it was convenient the way it occurred because Lamb's salary for the following year needed to be taken over & two were essentially free (as PSD & rookie picks) to GWS. I just meant that we don't have the same circumstances this year so I'd expect we'll aim to extract full value for each player - as you've mentioned, we might get enough interest to sell to highest bidder. Cheers.

 

[Raymann]

Carlton took 2 million of our cap. Plowman was their reward.

 

[isamedthegiants]

Carlton took 2 million of our cap. Plowman was their reward.

Is that the AFL equivalent of:

"Shagged Jennifer Hawkins! Got crabs"

 

[OrangeDuck]

Is that the AFL equivalent of:

"Shagged Jennifer Hawkins! Got crabs"

Gotta admit, that would probably be worth it.

 

[eth-dog]

Is that the AFL equivalent of:

"Shagged Jennifer Hawkins! Got crabs"

Would still do.

 

[Ellie Aquitaine]

Carlton took 2 million of our cap. Plowman was their reward.

Jeez. How much were we paying for NEAFL players? Obviously Lamb is expensive at places other than supermarkets.

 

[isamedthegiants]

Jeez. How much were we paying for NEAFL players? Obviously Lamb is expensive at places other than supermarkets.

Lamb's cheap at my butcher. $9 a kilo for a whole one broken down. Fantastic value.

 

[Chizm]

Not that I think you would be looking at shopping him around, but this is a hypotheticals thread, so I'm generally curious. What would Paul Ahern be worth?

 

[isamedthegiants]

Not that I think you would be looking at shopping him around, but this is a hypotheticals thread, so I'm generally curious. What would Paul Ahern be worth?

Honestly? Who knows?

That's one of those chicken and egg situations.

Talented high draft pick didn't play a game his first year then does an ACL and sits out his second.

No idea what he'd be worth.

 

[Giant Strides]

Some of the commentary in the current furore about the academy and amount of talent on GWS's list is certainly around the mark in my honest opinion, and the issue of round 1 picks not getting a game will be an issue over time. However, the current attention is a bit over the top - in the past first round picks weren't guaranteed a start in the team in the first year, let alone the first few rounds, so it shouldn't be a case of 'shock, horror, first/second year player hasn't cracked first grade'. But because we do have a young list, it is true that GWS will not be able to give everyone on their list that development pathway into regular first grade over the next 3-5 years. It was very unfortunate that Paul injured himself really early, as there were whispers of him pushing for a start early in 2016, but (barring injuries to other players) he's probably dropped in behind others who are getting playing time in 2016. So, it is not inconceivable that he might look at his recovery & road to first grade, and seek an opportunity elsewhere that might be easier.

Sorry, long-winded way to an answer. I just wanted to put some background out there to explain why I'd see GWS viewing him as still around the same mark he was taken in the first round. His value hasn't really dropped - neither injury nor not having played first grade yet should diminish it substantially. He's contracted until end of 2017, so this year there would be no alternative way out. So, I'd see GWS wanting a high-ish first round pick, or similar value in points. Having said that, I think that GWS would probably be sympathetic given his long injury, and depending on how the AFL proceeds in regards the academies and bidding rules, could see them taking less. I'd think 2017 first round pick might be a starting point - Essendon back themselves to improve and make that much lower than what he's worth.

 

[Turbocat]

Some of the commentary in the current furore about the academy and amount of talent on GWS's list is certainly around the mark in my honest opinion, and the issue of round 1 picks not getting a game will be an issue over time. However, the current attention is a bit over the top - in the past first round picks weren't guaranteed a start in the team in the first year, let alone the first few rounds, so it shouldn't be a case of 'shock, horror, first/second year player hasn't cracked first grade'. But because we do have a young list, it is true that GWS will not be able to give everyone on their list that development pathway into regular first grade over the next 3-5 years. It was very unfortunate that Paul injured himself really early, as there were whispers of him pushing for a start early in 2016, but (barring injuries to other players) he's probably dropped in behind others who are getting playing time in 2016. So, it is not inconceivable that he might look at his recovery & road to first grade, and seek an opportunity elsewhere that might be easier.

Sorry, long-winded way to an answer. I just wanted to put some background out there to explain why I'd see GWS viewing him as still around the same mark he was taken in the first round. His value hasn't really dropped - neither injury nor not having played first grade yet should diminish it substantially. He's contracted until end of 2017, so this year there would be no alternative way out. So, I'd see GWS wanting a high-ish first round pick, or similar value in points. Having said that, I think that GWS would probably be sympathetic given his long injury, and depending on how the AFL proceeds in regards the academies and bidding rules, could see them taking less. I'd think 2017 first round pick might be a starting point - Essendon back themselves to improve and make that much lower than what he's worth.

On the number our R1 types... and to some degree that involves the academy discussion... R1 players usually have been the gun kids in any team they have played , they have grown up being the centre of the universe. One can just imagine in juniors...just give it to Billy etc.. and as they have move thru the grades, the best player is not always the most defensive because of this. Its one reason , that in some cases early picks need to be groomed , to be educated in the method required at AFL level.

Geelong has never had the group you guys have had to contend with...but times in the past when we have had big groups of talented youth come in.. it was not an automatic that they would just get games to blood them. I think back to the 01 draft , Ablett, Bartel,Kelly is came in and Bartel played 11 game in their first year , Bartel 13 in the second , 16 in the third... not until year 4 was he a locked in best 22 player. He had to learn the other side of the game . I can remember at that time it was a bit touch and go on getting him to stay, new contract etc ..he was getting offers and the 2's was not what he was used to. And Jimmy was not as talented as some of your kids , and clubs had not been thru the establishment of 2 new clubs.

So some kids will just will not soak it up. Selfish to a degree , but understandable. I could imagine the fringe players waiting their turn, and then GWS bring in a new bunch of fresh exciting talent. Trying to balance where they should be for them as professionals some times means movement. Any club where the AFL side is playing well, starts to settle in a best 22/26 then players will look around. Thats not specific to Ahern but after doing a knee..and seeing a new bunch of high rated Academy kids come in , offers from talent deprived clubs might appeal. They have to find a way to get the deal done of course..thats normal for contracted players.

 

[NMFCARSENAL98]

Marchbank for our first and second rounders this year?

 

[isamedthegiants]

Marchbank for our first and second rounders this year?

Can't trade out two picks in the same draft can you?

This years and next years firsts, however, and you can send the paperwork across for me to sign tomorrow morning.

 

[dlanod]

Can't trade out two picks in the same draft can you?

This years and next years firsts, however, and you can send the paperwork across for me to sign tomorrow morning.

You can't trade out next year's first and another in next year's draft.

You can trade as many of this year's picks as you want.

 

[fargothegreat]

Marchbank, Steele and Barrett for a top 4 pick?

 

[Colonial]

Marchbank, Steele and Barrett for a top 4 pick?

No

 

[isamedthegiants]

Marchbank, Steele and Barrett for a top 4 pick?

Marchbank and Barrett, yes.

 

[Andre the Giant]

Marchbank, Steele and Barrett for a top 4 pick?

Sounds pretty fair but how about this counter offer

Rance, Martin and Deledio for Marchbank, Steele and Barrett??

What do you think??

 

[Vic pokiesmon]

Marchbank, Steele and Barrett for a top 4 pick?

I dont think other Giants posters will agree and Tigers would be very reluctant to give him up but Tigers have the one thing we are missing- a very very good mature aged centre.half back.Rance is the man but this could only happen if
1/Marchbank wants to go back to Melbourne.

2/We dont see Mohr or Corr being able to hold down CHB in a premiership team.

3/Others such as Tomlinson,Stewart,Hoskin Elliot,Steele (he hasnt resigned yet),Corr and Mccarthy free up salary cap room and provide good trade value.

4/We still have enough academy points for our top academy picks.We could offer players or 1st round draft picks even after academy picks are factored in.This could satisfy Tigers who may be in a rebuild mode

Before anyone scoffs at us trading for a 27 year old remember hes the best defender in the league.His age is where we have an age gap not as some have suggested here with 18 -19 year olds.. Mumford,Griffen,Shaw will all be 30 plus and Patfull who is a very important defender and Johnson will likely be gone.

5/We are in premiership zone next year and Macreadie will be the developing Centre half back in future years. Next year we don't want a developing centre half back in finals.Rance could be the player we need

6/Win the premiership next year or seriously challenge it helps retain Shiel etc.A 27 year old like Rance on a 4 year contract is going nowhere.Draftees u can never be sure of.He wouldn't come cheaply but we have to at least explore it.Tigers would have to consider it especially as they lack young top end talent.

Ps I realise we would probably need to front end load his contract therefore a few contracted players such as Tomlinson,Mccarthy, Hoskin Elliot and maybe Corr would have to go.It would still be tough to fit him in but clubs find a way

 

[MrPortAdelaide]

what is Steele's contract status? would love him at port and will be starved of opportunities at GWS, would he be worth? 1st, 2nd rounder

 

[Colonial]

what is Steele's contract status? would love him at port and will be starved of opportunities at GWS, would he be worth? 1st, 2nd rounder

Hahahaha you do realise he has played in 5 of 7 games right?

But hey its hypothetical.
His contract ends this year.
But.
He is a very popular academy player whose parents were original Giants members.

If IF you could sway him it would be a high 1st rounder plus something etra, with a 2nd or 3rd rounder coming back

Yes i rate him massively.

 

[MrPortAdelaide]

Hahahaha you do realise he has played in 5 of 7 games right?

But hey its hypothetical.
His contract ends this year.
But.
He is a very popular academy player whose parents were original Giants members.

If IF you could sway him it would be a high 1st rounder plus something etra, with a 2nd or 3rd rounder coming back

Yes i rate him massively.

in any other team he would be playing without question, at the moment he is somewhere between best 18-26. Is there any reason he hasnt signed, what are the vibes coming from club land

 

[Ichabod Noodle]

what is Steele's contract status? would love him at port and will be starved of opportunities at GWS, would he be worth? 1st, 2nd rounder

You jest, yes?

He's found his spot in the 22 and hasn't let it go. Was singled out by Leon in his post match presser after the Freo game as being very important after having his best game yet. Hardly "starved of opportunities"

But I suppose, now that Cal and Lachie have re-signed, he's the next cab off the rank for speculation.

But this is the hypothetical thread so I'll play along....

He was bid on at 17, by North, so was considered worthy of a first rounder before he'd played a game. Throw in 2 years of development and the fact he's regular 22 in a side comfortably in the 8, a local boy with no homesickness issues, parents who were foundation members of the club long before their boy was on the radar.....

you certainly wouldn't get him for a second rounder. I would think at least a first - and depending on what that was, you might also need a second rounder with maybe some change or steak knives going back. As for players thrown in, there's nobody on your list I want - except maybe Jack Hombsch back (never wanted to lose him)

So there you go - if you want Steele - I'll take your first rounder and Jack Hombsch and throw I'll throw a second/third round pick into the mix for steak knives. I value the boy highly.

 

[MrPortAdelaide]

You jest, yes?

He's found his spot in the 22 and hasn't let it go. Was singled out by Leon in his post match presser after the Freo game as being very important after having his best game yet. Hardly "starved of opportunities"

But I suppose, now that Cal and Lachie have re-signed, he's the next cab off the rank for speculation.

But this is the hypothetical thread so I'll play along....

He was bid on at 17, by North, so was considered worthy of a first rounder before he'd played a game. Throw in 2 years of development and the fact he's regular 22 in a side comfortably in the 8, a local boy with no homesickness issues, parents who were foundation members of the club long before their boy was on the radar.....

you certainly wouldn't get him for a second rounder. I would think at least a first - and depending on what that was, you might also need a second rounder with maybe some change or steak knives going back. As for players thrown in, there's nobody on your list I want - except maybe Jack Hombsch back (never wanted to lose him)

So there you go - if you want Steele - I'll take your first rounder and Jack Hombsch and throw I'll throw a second/third round pick into the mix for steak knives. I value the boy highly.

wasnt he dropped after the round 1 melbourne loss

 

[MrPortAdelaide]

You jest, yes?

He's found his spot in the 22 and hasn't let it go. Was singled out by Leon in his post match presser after the Freo game as being very important after having his best game yet. Hardly "starved of opportunities"

But I suppose, now that Cal and Lachie have re-signed, he's the next cab off the rank for speculation.

But this is the hypothetical thread so I'll play along....

He was bid on at 17, by North, so was considered worthy of a first rounder before he'd played a game. Throw in 2 years of development and the fact he's regular 22 in a side comfortably in the 8, a local boy with no homesickness issues, parents who were foundation members of the club long before their boy was on the radar.....

you certainly wouldn't get him for a second rounder. I would think at least a first - and depending on what that was, you might also need a second rounder with maybe some change or steak knives going back. As for players thrown in, there's nobody on your list I want - except maybe Jack Hombsch back (never wanted to lose him)

So there you go - if you want Steele - I'll take your first rounder and Jack Hombsch and throw I'll throw a second/third round pick into the mix for steak knives. I value the boy highly.

you cant have Jack, you gave him to us for peanuts, but you can have Carlilse?