Trade update - Sunday 7/10
- Thread starter Waltzing Woof Biscuit
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Waltzing Woof Biscuit
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MC, this is trade week. Where there is no smoke, there is no fire.
I've heard that Dimma is going to the Roos for a low draft pick.
I have no problems with not chasing the big name players. You either pay an absolute mint to get them (in this case West for Croad, or the 4th pick in the draft for Hamill last year, 1st pick for Croad etc.), or you miss out.
Also, given our relatively successful last 5 years, we haven't been in a position to really force a club to trade one of it's stars to us. Fremantle, St Kilda etc, can say "if you don't organise a trade, we'll take him in the pre season draft for nothing - ball's in your court" -- Hamill and Bell last year being cases in point.
Another point is that we're not alone in failing to draw the bigger name players (although it feels that way
) -- There have been 12 other clubs out there who haven't managed to get a 'big' name to cross over in the last 5 years -- 4 of the last 5 premiership teams (Essendon, Brisbane, Adelaide) being among them. Are we to say that because Essendon haven't landed big names, that they're failures? No -- it's just that some clubs have different philosophies on how to go about bringing a successful team together.
I'll use Colbert as an example on how, in some cases, we're better off by not chasing the bigger names -- We offered Cameron, M West, Dimma AND a first round draft pick for Colbert -- A HUGE name at the time -- Would we all be spewing with Murphy (the player Geelong could have selected with that pick), Cameron, Dimma doing well for Geelong? Yup. Would we have been dissapointed with Colbert, given the expectations on him, and what it cost us to snare him? Yup.
Sure, I would have loved to have snared Mckernan, Black and Croad. It just wasn't to be, and in a years time we might be better off not having chased them, with the first round draft pick we offered in getting Heath Black turning out to be a bigger star. And I admit -- Some supporters need something to be enthusiastic about, to feel excited enough about Big Name Player X having a huge influence on the team's fortunes next season, in order to buy a membership. But what happens the next year when it all turns out to be a load of hot wind, with no substance -- a player not performing to expectations, and being criticised because he hasn't lived up to the hype surrounding him ? Supporters are left feeling disappointed, and membership falls away again.
But it aint all doom and gloom -- Next year we make our move in the trade market -- $300K will be freed up in the salary cap with Grant being listed on the veterans list. Possibly another $100-150K with Smith. That's 450 big bikkies to entice a pretty bloody big name. Some more money/spots get freed up with a few retirements (Huddo, Croft, Curley, Libba). If it's a poor season (which it loks like being), we will most probably have a gun draft pick (#4/#5) to play around with, and have a higher placing in the pre season draft (possibly 1st with the ballot system, if we finish in the bottom 4).
So at the end of 2002, we're left with an impressive top 5, youngsters of the ilk of Murphy, Giansiracusa, McMahon, Hahn and Bowden with another year of experience under their belts, another good youngster coming in from our first draft choice next month, possibly a couple of quality players in trades next year, and a top draft choice. It aint all doom and gloom.
Cheers
An optimistic Westy Boy
Also, given our relatively successful last 5 years, we haven't been in a position to really force a club to trade one of it's stars to us. Fremantle, St Kilda etc, can say "if you don't organise a trade, we'll take him in the pre season draft for nothing - ball's in your court" -- Hamill and Bell last year being cases in point.
Another point is that we're not alone in failing to draw the bigger name players (although it feels that way
) -- There have been 12 other clubs out there who haven't managed to get a 'big' name to cross over in the last 5 years -- 4 of the last 5 premiership teams (Essendon, Brisbane, Adelaide) being among them. Are we to say that because Essendon haven't landed big names, that they're failures? No -- it's just that some clubs have different philosophies on how to go about bringing a successful team together. I'll use Colbert as an example on how, in some cases, we're better off by not chasing the bigger names -- We offered Cameron, M West, Dimma AND a first round draft pick for Colbert -- A HUGE name at the time -- Would we all be spewing with Murphy (the player Geelong could have selected with that pick), Cameron, Dimma doing well for Geelong? Yup. Would we have been dissapointed with Colbert, given the expectations on him, and what it cost us to snare him? Yup.
Sure, I would have loved to have snared Mckernan, Black and Croad. It just wasn't to be, and in a years time we might be better off not having chased them, with the first round draft pick we offered in getting Heath Black turning out to be a bigger star. And I admit -- Some supporters need something to be enthusiastic about, to feel excited enough about Big Name Player X having a huge influence on the team's fortunes next season, in order to buy a membership. But what happens the next year when it all turns out to be a load of hot wind, with no substance -- a player not performing to expectations, and being criticised because he hasn't lived up to the hype surrounding him ? Supporters are left feeling disappointed, and membership falls away again.
But it aint all doom and gloom -- Next year we make our move in the trade market -- $300K will be freed up in the salary cap with Grant being listed on the veterans list. Possibly another $100-150K with Smith. That's 450 big bikkies to entice a pretty bloody big name. Some more money/spots get freed up with a few retirements (Huddo, Croft, Curley, Libba). If it's a poor season (which it loks like being
), we will most probably have a gun draft pick (#4/#5) to play around with, and have a higher placing in the pre season draft (possibly 1st with the ballot system, if we finish in the bottom 4). So at the end of 2002, we're left with an impressive top 5, youngsters of the ilk of Murphy, Giansiracusa, McMahon, Hahn and Bowden with another year of experience under their belts, another good youngster coming in from our first draft choice next month, possibly a couple of quality players in trades next year, and a top draft choice. It aint all doom and gloom.
Cheers
An optimistic Westy Boy
You put that well WB but the thing is its not just the lack of big names we attract its the lack of quality trades at all.If you look at Brissy who you listed as not having attracted a big name last year they got Mal Michael who is a very handy player,they also got Pike and a few years ago Heuskes.Adelaide another team listed by you two years ago were able to pick up Scott Welsh and the year before Mark Stevens who are 2 very good players aswell.Anyway my point is i would just like some players with some sort of quality that we can work on with them.Originally posted by Westy_Boy
I have no problems with not chasing the big name players. You either pay an absolute mint to get them (in this case West for Croad, or the 4th pick in the draft for Hamill last year, 1st pick for Croad etc.), or you miss out.
Also, given our relatively successful last 5 years, we haven't been in a position to really force a club to trade one of it's stars to us. Fremantle, St Kilda etc, can say "if you don't organise a trade, we'll take him in the pre season draft for nothing - ball's in your court" -- Hamill and Bell last year being cases in point.
Another point is that we're not alone in failing to draw the bigger name players (although it feels that way
I'll use Colbert as an example on how, in some cases, we're better off by not chasing the bigger names -- We offered Cameron, M West, Dimma AND a first round draft pick for Colbert -- A HUGE name at the time -- Would we all be spewing with Murphy (the player Geelong could have selected with that pick), Cameron, Dimma doing well for Geelong? Yup. Would we have been dissapointed with Colbert, given the expectations on him, and what it cost us to snare him? Yup.
Sure, I would have loved to have snared Mckernan, Black and Croad. It just wasn't to be, and in a years time we might be better off not having chased them, with the first round draft pick we offered in getting Heath Black turning out to be a bigger star. And I admit -- Some supporters need something to be enthusiastic about, to feel excited enough about Big Name Player X having a huge influence on the team's fortunes next season, in order to buy a membership. But what happens the next year when it all turns out to be a load of hot wind, with no substance -- a player not performing to expectations, and being criticised because he hasn't lived up to the hype surrounding him ? Supporters are left feeling disappointed, and membership falls away again.
But it aint all doom and gloom -- Next year we make our move in the trade market -- $300K will be freed up in the salary cap with Grant being listed on the veterans list. Possibly another $100-150K with Smith. That's 450 big bikkies to entice a pretty bloody big name. Some more money/spots get freed up with a few retirements (Huddo, Croft, Curley, Libba). If it's a poor season (which it loks like being
So at the end of 2002, we're left with an impressive top 5, youngsters of the ilk of Murphy, Giansiracusa, McMahon, Hahn and Bowden with another year of experience under their belts, another good youngster coming in from our first draft choice next month, possibly a couple of quality players in trades next year, and a top draft choice. It aint all doom and gloom.
Cheers
An optimistic Westy Boy
I couldnt agree more about big name trades. Look at what we gave up for Eagleton and the initial benefits. Last season Powell played in a GF and Montgomery won the B&F at Port. Eagleton still has youth on his side and with a little more application will make a very good player, but in the short term we have lost out on the deal.
But. We have had a major definciency in defence for at least five years. A quick look at the premiership sides you mentioned WB shows that blokes like Michael, Barnard, Wellman, Pike and The fella at Adelaide that wore No. 44 that Plugger knocked out when he was playing at Sydney have all played in premierships, in a key defensive position after swapping clubs in either a low-key or a mutually beneficial trade.
In the mean time what have we been recruiting blokes like Winmar and Huddo. Dont get me wrong-these guys have all done a job, but how long does a glaring problem stick around before something gets done?
But. We have had a major definciency in defence for at least five years. A quick look at the premiership sides you mentioned WB shows that blokes like Michael, Barnard, Wellman, Pike and The fella at Adelaide that wore No. 44 that Plugger knocked out when he was playing at Sydney have all played in premierships, in a key defensive position after swapping clubs in either a low-key or a mutually beneficial trade.
In the mean time what have we been recruiting blokes like Winmar and Huddo. Dont get me wrong-these guys have all done a job, but how long does a glaring problem stick around before something gets done?
NOTE TO WWB
Not sure if anybody else has pointed it out, this thread is too long for me to catch up on fully, but just on the cameron trade we did also get a 5th round pick. (Ryan Hargrave)
Not sure if anybody else has pointed it out, this thread is too long for me to catch up on fully, but just on the cameron trade we did also get a 5th round pick. (Ryan Hargrave)
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