List Mgmt. Trade Week 2016 - Live Thread

[Chad in Vegas]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-10-20/players-in-limbo-who-is-yet-to-sign-on-or-find-a-new-home

Any thoughts on any of the uncontracted players listed above? Josh Green perhaps, he is quick (from memory) and would address our needs for both a small forward and a ginger.

I threw up Mitch Clark's name previously but seemed to be alone in that thinking, I would still prefer we rookie listed him over Petrie but now we have Vardy I think taking either would be a waste (if Giles and Vardy are on the list as insurance ruckman why would we need insurance on our insurance?).

 

[kranky al]

A part of me thinks the pick swap was primarily to spite Essendon who were a real shot at picking him up for nothing in the PSD.

Double whammy - if hawthorn get nothing out of him they lol as they had them pay good coin.

They make essendon miss out

And hawthorn no doubt owe them a big favour

 

[kranky al]

Club obviously thought Waterman wouldn't last until 70's. Vardy is 25 and if his body comes good he is a longer term prospect (e.g. Lobb). Petrie isn't a full time ruck, but he CAN ruck and his body is good. Its good planning.

We have Mitchell and I have the impression despite NN injury we are having a tilt. Why waste the opportunity to have a crack whilst Sammy is still around.

McInnes isn't much chop so why not if its a cheap pickup as a delisted free agent? I don't get the resistance really beyond saying "he's a spud" but yet he's better than our depth?

Without getting into a priddis bash im sure we can agree that you cant have pridd and mitchell in the centre square at the same time.

 

[SpaceClef]

Club obviously thought Waterman wouldn't last until 70's. Vardy is 25 and if his body comes good he is a longer term prospect (e.g. Lobb). Petrie isn't a full time ruck, but he CAN ruck and his body is good. Its good planning.

I don't see Vardy as a long term prospect. He is older than Lycett, is less durable and less runs on the board. He could come good, but I don't think his ceiling is higher than Lycett's, and they are very similar players.

If Vardy is insurance for the first 20 rounds of next year, then I have no problem with it. I don't see him as a long term prospect though, and we would be better off rookieing a project ruckman for that purpose.

So presuming Vardy is good sensible insurance then I don't like the idea of using our first rookie pick on Petrie (if that is what we are doing - i'm just going off what people have been posting) as insurance insurance. Could get a good mature ager like Tom Papley, Anthony Tippa, or Aaron Vandenburg or a crumber like Charlie Cameron for a pick like that.

If we use one of our last rookie picks then so be it.

 

[SpaceClef]

Some on this board mocked our acquisition of Giles this time last season. I imagine it's the same people this time around too. If our first choice ruckmen go down someone like Petrie could save our ass in a crucial game (eg Giles vs Adelaide).

I liked the Giles acquisition last year but I see the Vardy trade as being the equivalent this time around. Petrie is overkill.

 

[paran]

Without getting into a priddis bash im sure we can agree that you cant have pridd and mitchell in the centre square at the same time.

You can, but you're gambling that you win the ball and hit a target, because if it goes the other way, there likely a couple of guys tearing off those two.

 

[WCE_phil]

So Gaff and Darling didn't help us make the Prelim in 2011?

There have been a total of 11 different first and second year players who played in Grand Finals since 2012.

Obviously you can't rebuild your team from scratch and remain in your window but you can still get good immediate value from draftees which benefits the side long term as well

While this is the case you can go through those sides and be lucky if 1 of them was outside of the last few players picked in their side. While some of them have and will develop into star players when those players played in the respective grand finals they were all on the fringe and none of them were dominant.

 

[paran]

I liked the Giles acquisition last year but I see the Vardy trade as being the equivalent this time around. Petrie is overkill.

What was interesting last year was that McInnes hardly played any ruck at all, so that was obviously never in the WCE development plans, yet Vardy i brought in as a FWD/RUC... weird.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

So Gaff and Darling didn't help us make the Prelim in 2011?

There have been a total of 11 different first and second year players who played in Grand Finals since 2012.

Obviously you can't rebuild your team from scratch and remain in your window but you can still get good immediate value from draftees which benefits the side long term as well

Thats the point mate, of all the drafted players you get you will always get the odd one or two that can play straight away which is why i said it is a balancing act, invariably though most drafted players take considerable time these days for some reason.
It is hard to do both unless you are in total rebuild. Are we expecting our pick 12 to play next year? The chances are small but are possible.

 

[SpaceClef]

While this is the case you can go through those sides and be lucky if 1 of them was outside of the last few players picked in their side. While some of them have and will develop into star players when those players played in the respective grand finals they were all on the fringe and none of them were dominant.

Who said anything about being dominant?

Grand Finals themselves are a different beast, but try with a straight face to tell me that:
Sheed had no bearing on the Eagles making the Grand Final in 2015
Papley, Heeney and Mills had no bearing on Sydney making the Grand Final in 2016
Daniel or Dunkley didn't help their sides in 2016. Or Bontempelli in 2015.
Luke Parker contributed nothing in 2012.
Brad Hill had no bearing on Hawthorn making the Grand Final in 2013 (ok maybe you could)

Even if these players were omitted from the Grand Final due to lack of experience, then you still can't suggest that they didn't contribute to the premiership campaigns of their respective teams.

 

[SpaceClef]

Thats the point mate, of all the drafted players you get you will always get the odd one or two that can play straight away which is why i said it is a balancing act, invariably though most drafted players take considerable time these days for some reason.
It is hard to do both unless you are in total rebuild. Are we expecting our pick 12 to play next year? The chances are small but are possible.

I dare say if we pick Powell Pepper then he will play. I think WC take too long to blood players these days, but that's a different story.

 

[Keys]

As it stands we only have 6 spaces on our list (main and rookie)

Pure tall forwards we have Kennedy and Darling

Pure rucks we have Naitanui and Giles albeit Naitanui will miss most or all of 2017

Forward/Rucks we have Lycett, Vardy and McInness

Four of those (Nat, Slyce, Giles and Vardy) are on the list primarily as rucks

It's almost a given we will take a developing ruck over the draft period which will bring the number of "rucks" on our list to 5.

Adding Petrie to that makes no sense unless we miss out on a ruck during the draft

 

[QS]

Without getting into a priddis bash im sure we can agree that you cant have pridd and mitchell in the centre square at the same time.

That's another debate for another thread lol

 

[QS]

Adding Petrie to that makes no sense unless we miss out on a ruck during the draft

If this happens then no need for Petrie and given NN will be 27 next year (WTF!) it might be high time to look at drafting a project ruck.

But... the risk is, is that the cart before the horse and should we be loading up on mids? If so, then Petrie isn't a bad idea in the immediate short term. I will back the club if they do go with him.

 

[swooshacummings]

Risk Matrices are the bane of my existence.

Have replaced critical thinking

 

[WCE_phil]

If we draft english i think im going to have a meltdown.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

With Vardy coming in I'd like to see us pick up a younger ruck prospect like Cameron or Goodwin as further insurance rather than a one-year (at best) player like Petrie.

 

[flamingEMBERS]

If we draft english i think im going to have a meltdown.

discuss.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

I dare say if we pick Powell Pepper then he will play. I think WC take too long to blood players these days, but that's a different story.

i hope so mate, and yes we take way to long to give our recruits game time.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

As it stands we only have 6 spaces on our list (main and rookie)

Pure tall forwards we have Kennedy and Darling

Pure rucks we have Naitanui and Giles albeit Naitanui will miss most or all of 2017

Forward/Rucks we have Lycett, Vardy and McInness

Four of those (Nat, Slyce, Giles and Vardy) are on the list primarily as rucks

It's almost a given we will take a developing ruck over the draft period which will bring the number of "rucks" on our list to 5.

Adding Petrie to that makes no sense unless we miss out on a ruck during the draft

I dare say Petrie is on the radar still because they have recruited Vardy mainly to play forward. If he can be sound to play he will take CHF and push Darling to a flank and that creates a very solid forward line. Vardy can seriously play but staying out on the paddock is his issue.

 

[ROC1969]

I'm guessing the Petrie talk could reflect a behind closed doors lack of confidence in Lycett and NN recovery. That mixed with knowing Giles is not the longer term answer.

 

[bombard]

As it stands we only have 6 spaces on our list (main and rookie)

Pure tall forwards we have Kennedy and Darling

Pure rucks we have Naitanui and Giles albeit Naitanui will miss most or all of 2017

Forward/Rucks we have Lycett, Vardy and McInness

Four of those (Nat, Slyce, Giles and Vardy) are on the list primarily as rucks

It's almost a given we will take a developing ruck over the draft period which will bring the number of "rucks" on our list to 5.

Adding Petrie to that makes no sense unless we miss out on a ruck during the draft

Matthew Allen yo

 

[ROYAL EAGLE]

If we draft english i think im going to have a meltdown.

Totally agree dont need him, and he is a long development player

 

[SpaceClef]

Matthew Allen yo

The forgotten gun

 

[WCE_phil]

discuss.

The best case scenario for english imo is dean cox however the worst case scenario is gorringe mk 2. The other issue is his ruckwork is absolutely shit house and he will need at least 4-5 years of development. I would much rather use a late pick of jeremy goddard who while he won't ever be a superstar is easily the best actual ruckman in his draft year, is very aggressive and strong and could develop into a mumford type (more like jacobs imo but with more aggression)

English is an average midfielder who just happened to grow 20cm and become ruck sized.