Training Training Reports and Updates

[JuniorB]

If we play Frampton forward, he'll be instructed to mark the ball if he can and bring it to ground if he can't (and obviously kick goals if he can).
Keep it simple - he doesn't have to do anything amazing, just make a contest.

 

[sam_e]

Where they played seniors at their previous club is irrelevant now. At vfl level this year Kreuger is the better performed forward, especially over the past few months.

let's just agree to disagree.

where they've played their entire careers prior to crossing to the Pies isn't irrelevant ..they're not 18 year olds, they're 24 yo (kreuger) and 26 yo (frampton) respectively

kreuger has been playing vfl against vfl calibre defenders and doing ok'ish. if you close your eyes you can almost ignore the fact that he's gone done with shoulder / knee / ankle ..injury / soreness / awareness and/or concussion in nearly every one of those vfl games.

have you also looked at his last 5 senior performances at afl level

the longer Kreuger's absence the more he becomes a hybrid of Carey, Carmen, Quinlan & Lockett

He kicked 2.0 goals and 2.2 goals in rounds 2 and 5 in 2022 and since then his stats (in senior games):
_Rnd 6 anzac ‘22 v Ess: 0 disposals; 0.0 goals; shoulder -> injured early 2Q > 25% TOG
_QF ‘22: v Gee; 1 disposals; 0.0 goals; subbed on early Q4 > 9% TOG
_Prelim ‘22: v Swans; 4 disposals; 0.1 goals; subbed on mid Q4 > 35% TOG
_Rnd 6 ‘23: v Ess; 5 disposals; 0.0 goals; injured late 3Q > 40% TOG
_Rnd 7 anzac ‘23: v Adel; 5 disposals; 0.0 goals; injured shoulder early > 12% TOG

go back and watch the Anzac day game, he's miles off the pace

ps: just for clarification, i'm not saying Frampton will win Normie (and i can see the same weaknesses you can), it's just that i can't see any justification /rationale for playing Kreuger in front of him. If AJ was fit, he'd be straight in ..

 

[cfc19902010]

If we play Frampton forward, he'll be instructed to mark the ball if he can and bring it to ground if he can't (and obviously kick goals if he can).
Keep it simple - he doesn't have to do anything amazing, just make a contest.

He couldn’t do much worse than curnow did last week

 

[Apex36]

I don't buy the whole 'Frampton isn't a forward' thing. Can you mark? can you kick 40+ metres? Yes? then you are capable of being a forward option. Sure you're not going to be a Tony Lockett out there but it really is that simple. From 9 shots at goal this year he's kicked 7 of them with 2 behinds which is more than accurate enough.

If it was that simple then decent tall forwards wouldn’t be so incredibly hard to find.
Can you mark? Can you kick 40+ metres? Great! Can you lead to the right spots? Can you get to those important inside 50 aerial contests?


…oh.

 

[Apex36]

kreuger has played his entire senior career (geelong vfl) as a tall defender until he arrived at the pies in 2022.

That’s disingenuous at best. He was moved to defence after they recruited Cameron and no longer had a forward spot available for him in the senior side. They recruited him as a forward and played him there initially.

 

[sr36]

If we play Frampton forward, he'll be instructed to mark the ball if he can and bring it to ground if he can't (and obviously kick goals if he can).
Keep it simple - he doesn't have to do anything amazing, just make a contest.

He's good when he's at a contest in time. He'll be fine in the hotspot. Might even Jag a goal or two. It's reading the game and when he has to make decisions about pushing higher up - when and where to go that is the worry. You can no longer just anchor yourself to the goal square or not get involved or you're just giving the opposition a spare man to exploit for much of the game

 

[JuniorB]

If it was that simple then decent tall forwards wouldn’t be so incredibly hard to find.
Can you mark? Can you kick 40+ metres? Great! Can you lead to the right spots? Can you get to those important inside 50 aerial contests?


…oh.

If Jamie Elliot was 20cm taller he'd have been one of the best KPFs.
He's pretty damn good anyway!
McStay is pretty good at the things you mention, which is why it's unfortunate he is injured.
We wouldn't be having this discussion otherwise.

 

[sam_e]

That’s disingenuous at best. He was moved to defence after they recruited Cameron and no longer had a forward spot available for him in the senior side. They recruited him as a forward and played him there initially.

Fair call out. He was recruited in 2018 as a developing key position (trialled as forward) yet played no senior games in 2019 or 2020, before Cameron arrived.

Cameron arrived in 2021 and he still plays no senior games until the final two rounds of that year where he managed 7 disposals (0.0 goals) vs Nth and 8 disposals (0.0 goals) vs GWS

 

[Fat Jesus]

If Jamie Elliot was 20cm taller he'd have been one of the best KPFs.
He's pretty damn good anyway!
McStay is pretty good at the things you mention, which is why it's unfortunate he is injured.
We wouldn't be having this discussion otherwise.

Jamie Elliott is good because at his height he can play on bigs and smalls.
Has the talent.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

According to Jon Ralph
Frampton and Noble were told they’re the options to come in. So it’s really down to them it seems. No one else being considered. Fits with these two being named emergencies in both finals.

But Frampton spent time in black whereas Noble did not, so that and like-for-like logic suggests Frampton is the clubhouse leader.

 

[sr36]

Fair call out. He was recruited in 2018 as a developing key position (trialled as forward) yet played no senior games in 2019 or 2020, before Cameron arrived.

Cameron arrived in 2021 and he still plays no senior games until the final two rounds of that year where he managed 7 disposals (0.0 goals) vs Nth and 8 disposals (0.0 goals) vs GWS

This may come as a surprise, but he was injured for most of his first two years at the Cats ...

 

[sam_e]

This may come as a surprise, but he was injured for most of his first two years at the Cats ...

yep, he's been very consistent

 

[The Royal Sampler]

If it was that simple then decent tall forwards wouldn’t be so incredibly hard to find.
Can you mark? Can you kick 40+ metres? Great! Can you lead to the right spots? Can you get to those important inside 50 aerial contests?


…oh.

Again, Keeffe was apparently ok to play on Darcy Moore, AA defender, for the Giants who science tells us are the greatest sporting club to ever walk the Earth. His forward chops are significantly worse than Frampton’s.

 

[sr36]

But Frampton spent time in black whereas Noble did not, so that and like-for-like logic suggests Frampton is the clubhouse leader.

If he did what he was asked or what they wanted. Would have been a fair bit of trial, I suspect. Hopefully he smashed it, as if he can do the job it'll be ideal.

 

[magpienato]

If it was that simple then decent tall forwards wouldn’t be so incredibly hard to find.

We're not talking about being an elite forward, we're talking about just being good enough to step up and kick maybe 2 goals in a game of football. But my comments were more directed at the whole Frampton vs Kreuger debate anyway. Frampton will be a serviceable forward. Kreuger I don't think I've ever seen him win a genuine 1-on-1 in a senior game.

 

[sr36]

We're not talking about being an elite forward, we're talking about being good enough to step up and kick maybe 2 goals in a game of football. But my comments were more directed at the whole Frampton vs Kreuger debate anyway. Frampton will be a serviceable forward. Kreuger I don't think I've ever seen him win a genuine 1-on-1 in a senior game.

I was on the Kreuger train. Not because I envisaged him winning contests, but I envisaged him halving a lot more than Billy. Billy is more likely to stick a big mark though.

 

[Bianconeri]

Again, Keeffe was apparently ok to play on Darcy Moore, AA defender, for the Giants who science tells us are the greatest sporting club to ever walk the Earth. His forward chops are significantly worse than Frampton’s.

Keeffe played as backup ruckman, he wasn’t brought in to do anything special up forward. Riccardi and Hogan were their main targets. We need someone who can replace McStay’s role up forward not Cox’.

 

[swoop42]

How can those saying frampton should not be selected be so sure going small is better. When have we gone smaller

If we are to assume our 23 this week contains: Howe, Moore, Murphy / Cameron, Cox / Frampton, Mihocek (7)

then here is the examples of smaller lineups. By smaller, people are only suggesting one less tall than last week.

Round 8 vs Sydney +29: Moore, Murphy / Cox, Frampton / Johnson, Mihocek (6)

Round 9 vs GWS +65: Moore, Murphy / Cox, Johnson / Mihocek (5) + *McInnes 24% TOG

Round 10 vs Carlton +28: Moore, Murphy / Cameron, Cox / Johnson, Mihocek (6)

Round 11 vs North Melbourne +35: Moore, Murphy / Cameron, Cox / Johnson, Mihocek (6)

Round 24 vs Essendon +70: Frampton, Howe / Cameron, Cox / McStay, Mihocek (6)

 

[BillyElliott]

I was on the Kreuger train. Not because I envisaged him winning contests, but I envisaged him halving a lot more than Billy. Billy is more likely to stick a big mark though.

Big Bill was marking well today at training.

 

[Fonzeno1]

For me Frampton is miles better than Krueger at this stage. It's not even close. Frampton is more versatile, less injury prone and has better senior form. If Payne is underdone Frampton may be able to use his size and strength to his advantage. We need an honest contest from a big body so Billy and Bobby can go to work.

 

[Fruit]

Dan McStay has averaged 8 touches this season for us. He’s been great with contest and creating space for others but he’s not Wayne Carey. It wasn’t that long ago that people on here were calling for him to be left out.
Whoever replaces him won’t be as good which is why they weren’t in the team in the first place but hopefully they can provide a contest, not get out marked and maybe kick a goal or two.

 

[No SPIN]

202cm of elite marking, spoiling and intercepting versus a 192cm player in Mihochek who I cannot recall taking an overhead pack mark in what seems forever. Collingwood are going to have to keep the ball low and preferably away from Andrews which will mean Mihochek losing lots of opportunity to collect a few chest marks and ground balls and contribute a few goals. If Frampton contributes more than a goal down deeper I will be most surprised. And that's the extent of our tall man stock up forward?! The Brisbane defenders will be quaking in their boots at the prospect of dealing with our bigger blokes.

Frampton allows us to retain our fwd structure - the idea we would experiment in a GF with WHE or going small is just lunacy.

 

[jathanas]

Jen2310

The moment the Magpie army roared and alarmed my smartwatch

The game was sublime. Both teams were fast, ferocious and ridiculous and this Collingwood fan still can’t get his head around what happened.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Bianconeri]

It wasn’t that long ago that people on here were calling for him to be left out.

Those people were wrong

 

[WakeUpPies]

If you ever feel bad at your job, just remember you have kicked the same number of goals for Collingwood as Krueger in 2023.