Prediction Transition issues to continue

[lethalburns]

I don't know if its a lack of pace, skill, smarts, chemistry, off-the-ball work-rate (or a combination of) but we are one of the poorest teams in the AFL at finding space. The consequence is that we rarely transition the ball cleanly and our forwards are made to look second rate.

Last night was a Micky Mouse competition, however, the problem was again on display - of all the sides we were one of the few that were unable to consistently find a target in space and repeatedly took low percentage kicks.

What is confusing/frustrating about it all is that we have shown the ability to move the ball with pace and we look frightening when it all clicks - see the Sydney game 2017 (first quarter), GWS (first half) and first Cats game 2017, Cats game 2016, Adelaide 2017 first half.

What is going on with these boys? Are we going to see more of the same in 2018?

 

[CFC2010]

I don't know if its a lack of pace, skill, smarts, chemistry, off-the-ball work-rate (or a combination of) but we are one of the poorest teams in the AFL at finding space. The consequence is that we rarely transition the ball cleanly and our forwards are made to look second rate.

Last night was a Micky Mouse competition, however, the problem was again on display - of all the sides we were one of the few that were unable to consistently find a target in space and repeatedly took low percentage kicks.

What is confusing/frustrating about it all is that we have shown the ability to move the ball with pace and we look frightening when it all clicks - see the Sydney game 2017 (first quarter), GWS (first half) and first Cats game 2017, Cats game 2016, Adelaide 2017 first half.

What is going on with these boys? Are we going to see more of the same in 2018?

 

[Mukesh]

I think part of our problem is we don't have forwards who absolutely demand the ball be kicked to them...cue videos of Lockett, Dunstall, Richardson, BT, Riewoldt x 2 et al... and then go ballistic when they are ignored. Our guys seem to go 'oh well, no problem, yeah kick it sideways again'... ironically the forward who is most demanding on the lead is our smallest player, Mr Blair.. kudos to him for at least trying to look like a gun forward...

 

[mike123]

I think part of our problem is we don't have forwards who absolutely demand the ball be kicked to them...cue videos of Lockett, Dunstall, Richardson, BT, Riewoldt x 2 et al... and then go ballistic when they are ignored. Our guys seem to go 'oh well, no problem, yeah kick it sideways again'... ironically the forward who is most demanding on the lead is our smallest player, Mr Blair.. kudos to him for at least trying to look like a gun forward...

Even with a forward who complained when the ball wasn't kicked to him properly we still struggled in this area.

 

[Bored_Pie]

I don't know if its a lack of pace, skill, smarts, chemistry, off-the-ball work-rate (or a combination of) but we are one of the poorest teams in the AFL at finding space. The consequence is that we rarely transition the ball cleanly and our forwards are made to look second rate.

Last night was a Micky Mouse competition, however, the problem was again on display - of all the sides we were one of the few that were unable to consistently find a target in space and repeatedly took low percentage kicks.

What is confusing/frustrating about it all is that we have shown the ability to move the ball with pace and we look frightening when it all clicks - see the Sydney game 2017 (first quarter), GWS (first half) and first Cats game 2017, Cats game 2016, Adelaide 2017 first half.

What is going on with these boys? Are we going to see more of the same in 2018?

Yeah nah i'm not going to let a an AFLX game where our side had 2-3 genuine best 22 players in it give me grief about our transition.

 

[Quicky]

I think part of our problem is we don't have forwards who absolutely demand the ball be kicked to them...cue videos of Lockett, Dunstall, Richardson, BT, Riewoldt x 2 et al... and then go ballistic when they are ignored. Our guys seem to go 'oh well, no problem, yeah kick it sideways again'... ironically the forward who is most demanding on the lead is our smallest player, Mr Blair.. kudos to him for at least trying to look like a gun forward...

Aish was good at demanding it last night. Might have found a role for himself.

 

[parvey]

I think goal kicking continues to be the major problem, if thomas missed those 3 goals we would have lost

 

[WalterBlaknWhte]

Thread title made me think that one of the lads had decided on gender re-assignment

 

[ClaytonM]

Thread title made me think that one of the lads had decided on gender re-assignment

Not that there is anything wrong with that.

 

[MagpieJoel]

You might be right, but way too early. Gone way too early.

 

[Harry O]

Two words some it up. Nathan and Buckley

 

[Soups]

Two words some it up. Nathan and Buckley

That’s three words.

 

[Jasper84]

That’s three words.

But they did contain "T" and "U" which technically are some of "it up".

 

[Mukesh]

Two words some it up. Nathan and Buckley

Did u mean sum ?

 

[Jasper84]

Did u mean sum ?

I like to think he meant "summit up". Makes sense considering where a summit is located.

And just like that, Jasper's inspirational catchphrase was born. Summit up, everyone! Summit up.

 

[Daicos Torpedo]

Hit n giggle. Rookies and 2-3 first choice jogging on the spot.... Also, if BT and that Cuck Brayshaw cannot fake it (and they couldn't..) To get 'excited' then turn overbto the paint drying channel... Tonight, will black dry faster than white... Then a half time interview with Bucks...

 

[jmac70]

No problems yet. The season hasn’t started.

 

[Scodog10]

I thought the comments from BJ’s mate, Terry Wallace, were interesting on this topic last night. Don’t worry though nothing to see here Timmy told us so and we’ve got the coaches best mate on the job

 

[Quicky]

What were the comments?

 

[Scodog10]

What were the comments?

That we were the worst of the 6 teams in transition and kicked to contests far too often.

This is my take 36 odd hours removed. In a game specifically designed for transition, we struggled, but it’s not our strength anyway plus you don’t need to be good in all phases of the game to be good overall. That’s where the benefit of time comes in.

We need to be better than 2017, fact, but I’d be waiting before starting a thread on it myself. What I think would be an interesting exercise would be counting our possession chain lengths from the defensive third. It won’t be indicative only interesting, IMO.

 

[loki04]

I think part of our problem is we don't have forwards who absolutely demand the ball be kicked to them...cue videos of Lockett, Dunstall, Richardson, BT, Riewoldt x 2 et al... and then go ballistic when they are ignored. Our guys seem to go 'oh well, no problem, yeah kick it sideways again'... ironically the forward who is most demanding on the lead is our smallest player, Mr Blair.. kudos to him for at least trying to look like a gun forward...

Elliott and Faz both demand it when out there.

The issue is KPP who demand the footy and the functionality of all forwards to make space for one another. If only 2 fwds are dangerous then it makes the oppositions job a lot easier to double or even triple team the key targets.
Then once the ball hits the ground we have a focus on defending rather then having attacking crumbers that hit the contests front and square Buckley is obsessed with uncreative fwd defensive pressure types (even though they stunk it up in this area as well as limiting the creativity in fwd 50).

The balance of lead and mark types vs crumbers can also be off with Faz and Elliott games much more closer to a KPP then a small crumbing fwd, although both can occasionally crumb well it isn't a bread and butter skill to them.

Moore and Reid is where our hopes lie in terms of a genuine KPP threat to straighten us up, do they lead enough and with enough purpose. (moore if moved to def further weakens us fwd of center).

Also our zone comes into play when assessing work rate of fwds because how high up we press (both ways) when we transition out of def our fwds are usually way out of posiotion and have to firstly sprint back. Makes fast transitions get held up on a hbf or wing. This hold up then also allows the opposition to flood back and block all leading lanes further holding us up and often forcing kicks to congested areas.

 

[loki04]

You might be right, but way too early. Gone way too early.

I think why people are nervous is because of the previous 5 years and how we played very similar with similar flaws, the X game was just somewhat confirmation bias on our behalf I guess.
We are hoping for significant improvement and there were zero signs of any improvement in those areas even given the players available.

Hopefully the jlt with more of the best 22 out there can show some signs of improving ball movement, structure, tinkered zone placements, fwdline fuction and movement, kicking accuracy, ability of mids to spread into space.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Not that there is anything wrong with that.

We all know our LGBTIQ's like we used to know our ABCs. You may not know whether your Arthur or Martha, coming or going or just plain asexual anymore. But that's all fine - call yourself a Q and place yourself on hold for a while. Just got to sort out which toilet to use with all the choices out there now.

 

[Bard]

That we were the worst of the 6 teams in transition and kicked to contests far too often.

This is my take 36 odd hours removed. In a game specifically designed for transition, we struggled, but it’s not our strength anyway plus you don’t need to be good in all phases of the game to be good overall. That’s where the benefit of time comes in.

We need to be better than 2017, fact, but I’d be waiting before starting a thread on it myself. What I think would be an interesting exercise would be counting our possession chain lengths from the defensive third. It won’t be indicative only interesting, IMO.

It was concerning, not from a coaching perspective, but I think it showed a few players that just don’t have the mind for fast transition. Very few players that would normally be involved in such passages were out there though.

Would rather assess this after the first month of footy.

 

[noideaatall]

I have a theory on this but not the time or words to write a small thesis. A brief go at it:

Start with idealized memory of Leon Davis in 2011. Davis would receive or win the ball in the backline, wheel around in a big arc and deliver the ball lace out to a teammate. He made space for the team by the time he held the ball, drawing opposition players to him and the threat, given his disposal skills and experience, he could deliver the ball anywhere on the field 20 - 45m away from him. Teammates up-field could make futher space immediately knowing there was a high percentage chance the ball was coming there way when he took possession.

Over the past five years or so we have lacked pace and creative play out of the back line. Ball in hand we tend to run straight forward, limiting the time and making it easy for the opposition to corral the runner. Where we created time, ie. Langdon, the view was upfield, skills didn't allow an accurate kick to target in the congestion, and it was easy for the opposition to predict the ball movement. Alternatively we try the slow, safe switch sides approach with relatively little success.

We appear to have tried ways to get around our weakness, ie. the handball chains a couple of years ago. We lack the disposal skills and experience to make this work. If there is a 50% chance a disposal isn't going to work, a chain becomes increasingly unlikely the further you go. This explains why, at times, our ball movement can look good but we can't consistently reproduce it. The odd passage of play, the odd period of play, the rare quarter and the almost non-existent entire match we can look good but not the next wekk. Everything is possible, doesn't mean its likely or repeatable.

We have accentuated this problem by a defensive mindset, stacking and crowding our backline, high presses and recruiting competitive ball players rather than speed, disposal skills and creativity. And around it goes, because if winning possession in the backline has a low chance of decent ball coming into the forward line and high chance you will look stupid for not covering your opposition then you are not going to make space.

Solutions:
Players, players, players, to quote some random on this forum Having said that I don't see KPP forwards as the definitive issue. Deliver the ball decently and a forward line of Cox, Reid/Moore, Eliot and Fas has huge potential. If Blair could be miraculous grown by 8 inches, well, that would be more than fantastic.

Fix the backline: Moore might be a winner but we still need pace, disposal and decision making skills, that don't slow the play, there.

Tinker as in Loki4's post.

Put more emphasis on offensive play rather than trying to win by outworking, crowding or competitive ball focus.
My one cent