Travis Cloke

[TheProwler]

How do you know he'll say know. It's 800k more than Collingwood without the performance clause plus he gets an extra year (gives him stability till pretty much end of his career). What do you mean if he can't do it at Collingwood? His form isn't even that bad this year. He's taken 20 more marks than Jack. Leads the league in contested marks and has still kicked 35 goals. He's not a FF. He's a leading CHF. Then you look back to last year when he dominated. Gotta love how people think he's a dud. Probably need to watch some more Collingwood games.

Firstly I recall his old man being interviewed in his car only a few weeks ago when he said it was up to the pies and he
wanted Trav to stay o something along those lines. His old man is just doing what any manager should do and fry and get the best deal so No I don't reckon he so going anywhere unless the pies have had enough

Secondly I watched him on Saturday and kept a real eye on how he worked when the ball wasn't in his area and when it was in his area, can some it up in one word LAZY! If he is a Chf as you suggest then I have no idea why he plays deeper than Dawes? Maybe you need to watch some more mate?

 

[tigs2010]

Firstly I recall his old man being interviewed in his car only a few weeks ago when he said it was up to the pies and he
wanted Trav to stay o something along those lines. His old man is just doing what any manager should do and fry and get the best deal so No I don't reckon he so going anywhere unless the pies have had enough

Secondly I watched him on Saturday and kept a real eye on how he worked when the ball wasn't in his area and when it was in his area, can some it up in one word LAZY! If he is a Chf as you suggest then I have no idea why he plays deeper than Dawes? Maybe you need to watch some more mate?

I've watched him about 20 times live at the actual ground over the last 2 years. You realise Dawes has been playing parts in the ruck. Cloke pushes up and back. He was terrible on the weekend sooking to the umpires I'm not going to deny that but the guy can play. His best footy is played when he pushes up away from goal and takes his man with him. For some reason lately he's decided to wrestle just like Jack. It doesn't work.

 

[SunshineBoy]

Just on that highlighted part here is something for everyone to stew over:

B: Newman Rance Grimes
HB: Houli Chaplin Morris
C: Grigg Cotchin Deledio
HF: Martin Cloke Ellis
F: Edwards Riewoldt Vickery
R: Maric Conca Tuck
INT: Batchelor Dea Foley Nahas
EMG: Griffiths King Jackson

Might come across rather one eyed but if that was our starting lineup round 1 next year, we'd be fairly short odds for the top 8 and would be in with a real shot at going deep into September. Its about time we got a bit of arrogance and mongrel back and went about making this club the one that everyone wants to play for.

Shit we agree on this.......

 

[Boston tiger]

Just on that highlighted part here is something for everyone to stew over:

B: Newman Rance Grimes
HB: Houli Chaplin Morris
C: Grigg Cotchin Deledio
HF: Martin Cloke Ellis
F: Edwards Riewoldt Vickery
R: Maric Conca Tuck
INT: Batchelor Dea Foley Nahas
EMG: Griffiths King Jackson

Might come across rather one eyed but if that was our starting lineup round 1 next year, we'd be fairly short odds for the top 8 and would be in with a real shot at going deep into September. Its about time we got a bit of arrogance and mongrel back and went about making this club the one that everyone wants to play for.

Thanks for that.

 

[CoggaRules]

minimum - I wouldn't be shocked if the first 3 alone add $1m to the budget, good seasons, finals, etc, all three will be getting good offers from other clubs

what you need to understand dude is that these "other clubs" will have muppets like you saying the same about their brains trust going after "big fish" as you are about ours. You gotta understand that we are not the only club that has to play the balancing act when signing players on good $$$.
The thing is that at the end of the day it all comes down to the formula where you work out how much of a difference a top signing will make and if that difference covers the loss of one of your own, on the "assumption" that you lost one of your own. If that difference is in the +++ then you make the call. Its all about improving the fortunes of the club, it has nothing to do with being precious about who you "might" lose.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

what you need to understand dude is that these "other clubs" will have muppets like you saying the same about their brains trust going after "big fish" as you are about ours. You gotta understand that we are not the only club that has to play the balancing act when signing players on good $$$.
The thing is that at the end of the day it all comes down to the formula where you work out how much of a difference a top signing will make and if that difference covers the loss of one of your own, on the "assumption" that you lost one of your own. If that difference is in the +++ then you make the call. Its all about improving the fortunes of the club, it has nothing to do with being precious about who you "might" lose.

Do you seriously think Dusty will be content with $300-400k next contract if he continues to improve?

 

[MightyTiger]

Do you seriously think Dusty will be content with $300-400k next contract if he continues to improve?

He's already knocked back a contract more then double what we offered him, I think it would be fair to say that the majority of our top liners won't be commanding big big money for another 2-4 years, by that time comes around Clokes contract would more then likely be on the lighter side freeing up much needed cap space when the majority of our top liners start commanding more $.

 

[Bazzar]

One thing for sure is we need help up forward.

Loosing to the Tankers, they had an extra 14 scoring shots. Terrible night.

Losses to Collingwood and GC they had just one extra scoring shot

Losses to the Eagles and Cats, scoring shots equal.

We have out numbered in scoring shots every other team.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

He's already knocked back a contract more then double what we offered him, I think it would be fair to say that the majority of our top liners won't be commanding big big money for another 2-4 years, by that time comes around Clokes contract would more then likely be on the lighter side freeing up much needed cap space when the majority of our top liners start commanding more $.

Things change though. Remember Dusty changed management since that deal, and I believe he's now with Clokes guy

 

[MightyTiger]

Things change though. Remember Dusty changed management since that deal, and I believe he's now with Clokes guy

Things may have changed but it doesn't mean Martin is all of a sudden going to start demanding an extra 2-300k a year.

Put it this way, our list is positioned in such a way that our best players are yet to hit there prime, and are about 2-3 years away from doing so, and the likes of Grimes, Conca, Ellis etc, these guys will only get a slight upgrade in $ terms, maybe an extra 100k or so.

So what that leaves is a massive hole in our list in which for a certain time period we will have large amounts of cap space, it is a big reason why McGuane is on big $s even though he's a terrible footballer.

I'm no expert in contracts or what not, but if the club can structure the deal where it starts easing up in the last 2 years of his contract it will mean the likes of Cotchin, Martin, Riewoldt etc will have matured and hopefully improved to the point where they start demanding a larger slice of the pie.

Think of it a bit like what Collingwood did with the Luke Ball contract, something like 1M in his first year and then peanuts for his second.

If we could do something like, 2013 2M, 2014 2M, 2015 500k, and then 250k in his last 2 years.

 

[TheTigerArmy]

Just on that highlighted part here is something for everyone to stew over:

B: Newman Rance Grimes
HB: Houli Chaplin Morris
C: Grigg Cotchin Deledio
HF: Martin Cloke Ellis
F: Edwards Riewoldt Vickery
R: Maric Conca Tuck
INT: Batchelor Dea Foley Nahas
EMG: Griffiths King Jackson

Might come across rather one eyed but if that was our starting lineup round 1 next year, we'd be fairly short odds for the top 8 and would be in with a real shot at going deep into September. Its about time we got a bit of arrogance and mongrel back and went about making this club the one that everyone wants to play for.

Hell this side would take some beating would give us some real depth ..even the EMG are pretty handy...BRING It TIGES.. startin to reminds me of a 2001 Brisbane lions side we have a fab four too..

 

[Harmichael]

Things change though. Remember Dusty changed management since that deal, and I believe he's now with Clokes guy

He's with David Cloke?

 

[Bird Man]

could imagine how big round one could be if we snagged cloke

one can dream tho

 

[Ned_Flanders]

He's with David Cloke?

No the other guy, Cloke now has two managers.

Forget his name, but Pies fans hate him. Used to be a Blues board member, which is why they are calling shenanigans on the whole Trav negotiations.

Things may have changed but it doesn't mean Martin is all of a sudden going to start demanding an extra 2-300k a year.

Put it this way, our list is positioned in such a way that our best players are yet to hit there prime, and are about 2-3 years away from doing so, and the likes of Grimes, Conca, Ellis etc, these guys will only get a slight upgrade in $ terms, maybe an extra 100k or so.

So what that leaves is a massive hole in our list in which for a certain time period we will have large amounts of cap space, it is a big reason why McGuane is on big $s even though he's a terrible footballer.

I'm no expert in contracts or what not, but if the club can structure the deal where it starts easing up in the last 2 years of his contract it will mean the likes of Cotchin, Martin, Riewoldt etc will have matured and hopefully improved to the point where they start demanding a larger slice of the pie.

Think of it a bit like what Collingwood did with the Luke Ball contract, something like 1M in his first year and then peanuts for his second.

If we could do something like, 2013 2M, 2014 2M, 2015 500k, and then 250k in his last 2 years.

We had this flexibility for two reasons. Firstly we had a lot of underpaid duds, so to meet the minimum we needed to heavily front load some contracts. Secondly we had few players worth decent money. If you want to follow the Geelong model, they had next to no one on the mega bucks, they had lots of guys on decent, but not mega, contracts.

Right now we have Lids and probably no one else on over $500k. This will change soon, with Martin, Reiwoldt, Cotchin at a minimum easily needing this level. Tbh I reckon if we hold Cotch to $500-600k we have done very well, he is a gun, and is worth much more.

You talk about the players rejecting bigger offers, and this is right, but we can only discount by so much before the player starts looking elsewhere.

Add Travis's $900k (remember we have to make an offer the Pies refuse to match, and they are at $800k already), and suddenly that flexibility we had dries up. When Ellis, Conca, and so on start putting their hand up for $300-400 (assuming they develop as hoped) we will start to struggle, just as the Pies did.

This is the key reason I don't want Travis. I don't think he is worth $900k, especially if it means we risk losing one of the young kids we have spent a lot of time developing, and who unlike Trav actually gives a damn abut something other than a pay cheque.

 

[MightyTiger]

No the other guy, Cloke now has two managers.

Forget his name, but Pies fans hate him. Used to be a Blues board member, which is why they are calling shenanigans on the whole Trav negotiations.



We had this flexibility for two reasons. Firstly we had a lot of underpaid duds, so to meet the minimum we needed to heavily front load some contracts. Secondly we had few players worth decent money. If you want to follow the Geelong model, they had next to no one on the mega bucks, they had lots of guys on decent, but not mega, contracts.

Right now we have Lids and probably no one else on over $500k. This will change soon, with Martin, Reiwoldt, Cotchin at a minimum easily needing this level. Tbh I reckon if we hold Cotch to $500-600k we have done very well, he is a gun, and is worth much more.

You talk about the players rejecting bigger offers, and this is right, but we can only discount by so much before the player starts looking elsewhere.

Add Travis's $900k (remember we have to make an offer the Pies refuse to match, and they are at $800k already), and suddenly that flexibility we had dries up. When Ellis, Conca, and so on start putting their hand up for $300-400 (assuming they develop as hoped) we will start to struggle, just as the Pies did.

This is the key reason I don't want Travis. I don't think he is worth $900k, especially if it means we risk losing one of the young kids we have spent a lot of time developing, and who unlike Trav actually gives a damn abut something other than a pay cheque.

Did you even bother to read my post properly?

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Did you even bother to read my post properly?

yes, you seem to believe everyone will accept only minor increases, but given how little many of our guys are earning (most only on 1st or 2nd contract) this is unrealistic. Also the big holes you refer to (i.e. the McGuane loading) are drying up as our side matures and actually gets paid a decent amount.

 

[tigerwill]

He's with David Cloke?

Ralph Carr

 

[tigerfan1961]

Just on that highlighted part here is something for everyone to stew over:

B: Newman Rance Grimes
HB: Houli Chaplin Morris
C: Grigg Cotchin Deledio
HF: Martin Cloke Ellis
F: Edwards Riewoldt Vickery
R: Maric Conca Tuck
INT: Batchelor Dea Foley Nahas
EMG: Griffiths King Jackson

Might come across rather one eyed but if that was our starting lineup round 1 next year, we'd be fairly short odds for the top 8 and would be in with a real shot at going deep into September. Its about time we got a bit of arrogance and mongrel back and went about making this club the one that everyone wants to play for.

Yep, looks a solid side but to me, just Chaplin would do as he is what we lack the most- tall defender. It also shows that if we can develop Griff or Astbury into our big solid CHF, we will be looking good. No need to pay Cloke $700-900k IMO, which would destroy our salary cap structures completely.

Still need more mids as well for mine.

 

[MightyTiger]

yes, you seem to believe everyone will accept only minor increases, but given how little many of our guys are earning (most only on 1st or 2nd contract) this is unrealistic. Also the big holes you refer to (i.e. the McGuane loading) are drying up as our side matures and actually gets paid a decent amount.

Once again you didn't read it properly, the only way we could fit Cloke into our salary cap is because of the massive hole in our list from our top end players to our bottom 10-15 players.

We have Martin, Riewoldt and Cotchin who are 2-4 years away from there prime and truly commanding of contracts worth 500-600k a year, and when there next contract negotiations come up the only one who could make a case for a larger slice of the pie is Cotchin.

And as I already stated, the young ones such as Conca, Ellis, Batchelor, Griffiths etc, these guys will only receive slight upgrades, nothing in the vicinity as our top liners.

If Collingwood can sign up all of Thomas, Pendelbury, Swan, Sidebottom and Beams to big $s especially the first 3 then I see no reason why as to why we couldn't fit Cloke into our cap.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Once again you didn't read it properly, the only way we could fit Cloke into our salary cap is because of the massive hole in our list from our top end players to our bottom 10-15 players.

We have Martin, Riewoldt and Cotchin who are 2-4 years away from there prime and truly commanding of contracts worth 500-600k a year, and when there next contract negotiations come up the only one who could make a case for a larger slice of the pie is Cotchin.

And as I already stated, the young ones such as Conca, Ellis, Batchelor, Griffiths etc, these guys will only receive slight upgrades, nothing in the vicinity as our top liners.

If Collingwood can sign up all of Thomas, Pendelbury, Swan, Sidebottom and Beams to big $s especially the first 3 then I see no reason why as to why we couldn't fit Cloke into our cap.

This is where I disagree (not misunderstand) your premise. I think you are massively overestimating the hole in our cap.

In the past we had to front load contracts just to meet the minimum, but I think that time is past us now. A fair chunk of the kids we have are actually worth a decent pay rise (i.e. Grimes), where in the past many were fighting just to keep a contract (i.e. JON), resulting in some getting above the odds (i.e. McGuane).

Also add into this we have started poaching players with some talent (Grigg, Houli, Maric) rather than those looking for second chances (Thomson, Hislop). Where we would have gotten away paying SFA to the likes of Hislop, Maric/Houli/Grigg would all easily be above $300k IMO. This will be added to further this year, with us still needing another ruck, a CHB/CHF, and any number of mids.

As I say, I get where you are coming from, but I think you are underestimating how much the wages of our kids will start kicking in over the next 1-2 years.

 

["The Roar Is Back"]

Once again you didn't read it properly, the only way we could fit Cloke into our salary cap is because of the massive hole in our list from our top end players to our bottom 10-15 players.

We have Martin, Riewoldt and Cotchin who are 2-4 years away from there prime and truly commanding of contracts worth 500-600k a year, and when there next contract negotiations come up the only one who could make a case for a larger slice of the pie is Cotchin.

And as I already stated, the young ones such as Conca, Ellis, Batchelor, Griffiths etc, these guys will only receive slight upgrades, nothing in the vicinity as our top liners.

If Collingwood can sign up all of Thomas, Pendelbury, Swan, Sidebottom and Beams to big $s especially the first 3 then I see no reason why as to why we couldn't fit Cloke into our cap.

Cotchin, jack , Dusty , Batch , Grimes and Rance IIRC All come out of contract end of next season .
Hypothetically Cotchin by then could well be the best player in the game 2 X all Australian , Jack may well be a 3 time all Australian and Rance may also be all Australian all under 24 years of age . I think there worth may be more than some think .

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Cotchin, jack , Dusty , Batch , Grimes and Rance IIRC All come out of contract end of next season .
Hypothetically Cotchin by then could well be the best player in the game 2 X all Australian , Jack may well be a 3 time all Australian and Rance may also be all Australian all under 24 years of age . I think there worth may be more than some think .

Also worth remembering strong rumours were going around about WCE being very interested in Rance. I'd be expecting them to make a big play for him next year.

 

[Punt_Road_Roar]

And McGuire's response to that suggestion was predictable. ''That would be fantastic,'' he told SEN yesterday, with heavy irony. ''We could go back to the old days, when they had a crack at Collingwood, and it took them 30-odd years to recover from it.''


Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/cloke-saga-sparks-tiger-memories-20120726-22vev.html#ixzz21mgRMnUA​

Oh no !!! Eddie is trying some of his intimidation tactics to scare us off again ..... we better not piss Eddie off cant have his precious Collingwood lose its premiership hopes.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Oh no !!! Eddie is trying some of his intimidation tactics to scare us off again ..... we better not piss Eddie off cant have his precious Collingwood lose its premiership hopes.

He was funny on SEN yesterday. They asked him about this, and he said (paraphrased) "no no no, the Richmond President clearly told me in the interview that Richmond are not interested in Cloke". They then pointed out the interview was prior to talks being killed, and things had changed. His response was "no, March said they are not interested"

he's funny

 

[theflea]

The morning after the Whitten legends bash I nearly crashed my car when a bloke called SEN announcing Fev simply must VE picked up based on the previous nights form.
Sshhh.... I think some people think its real...

it really shows the inteligence of callers doesnt it!