Trent Cotchin - Disposal Efficiency

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#26
An issue?
Some pretty low percentages this year, including 29% on Fri night.
Love how he goes about it, but concerned he's not quite as 'silky' as we think?
Happy to be proven wrong....
so what!
He's in and under every week, putting his body on the line and getting better with each week.
For a guy who has still yet to have a proper pre-seasn he's ticking all the right boxes as far as I'm concerned.
The constant demand for perfection from some of the people around here is unbelievable.
 

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#27
Just gone back through the 23 posts and cant find the one your talking about? Who is putting Cotch down and who/where has it been said Tuck is better:confused:
Post #17 for a start....

It's been implied numerous times on this board...usually by you or the other two stooges (NQT & Rayzor ..the agenda-driven latter even going so far as to not give him votes in a game he was clearly BOG from either side because he "smiled and shook hands with players after a loss,while everyone else was gutted" thereby questioning his passion and commitment to the jumper..truly laughable about a player almost everyone agrees is a natural leader and future captain...and all that whilst falling over himself to throw votes & BOG's at Jackson in games where even most of his other supporters barely rated him )...invariably designed with the intent to make Tuck or Jackson look better or not as bad and to show that everyone's somehow being unfair to them whilst letting Cotchin "off the hook" I would also suggest that people saying his "disposal is a worry" is casting doubts on his development that really aren't there....(although I could be a smartarse and say as someone else did that he needs to get "the hell away from Tuck")

...even if his "efficiency" has been down, getting all hot and bothered because people are going easier on a 20 year-old with less than 50 games and no full pre-season under his belt than they are a 28 year-old 100 gamer and a 24 year-old in his 7th year on our list is ridiculous....and the fact that you immediately jumped on my post and got all defensive about it speaks volumes...
 
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#32
As stated, is having to lump around a tagger which is playing a part with efficiency. Similar to Judd.
Will get better as your midfield improves and tagging options are spread across other emerging players like Martin. Is also just a kid and his body will become bigger and harder.
Kid is going to be friggen star, sit back and enjoy his developement. Don't expect too much too soon. The worth of a player most times cannot be gauged by his supercoach score.
Top 10 player in the next 3 to 5 years.
Going to be a gun.
 

Bazzar

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#33
It's been implied numerous times on this board...usually by you or the other two stooges (NQT & Rayzor ..the agenda-driven latter even going so far as to not give him votes in a game he was clearly BOG from either side because he "smiled and shook hands with players after a loss,while everyone else was gutted" thereby questioning his passion and commitment to the jumper..truly laughable about a player almost everyone agrees is a natural leader and future captain...and all that whilst falling over himself to throw votes & BOG's at Jackson in games where even most of his other supporters barely rated him ).
What you need to do is go find where i have ever bagged Cotch or said he wasnt as good as Jackson or Tuck. Once i didnt give him votes when he waranted it, and i think he had coaches votes that game, and i think it was also the game you mentioned above. Im a massive wrap for Cotch and he is clearly our second best player and probably only one season of being our best.

Also Stooges.... lol
 

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#34
Post #17 for a start....

It's been implied numerous times on this board...usually by you or the other two stooges (NQT & Rayzor ..the agenda-driven latter even going so far as to not give him votes in a game he was clearly BOG from either side because he "smiled and shook hands with players after a loss,while everyone else was gutted" thereby questioning his passion and commitment to the jumper..truly laughable about a player almost everyone agrees is a natural leader and future captain...and all that whilst falling over himself to throw votes & BOG's at Jackson in games where even most of his other supporters barely rated him )...invariably designed with the intent to make Tuck or Jackson look better or not as bad and to show that everyone's somehow being unfair to them whilst letting Cotchin "off the hook" I would also suggest that people saying his "disposal is a worry" is casting doubts on his development that really aren't there....(although I could be a smartarse and say as someone else did that he needs to get "the hell away from Tuck")



...even if his "efficiency" has been down, getting all hot and bothered because people are going easier on a 20 year-old with less than 50 games and no full pre-season under his belt than they are a 28 year-old 100 gamer and a 24 year-old in his 7th year on our list is ridiculous....and the fact that you immediately jumped on my post and got all defensive about it speaks volumes...
Well larry read my post i didnt give him the bog because he wasnt in my opinion........and as i have said in the past opinions are like arseholes and you are one and i have one!!!
 

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#35
With two metres of space is the best decision maker and disposer in our side , problem is at the moment he ain't getting that two metres, like it or not he is the heir apparent to Newwy and pretty much unofficially already is our captain !!
 

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#36
With two metres of space is the best decision maker and disposer in our side , problem is at the moment he ain't getting that two metres, like it or not he is the heir apparent to Newwy and pretty much unofficially already is our captain !!
I think the bloke wearing no.3 has Cotch covered there. Lids hits targets lace out over 50m+, Cotch is silk in the 30-45m range, but Lids does that too. It's Cotch's ability to find space in traffic, and to win the contested ball (rarely loses his feet) that really stands out. He will become increasingly untackleable (new word?) over the next two years, Ablett Jnr style.

I agree with the sentiment that Tuck's tendencies to hack the ball forward aren't limited to when he is in the middle of a pack, he often does it when he has space also. Cotch's awareness and decision making are far superior. He's currently playing a different role with Foley and Jackson out, and being tagged, thus his opportunities in space have dried up of recent.
 

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1980

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#37
Christ, only at Richmond would we have supporters running down a sheer talent like Cotchin in order to put some mediocre plodder with questionable skills in a more favourable light....I think having a player of Cotchin's ability wearing the yellow and black must be some kind of culture shock for some people used to spending year after year gallantly defending mediocrity and they don't quite know how to handle seeing a bonafide superstar in our colours...
Only at Richmond would we hero worship a player before he has even played a full season.

Supporters suffering from premature ejaculation is the curse of this club. Save your adulation for when the lad is winning us finals games.

Until then, Cotchin has talent, ability and loads of potential, and so did Mark Merenda.
 

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#38
I think the bloke wearing no.3 has Cotch covered there. Lids hits targets lace out over 50m+, Cotch is silk in the 30-45m range, but Lids does that too. It's Cotch's ability to find space in traffic, and to win the contested ball (rarely loses his feet) that really stands out. He will become increasingly untackleable (new word?) over the next two years, Ablett Jnr style.

I agree with the sentiment that Tuck's tendencies to hack the ball forward aren't limited to when he is in the middle of a pack, he often does it when he has space also. Cotch's awareness and decision making are far superior. He's currently playing a different role with Foley and Jackson out, and being tagged, thus his opportunities in space have dried up of recent.
Don't disagree lids is probably a longer kick but I think Cotch is better under 50 by both hand and foot and his decision making has Lids well covered , mind you not to worried , I think it's an arguement over two very disposers of the aggot , who have the skills I wish all our side had !!
 

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#39
Don't disagree lids is probably a longer kick but I think Cotch is better under 50 by both hand and foot and his decision making has Lids well covered , mind you not to worried , I think it's an arguement over two very disposers of the aggot , who have the skills I wish all our side had !!
Been a while since we could argue over who is the most elite user of the ball :thumbsu:
 

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#40
It's been implied numerous times on this board...usually by you or the other two stooges (NQT & Rayzor ..the agenda-driven latter even going so far as to not give him votes in a game he was clearly BOG from either side because he "smiled and shook hands with players after a loss,while everyone else was gutted" thereby questioning his passion and commitment to the jumper..truly laughable about a player almost everyone agrees is a natural leader and future captain...and all that whilst falling over himself to throw votes & BOG's at Jackson in games where even most of his other supporters barely rated him )...invariably designed with the intent to make Tuck or Jackson look better or not as bad and to show that everyone's somehow being unfair to them whilst letting Cotchin "off the hook" I would also suggest that people saying his "disposal is a worry" is casting doubts on his development that really aren't there....(although I could be a smartarse and say as someone else did that he needs to get "the hell away from Tuck")

...even if his "efficiency" has been down, getting all hot and bothered because people are going easier on a 20 year-old with less than 50 games and no full pre-season under his belt than they are a 28 year-old 100 gamer and a 24 year-old in his 7th year on our list is ridiculous....

If Cotchin was a blue collar draftee rather than the designated messiah, I'd be the one pointing out how exceptional his clearance work had been, while some clown like you would be howling about how he'll never make it because his kicking lets him down too often and had hurt us to the tune of half a dozen goals a game (as it has several times this year).

And ptf would be claiming that no other midfielders in the comp other than Cotchin, Tuck and Jackson just bang the ball on the boot to get it forward, and that we really need to do better by getting better ball users like Thomson into the midfield.

I rate them all fairly on what they do from game to game and season to season, not on isolated possessions where the other 25+ get ignored, reputations, or mass perception.

With Jackson and Tuck comfortably inside our top-10 players this year due to the qualities I've always rated them for, it's your ability to judge a player that's taking a beating, not mine.

Really makes you want to rant endlessly with asides in brackets that go on so long you can't even manage to pick up the original sentence again, and howl at the moon in your best 80's glam rocker voice, doesn't it? :p
 

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#41
If Cotchin was a blue collar draftee rather than the designated messiah, I'd be the one pointing out how exceptional his clearance work had been, while some clown like you would be howling about how he'll never make it because his kicking lets him down too often and had hurt us to the tune of half a dozen goals a game (as it has several times this year).

And ptf would be claiming that no other midfielders in the comp other than Cotchin, Tuck and Jackson just bang the ball on the boot to get it forward, and that we really need to do better by getting better ball users like Thomson into the midfield.

I rate them all fairly on what they do from game to game and season to season, not on isolated possessions where the other 25+ get ignored, reputations, or mass perception.

With Jackson and Tuck comfortably inside our top-10 players this year due to the qualities I've always rated them for, it's your ability to judge a player that's taking a beating, not mine.

Really makes you want to rant endlessly with asides in brackets that go on so long you can't even manage to pick up the original sentence again, and howl at the moon in your best 80's glam rocker voice, doesn't it? :p
So Cotchins kicking has cost half a dozen goals per game , has it Rayzor ?
Oh and is this finally an admission that you purely base your opinion of players based on their reputation and or draft pick and significantly mark harder those with a good rep and easier those without one ?
' If Cotchin was a blue collar draftee rather than the designated messiah, I'd be the one pointing out how exceptional his clearance work had been '
Concentrate on thinking for yourself rather than trying to convince others of your deluded views and assuming their thoughts !!
 

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#42
Watched a replay of the game yesterday. How he got rated at 29% efficiency is beyond me. As far as I'm concerned he was okay, probably 50% efficiency but I assume the kicks he made out of heavy traffic that went to pure 50/50 contests all were counted on the inefficient side, which isn't right imo. And he also had at least 3 kicks that were smothered which doesn't help the percentage, but they were not turnovers.

Overall Clint Jones absolutely kills him from late in the first quarter onwards, which is nothing for him to be embarrassed about, he isn't the first and won't be the last.

Watch the game properly, Rayzor, and stop sprouting crap like Cotch gives up 6 goals a game unless you can back it up and tell us the games where that has happened. You're entitled to have a different opinion but don't start trolling, please.
 

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#43
So Cotchins kicking has cost half a dozen goals per game , has it Rayzor ?
In 2-3 games, yes, quite clearly it has. At the same time, his work at the stoppages has typically helped create a similar amount of scoring opportunities in those games, if not more, which is an argument I've often put forward for our older mids. Some games where he's kicked reasonably well he's been 5-6 goals ahead. He's had an outstanding season and I've never said otherwise, but his ball use has seldom been a contributing factor to his value in games this year.

Oh and is this finally an admission that you purely base your opinion of players based on their reputation and or draft pick and significantly mark harder those with a good rep and easier those without one ?
Why do you so often draw the exact opposite conclusion to what has been written very clearly?

That's a rhetorical question.

...trying to convince others of your deluded views...
Deluded like me maintaining that Jackson and Tuck are integral parts of our current team? Hardwick and the coaching staff are deluded too?

Or actually deluded, like you claiming Thomson deserves games ahead of Tuck and Jackson and performed well in his games this year, or that the mids from the best teams never just bang the ball forwards from tight contests and let their superior half-forwards do the rest?


Watch the game properly, Rayzor, and stop sprouting crap like Cotch gives up 6 goals a game unless you can back it up and tell us the games where that has happened.
I've done so in my comments following those games. The Adelaide game comes to mind where he missed a crucial easy shot and turned the ball over by foot repeatedly in situations which hurt us on the scoreboard. At the same time, other aspects of his game mitigated his poor kicking - as I've said consistently about his performances this year. There has been a couple of other games and if you're so interested in the topic, you know how to use the search function - I'm not going to waste my time when you're clearly determined to be rude.

...don't start trolling, please.
My definition of trolling would be Mario's diatribe above (which is the only reason I've commented at all), or ptf still insisting (as he has repeatedly for the last 6 months) I'm delusional despite the fact everything I've said this year on the subject of our midfield has been proven correct (while his own views have been laughably off the mark as often as not), or you going out of your way to be insulting based largely on your perceptions of a game I've made no comment whatsoever on (the Saints game)...but hey, you're the one with an impeccable sense of what is appropriate and fair, so by all means, label me the 'troll.' :D
 

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#45
Once again Rayzor, trying to make up stories to suit yourself...
Really, made all the text quoted below up did I ptf? Stole your username and argued with myself did I? :D

...we play our best with Thompson [sic]...in the centre square and by a fair bit !!

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showpost.php?p=17333208&postcount=29
The difference is Thompsons [sic] first reaction is to handball to someone in space Tuck and Jackson bang it on the boot

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showpost.php?p=17212801&postcount=103
Originally Posted by Rayzorwire


As for Jackson and Tuck banging it on the boot, every mid in the league does it in tight traffic.
20 years ago when Mark Jackson and Micheal Tuck where playing yes , in this era no !!

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showpost.php?p=17216332&postcount=114
Nobody does it in this era...except Tuck, Jackson and...oops...Cotchin! :D


who has spent endless hours upon this board posting unnecessary , extended essays trying to defame certain players at the club !!
Defamed Cotchin by saying repeatedly that he's had "an outstanding season"...or defamed Thomson by insisting he's a VFL player?

Which statement amounts to 'defamation' ptf? :D

If you can't post decent content without the snipes don't post...
...you have absolutely no idea about football and you are nothing short of a dead shit, trolling clown ... this board doesn't need arsewipes like you...

Indeed.

What this board needs is polite gun football analysts with outstanding memory capacity like you ptf.
 

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#46
Silly comment.

The kid is 18 and has spoken in the media maybe 4-5 times.

You have no idea what his internal persona is like...
And you do? Have you considered WHY he hasn't ever captained a team, why he doesn't speak to the media? Why that when Hardwick was listing the young players with leadership qualities from our most recent draft (He named Astbury, Griffiths, Dea) he didn't name Martin? Why throughout the U18s he was never really listed as a leader?

There's nothing wrong with not being a captain.
 

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#47
And you do? Have you considered WHY he hasn't ever captained a team, why he doesn't speak to the media? Why that when Hardwick was listing the young players with leadership qualities from our most recent draft (He named Astbury, Griffiths, Dea) he didn't name Martin? Why throughout the U18s he was never really listed as a leader?

There's nothing wrong with not being a captain.
Our last captain Kane Johnson was not the best player on our list but he was a good leader. dispite his poor form towards the end of his career he was a really good leader and captain for us.
 

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#48
Really, made all the text quoted below up did I ptf? Stole your username and argued with myself did I? :D







Nobody does it in this era...except Tuck, Jackson and...oops...Cotchin! :D




Defamed Cotchin by saying repeatedly that he's had "an outstanding season"...or defamed Thomson by insisting he's a VFL player?

Which statement amounts to 'defamation' ptf? :D





Indeed.

What this board needs is polite gun football analysts with outstanding memory capacity like you ptf.
Opinions which were all time relative which I have no shame in admitting to or standing by, no long winded fabricated fictional crap like that which dribbles from you , keep up the cheap shots at Cotch, you'll be reminded !!

This comment alone sums you right up " If Cotchin was a blue collar draftee rather than the designated messiah, I'd be the one pointing out how exceptional his clearance work had been "
Its commonly called tall poppy syndrome , but you've taken it to a new extreme level by fabricating and blatantly lying about factual information constantly !!
 

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#49
...fabricated fictional crap like that which dribbles from you , keep up the cheap shots at Cotch, you'll be reminded !!
I haven't "fabricated" anything, I've directly quoted you ya dopey bugger - with links to those direct quotes. It's like you use these words with zero comprehension of what they actually mean.

The only "fabricated fictional crap" in this discussion is your incessant claims that me saying Cotchin has had an "outstanding year" but hasn't kicked well at all well on occasion, amounts to me taking "cheap shots" at him. :rolleyes:

Saying a player has exceptional clearance ability is not insulting them, or at least isn't among people with normal adult comprehension skills.
 

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#50
I haven't "fabricated" anything, I've directly quoted you ya dopey bugger - with links to those direct quotes. It's like you use these words with zero comprehension of what they actually mean.

The only "fabricated fictional crap" in this discussion is your incessant claims that me saying Cotchin has had an "outstanding year" but hasn't kicked well at all well on occasion, amounts to me taking "cheap shots" at him. :rolleyes:

Saying a player has exceptional clearance ability is not insulting them, or at least isn't among people with normal adult comprehension skills.
You've fabricated plenty Rayzor , don't try taking the moral high ground now, only yesterdy you posted that ' he costed us 6 goals per game ' or words to that affect, and you've also made up plenty of other lies over the past 6 months including who have been his opponents all fabricated lies !!
 
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