Two Things

[Stigmata]

In footy teams can roughly be broken into two categories.

Have the players but for some reason don't win games or don't have the players and need to rebuild

If you have the players and are not winning games it could be because you dont have a good system. Not fit enough, Not hungry enough. Internal issues at the club. Coach injuries.

Personally I dont think we have the players.


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[Tiger Toffee]

In footy teams can roughly be broken into two categories.

Have the players but for some reason don't win games or don't have the players and need to rebuild

If you have the players and are not winning games it could be because you dont have a good system. Not fit enough, Not hungry enough. Internal issues at the club. Coach injuries.

Personally I dont think we have the players.


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We have the players, they have proven it, shit teams and lists don't win 9 in a row, it's the players brains holding them back, it seems to me they are easily rattled, easily pushed aside, easily affected by past games, in all 3 losses they have let themselves be bullied, it's time for the players to bully back.

 

[Stigmata]

We have the players, they have proven it, shit teams and lists don't win 9 in a row, it's the players brains holding them back, it seems to me they are easily rattled, easily pushed aside, easily affected by past games, in all 3 losses they have let themselves be bullied, it's time for the players to bully back.

Our guys played above themselves last year


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[TigerImposter]

An interesting point was made in another Tiger forum today which I hadn't heard since the country footy days in the EGFL
If you're losing games by ten goals plus then it's the players or the list is not up to scratch
If you're losing games by 20 points or less then its the coach
In between then you just need to tweak the list and staff

 

[partycorolla]

Our guys played above themselves last year


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Well not really.... they started 3-10, that's well below what they did in 2013 and below the standard of 2012.... They played well for 9 weeks and for patches in the weeks before.....

It's a combination of lack of depth, lack of confidence, seeming lack of faith in our youth/over-reliance on our oldest players by the coach and match committee, lack of new ideas from our assistants and with our game plan....

 

[partycorolla]

An interesting point was made in another Tiger forum today which I hadn't heard since the country footy days in the EGFL
If you're losing games by ten goals plus then it's the players or the list is not up to scratch
If you're losing games by 20 points or less then its the coach
In between then you just need to tweak the list and staff

It also depends on which way those games/team has been travelling. If you are a Saints/Melb/Doggies from the last few years, losing games by 10 goals and then you start losing them by 20 points, it's a sign of improvement however if you are RFC right now, it's an issue. I wouldn't sack DH at this point in time but I'd be doing my research behind closed doors and coming up with a short list.... of both coaches and players...

 

[TigerImposter]

It also depends on which way those games/team has been travelling. If you are a Saints/Melb/Doggies from the last few years, losing games by 10 goals and then you start losing them by 20 points, it's a sign of improvement however if you are RFC right now, it's an issue. I wouldn't sack DH at this point in time but I'd be doing my research behind closed doors and coming up with a short list.... of both coaches and players...

Not really that as we were belting Bulldogs and Dees two years ago and now we are dropping them
I agree with your point though, but we've failed to improve at a faster rate than our competitors
So much that we've gone backwards
Warning signs were there , but making the finals may have been DH and teams biggest nemesis as it lured them in a false sense of where our list was at
So they spent all Summer getting the players to tell us how wonderful they were and also not trading hard for a gun or for young kds like Miles in the trade period
Young Saad for Coburg was Rookied by GCS for crying out loud and was elevated and has been terrific. Could have been a great lock down small defender but with dash and flare
Instead we wasted our time chasing Trengrove etc

 

[wart101]

An interesting point was made in another Tiger forum today which I hadn't heard since the country footy days in the EGFL
If you're losing games by ten goals plus then it's the players or the list is not up to scratch
If you're losing games by 20 points or less then its the coach
In between then you just need to tweak the list and staff

it would be good if it was that simple.

 

[partycorolla]

Not really that as we were belting Bulldogs and Dees two years ago and now we are dropping them
I agree with your point though, but we've failed to improve at a faster rate than our competitors
So much that we've gone backwards
Warning signs were there , but making the finals may have been DH and teams biggest nemesis as it lured them in a false sense of where our list was at
So they spent all Summer getting the players to tell us how wonderful they were and also not trading hard for a gun or for young kds like Miles in the trade period
Young Saad for Coburg was Rookied by GCS for crying out loud and was elevated and has been terrific. Could have been a great lock down small defender but with dash and flare
Instead we wasted our time chasing Trengrove etc

Not the point I was making. If we were Doggies, Saints or Dees supporters the 20 point losses would be a sign of improvement from where they have come from, like our narrow losses in 2011/12. For us now, these 20 point losses are a sign of stagnation or going backwards....

 

[TigerImposter]

We

it would be good if it was that simple.

We all know this wart but sometimes it's the simple things that work , but we seem to be doing the same things according to the inverted parabola

 

[TigerImposter]

Not the point I was making. If we were Doggies, Saints or Dees supporters the 20 point losses would be a sign of improvement from where they have come from, like our narrow losses in 2011/12. For us now, these 20 point losses are a sign of stagnation or going backwards....

Agree and I got your point so according to you it should be bye bye DH

 

[Bojangles17]

An interesting point was made in another Tiger forum today which I hadn't heard since the country footy days in the EGFL
If you're losing games by ten goals plus then it's the players or the list is not up to scratch
If you're losing games by 20 points or less then its the coach
In between then you just need to tweak the list and staff

It's a good point, a teams percentage is generally a barometer for its competitiveness , I think we tick the box there , just cannot muster a decent offensive part to the game which I believe reflects on the coaching panel

 

[wart101]

It's a good point, a teams percentage is generally a barometer for its competitiveness , I think we tick the box there , just cannot muster a decent offensive part to the game which I believe reflects on the coaching panel

Forward coaching is shot and has been for two years now.

 

[TheProwler]

Our guys played above themselves last year


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Impossible, just hate that saying.

What they did however was play as a team, from boot studder to senior coach. This year they are back to the first half of 2014.

Something is happening inside the four walls at that place. Players getting over coached and confused, scared, afraid of making an error? Who knows but their heads aren't in the right place. At 3&10 last year finals were all but out of the question, they relaxed, took the game on, played instinctively, played to each other's strengths. Got to the finals and the pressure and expectation returned, the rest is history and it's being repeated again each week.

Some mental demons inside that club, we will achieve nothing until that's fixed!

 

[Lsta062]

We have the players, they have proven it, shit teams and lists don't win 9 in a row, it's the players brains holding them back, it seems to me they are easily rattled, easily pushed aside, easily affected by past games, in all 3 losses they have let themselves be bullied, it's time for the players to bully back.

I definitely think they have confidence problems. In fact, that may be their biggest problem. You see that many times in their forward 50s. They keep passing to each other with no one stepping up to kick the goal. Of course, it turns into a turn over eventually

 

[wart101]

We

We all know this wart but sometimes it's the simple things that work , but we seem to be doing the same things according to the inverted parabola

Can you tell me who would be a suitable replacement for DH?

 

[_DBF_]

Can you tell me who would be a suitable replacement for DH?

Matthew Knights.

Tiger Boy, Attacking Gameplan, Proven to develop kids.

Arguments for Nathan Bassett.

 

[wart101]

Matthew Knights.

Tiger Boy, Attacking Gameplan, Proven to develop kids.

Arguments for Nathan Bassett.

I'm aware of both of them but i'm not convinced they are better than DH

Any others?

 

[57Tig]

We have the players, they have proven it, shit teams and lists don't win 9 in a row, it's the players brains holding them back, it seems to me they are easily rattled, easily pushed aside, easily affected by past games, in all 3 losses they have let themselves be bullied, it's time for the players to bully back.

Have just finished watching this match and tend to agree. The doogies match we lost and to a degree the deamons. Poor kicking on goal does not give score board pressure to help win games. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Rance should of gone to hawkins from the start but look at atsbury form early last year and It was the right start. I still think our depth has improved but needs to improve even moore. Our percentage is okay at this stage even allowing for the sides we play. Also after watching the match I think Our attack on the ball and quick movement was the best for the year. the cats were very lucky with a few of their goals, the way our defense has been in the past they would have cleared the ball out of defense most times with 3 of the goals the cats got in the first 2 qrt..
On another post I mentioned vickery poor possession numb compared with griff. Still stand by that but watching the match did put in a good effort and would now like to see him work with griff in the side. Loved the first game by corey and hope he can build from there. 1 game from top 4 its not that bad but do say we need to really lift every week and think we can. if we get Delideo back and Conca soon we will a lot more matches yes we will loose some as well

 

[wart101]

Have just finished watching this match and tend to agree. The doogies match we lost and to a degree the deamons. Poor kicking on goal does not give score board pressure to help win games. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Rance should of gone to hawkins from the start but look at atsbury form early last year and It was the right start. I still think our depth has improved but needs to improve even moore. Our percentage is okay at this stage even allowing for the sides we play. Also after watching the match I think Our attack on the ball and quick movement was the best for the year. the cats were very lucky with a few of their goals, the way our defense has been in the past they would have cleared the ball out of defense most times with 3 of the goals the cats got in the first 2 qrt..
On another post I mentioned vickery poor possession numb compared with griff. Still stand by that but watching the match did put in a good effort and would now like to see him work with griff in the side. Loved the first game by corey and hope he can build from there. 1 game from top 4 its not that bad but do say we need to really lift every week and think we can. if we get Delideo back and Conca soon we will a lot more matches yes we will loose some as well

There was a lot of "just yeah!" About the game.....

How were you able to watch it again though, i haven't watched any opposition games i am that frustrated.

 

[TigerImposter]

Can you tell me who would be a suitable replacement for DH?

Anyone with a plan B
Peter German could do a better job , but I would like him for vfl ream
Bassett knights Collins are all better prospects
SKH KAC SRL are my wish list but they wouldn't bother with us bc they're probably satisfied with their lists, but SRL does love a dollar
It's not what I would like as I don't get to pick the coach, but its more who I wouldn't like
To me it's safe to say for DH its "when " not "wont" the costs to the club are just too great
He even managed to mess up the last centre bounce as Scott threw two extra players in defence so super coach leaves them alone
We win the clearance kick it to an undermanned fwd line and they mark it and ice the clock and clear
Then throw in is pre planning with astbury on Hawkins and stubborbess to make an early call and Harry Taylor having a ball by himself
It's stuff you learn as an assistant and we've got him as head coach
Surely Gale is awake to him as I watched the game on TV and could see the these flaws
I wouldn't let this guy be at an Auskick clinic but we're paying his wages to coach the rfc
PMSL

 

[57Tig]

There was a lot of "just yeah!" About the game.....

How were you able to watch it again though, i haven't watched any opposition games i am that frustrated.

Not sure how you mean you haven't watched games as in is it you just cannot from frustration or you can not get the game. I watch thru bigpond afl site. I am a person who likes to watch and find out why. I have commented this time only after watching once usually will watch 2-3 times especially focusing on comments on this sight. After watching the matches and looking and specifics from comments there is a number of people who comment with no idea and are half baked with their comments. I wont make the prediction of making the 8 but watching the replays and as we get back to full strength side i think we can turn this around and win more games than last year.

 

[57Tig]

Anyone with a plan B
Peter German could do a better job , but I would like him for vfl ream
Bassett knights Collins are all better prospects
SKH KAC SRL are my wish list but they wouldn't bother with us bc they're probably satisfied with their lists, but SRL does love a dollar
It's not what I would like as I don't get to pick the coach, but its more who I wouldn't like
To me it's safe to say for DH its "when " not "wont" the costs to the club are just too great
He even managed to mess up the last centre bounce as Scott threw two extra players in defence so super coach leaves them alone
We win the clearance kick it to an undermanned fwd line and they mark it and ice the clock and clear
Then throw in is pre planning with astbury on Hawkins and stubborbess to make an early call and Harry Taylor having a ball by himself
It's stuff you learn as an assistant and we've got him as head coach
Surely Gale is awake to him as I watched the game on TV and could see the these flaws
I wouldn't let this guy be at an Auskick clinic but we're paying his wages to coach the rfc
PMSL

Its great being a back seat coach isnt it. Last year astbury beat hawkins. and 1 of the goals hawkins got was thru a rance mistake. As for the last centre bounce that is the leadership group and players fault. Tell me how the communication from the coaches box could have got tothe players to do what they should have known what to do. I am not on the Hardwick ban wagon but please critise the right people for the wrong things. It want the geelong coach who made the decision to drop back it was the players with years of experience.

 

[TigerImposter]

Its great being a back seat coach isnt it. Last year astbury beat hawkins. and 1 of the goals hawkins got was thru a rance mistake. As for the last centre bounce that is the leadership group and players fault. Tell me how the communication from the coaches box could have got tothe players to do what they should have known what to do. I am not on the Hardwick ban wagon but please critise the right people for the wrong things. It want the geelong coach who made the decision to drop back it was the players with years of experience.

So it's not the coaches job after five years to have this drilled in the players
If two go back then two pick them up etc etc
Yes again no leadership in coach means no leaders on the ground
We are a poorly drilled side and the buck stops with the coach.
Joel Selwood dictated the last quarter he had been Griggs scalp all day. So DH takes him off him
It was the day where DH demonstrated he's not fit to coach anymore. He's now at his lowest point and needs to be moved on
Astbury beat Hawkins when fe was at his peak fitness and games under his belt. Rance takes the best defender after all he was all Australian champion back last year. It's a calamity mate

 

[wart101]

Anyone with a plan B
Peter German could do a better job , but I would like him for vfl ream
Bassett knights Collins are all better prospects
SKH KAC SRL are my wish list but they wouldn't bother with us bc they're probably satisfied with their lists, but SRL does love a dollar
It's not what I would like as I don't get to pick the coach, but its more who I wouldn't like
To me it's safe to say for DH its "when " not "wont" the costs to the club are just too great
He even managed to mess up the last centre bounce as Scott threw two extra players in defence so super coach leaves them alone
We win the clearance kick it to an undermanned fwd line and they mark it and ice the clock and clear
Then throw in is pre planning with astbury on Hawkins and stubborbess to make an early call and Harry Taylor having a ball by himself
It's stuff you learn as an assistant and we've got him as head coach
Surely Gale is awake to him as I watched the game on TV and could see the these flaws
I wouldn't let this guy be at an Auskick clinic but we're paying his wages to coach the rfc
PMSL

Acronyms man? You could be talking about a can of beans for all i know.

knights is shit IMO.
basset untried at AFL level but i am interested.
Collins is an interesting prospect.

the coaching pool is empty at the moment.

if we could get paul roos at the end of his melbourne gig I'd go for that.