Two Up

[HARKER]

I'll stop you there and suggest nobody really thinks they are 100% pure. There is no doubt a fair bit of self interest going on. But most of us seem to be able to take the good with the bad. We welcome debate and accept shades of grey. The facts that they are not 100% pure of intent does not mean everything about them is to be dismissed.

My starting point (before the standard C.T. terms started loosely being bandied about) wasn't to say that you shouldn't immunize but it serves a purpose to inform yourself a little more than to allow your G.P. to put what they want into your system or your child's system for that matter.

I think most people would agree in principle, to that notion.....I think.....but I may be wrong.

 

[Long Live HFC]

So you're saying I'm a C.T. That's it?

sorry if you were expecting more? but i'll take that as an admittance I was on the money.

"I am extremely well-versed in people like you"

well I am? I took your language, style & topic of comment and extrapolated that to a bunch of completely unrelated topics that you also subscribe to, as well as your level of education. not terrible work for a handful of forum posts

 

[kickazz]

My starting point (before the standard C.T. terms started loosely being bandied about) wasn't to say that you shouldn't immunize but it serves a purpose to inform yourself a little more than to allow your G.P. to put what they want into your system or your child's system for that matter.

I think most people would agree in principle, to that notion.....I think.....but I may be wrong.

That's pretty much right. Those who are strongly pro-vaccination perhaps are a bit scared that the anti-vacc side has means of influence/persuasion that is so powerful that it can more than compensate for any lack of factual or scientific basis their assertions may have. To me, that would explain why perhaps some GPs take the more "I am an expert listen to me" prescriptive approach.

And as I saw (forget his name) on TV a pro-vaccination professor said that if GPs truly believe that science and the facts are on their side, then they should be able to convince people better, and that as tiresome they may feel it is, it is their duty to argue the case rather that ask for mandation.

 

[HARKER]

sorry if you were expecting more? but i'll take that as an admittance I was on the money.

well I am? I took your language, style & topic of comment and extrapolated that to a bunch of completely unrelated topics that you also subscribe to, as well as your level of education. not terrible work for a handful of forum posts

You're an intelligent individual...............I used to be an intelligent individual................not nearly as smart as I used to be, unfortunately.
You're right about my level of education..............................but I did skip grades and was dux twice.
Went to High School at age 10 and was still smarter than most, if not all kids two years older than me. Results reflected that.
Being 'uneducated' as you like to put it does have its advantages and I've put many an 'educated' person back in their place many a time......but I digress.

Back on topic and clearly dealing with an intelligent man (?)
Should people inform themselves about what they put into their bodies or not?

i.e.
I asked my GP whether my mum should be vaccinated against the flu. He said that there is no need.
I asked a GP why he prescribes one medication over another. He told me that the perks were better.
I asked my GP about fluoride and he told me to avoid it. Too many unknowns.
I told my GP how much I drink and he had me do blood tests. He told me I drink too much and should slow down

Moral to the story: Ask your GP and maybe you may just find one that will tell you the truth as best an "expert" can.

 

[Long Live HFC]

You're an intelligent individual...............I used to be an intelligent individual................not nearly as smart as I used to be, unfortunately.
You're right about my level of education..............................but I did skip grades and was dux twice.
Went to High School at age 10 and was still smarter than most, if not all kids the same age as me. Results reflected that.
Being 'uneducated' as you like to put it does have its advantages and I've put many an 'educated' person back in their place many a time......but I digress.

education isn't necessarily required. some people are just naturally brilliant and insightful. sadly, too many people just assume they're that brilliant. this is where education can help.

Should people inform themselves about what they put into their bodies or not?

certainly. I have no issues with that whatsoever. having said that though, they need to understand the context. people complain about, say, fluoridation of water without appreciating that the dose makes the poison. just about anything is "toxic" if you are exposed to too much of it. likewise, plenty of substances are perfectly safe at lesser levels of exposure. a chemist knows this, but a layman may not.

i.e.
I asked my GP whether my mum should be vaccinated against the flu. He said that there is no need.
I asked a GP why he prescribes one medication over another. He told me that the perks were better.
I asked my GP about fluoride and he told me to avoid it. Too many unknowns.
I told my GP how much I drink and he had me do blood tests. He told me I drink too much and should slow down

Moral to the story: Ask your GP and maybe you may just find one that will tell you the truth as best an "expert" can.

well, I don't need to ask these questions because I already know the answers. however when I have specific queries, I ask my sister (the GP). she always tells me the truth.

 

[HARKER]

well, I don't need to ask these questions because I already know the answers. however when I have specific queries, I ask my sister (the GP). she always tells me the truth.

Is she good? I mean as a doctor.

Good chat by the way. Thanks

 

[Long Live HFC]

Is she good? I mean as a doctor.

i am loathe to admit it! but her peers respect her highly, which is good enough for me.

 

[GreyWind]

How would you know? Did you go to her lecture series? Or base your opinion on her from statist msm outlets?

Because I've watched her lectures on youtube. Have you seen her at all?

 

[Smiling Buddha]

Because I've watched her lectures on youtube.

So even when she was banned from taking part in the debate here in Australia, people could still access her opinions and information, and they still wanted to attend her lectures.

Tell me why the statists banned her then.

 

[GreyWind]

So even when she was banned from taking part in the debate here in Australia, people could still access her opinions and information, and they still wanted to attend her lectures.

Tell me why the statists banned her then.

I'm guessing they saw what I saw and that was someone who draws on conclusions from a very long bow while not giving a complete picture. I'm not saying pharma companies give a full picture either because they sure as hell don't.

She also isn't really qualified to be giving out advice. She isn't trained in research and is currently an osteopath and hasn't been practising medicine for about 10 years.

 

[Probitas_]

So even when she was banned from taking part in the debate here in Australia, people could still access her opinions and information, and they still wanted to attend her lectures.

Tell me why the statists banned her then.

Because it was uninformed fear mongering probably

 

[GreyWind]

Because it was uninformed fear mongering probably

She isn't uninformed, she does put in the time and effort to research but from listening to her I found her conclusions to be limited.

 

[Probitas_]

She isn't uninformed, she does put in the time and effort to research but from listening to her I found her conclusions to be limited.

She's a self proclaimed expert with no education to deserve the title. She uses the phrase 'statistically significant' in her talks while having no actual idea of what the term means. She is also a germ theory denialist which is a whole new level of crazy that we probably shouldn't even touch on. There's plenty more examples of her lunacy, poor conclusions and lies but those are the ones that really get my goat.

 

[GreyWind]

She's a self proclaimed expert with no education to deserve the title. She uses the phrase 'statistically significant' in her talks while having no actual idea of what the term means. She is also a germ theory denialist which is a whole new level of crazy that we probably shouldn't even touch on. There's plenty more examples of her lunacy, poor conclusions and lies but those are the ones that really get my goat.

Totally agree with you mate, just saying she isn't uninformed that's all.

 

[Sublime]

I'm not immunised and i'm fine, therefore immunisation is not required.

That's about the logic i think.

 

[krisholio14]

Totally agree with you mate, just saying she isn't uninformed that's all.

Ill informed then.

 

[Probitas_]

She's a self proclaimed expert with no education to deserve the title. She uses the phrase 'statistically significant' in her talks while having no actual idea of what the term means. She is also a germ theory denialist which is a whole new level of crazy that we probably shouldn't even touch on. There's plenty more examples of her lunacy, poor conclusions and lies but those are the ones that really get my goat.

You're right sorry, it was not the correct word to use.

Ill informed then.

This.

 

[JD11]

tell you what? how old you are and what injections you've had?

Where's that lame cut + paste that you trot out 'failure to answer questions' or whatever...

I asked how I could find out what I have been injected with. Do you know the answer?

 

[Probitas_]

Where's that lame cut + paste that you trot out 'failure to answer questions' or whatever...

I asked how I could find out what I have been injected with. Do you know the answer?

You can have a blood test done that lets you know which immunities you have.

http://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/bhcv2/bhcarticles.nsf/pages/Immunisations_catch-ups

 

[Long Live HFC]

I asked how I could find out what I have been injected with. Do you know the answer?

of course i know the answer. ask a parent or guardian which immunisations you've had, and speak to your GP about the ingredients of said vaccines (or you could use google coz i know you guys love that). if your parent or guardian is unable to provide that information, get a blood test at your closest pathology and voila.

if you actually gave a shit about the topic you should have been able to work this out for yourself? don't you guys worship "thinking for yourself"?

 

[JD11]

of course i know the answer. ask a parent or guardian which immunisations you've had, and speak to your GP about the ingredients of said vaccines (or you could use google coz i know you guys love that). if your parent or guardian is unable to provide that information, get a blood test at your closest pathology and voila.

if you actually gave a shit about the topic you should have been able to work this out for yourself? don't you guys worship "thinking for yourself"?

I don't have a GP, I haven't seen a doctor of any kind in this decade. Save for a therapist at the behest of my then girlfriend around a year and a half ago. I already said my mother doesn't know, or can't remember. I googled it but all i could find was 'aluminium hydroxide', which I guess is supposed to make me a blonde iron man.

Seems that I'll need to procure a 'Child Health Record', and then find out - beyond just what I've been immuned against - what is actually in those vaccines. And then, somehow, contact the individual nurses themselves so as to make sure that they only injected me with those exact things.

Boy, no wonder ASADA took so long.

 

[Probitas_]

I don't have a GP, I haven't seen a doctor of any kind in this decade. Save for a therapist at the behest of my then girlfriend around a year and a half ago. I already said my mother doesn't know, or can't remember. I googled it but all i could find was 'aluminium hydroxide', which I guess is supposed to make me a blonde iron man.

Seems that I'll need to procure a 'Child Health Record', and then find out - beyond just what I've been immuned against - what is actually in those vaccines. And then, somehow, contact the individual nurses themselves so as to make sure that they only injected me with those exact things.

Boy, no wonder ASADA took so long.

Or do that thing I directly quoted you and gave you a link to. You'll know within a week.

 

[JD11]

Well that's where I got the 'Child Health Record' from.

 

[Probitas_]

Well that's where I got the 'Child Health Record' from.

Blood test will give you all the standards as far as I'm aware. Unless you got some overseas or in extenuating circumstances. This is what I've been told anyway as I've looked into it myself due to not having vaccinations when young.

 

[Long Live HFC]

I already said my mother doesn't know, or can't remember.

apologies, i missed that part.

what is actually in those vaccines.

as i have mentioned in this thread, you need a working understanding of immunisation to make sense of any particular component in a vaccine. just googling any particular ingredient won't necessarily give you the proper information. eg people thought/think that vaccines are dangerous because they contained thimerosal (mercury compound).