MMA-UFC UFC 232

[red+black]

all we need now is Jones to pull out of the fight for some reason

 

[deklares]

I don't claim to be an expert on PEDs but all that Im reading is that Turinabol can be cleared from the system in weeks and at a maximum a couple of months.

That's not taking into consideration if the drug is being micro dosed.

Who knows for sure though.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

The original results were trace amounts too and he passed tests before and after that test aswell. The argument was the same that time that it was so low as to not have any benefit IIRC..

He's lost any credibility for me to give him any benefit of the doubt. May be innocent this time but I won't be shedding any tears for him if it turns out the majority of fight fans are wrongly assuming guilt here..

I get that, but why would he be punished for the same thing twice? They have said that they are satisfied that the substance has not been ingested again.

 

[deklares]

I get that, but why would he be punished for the same thing twice? They have said that they are satisfied that the substance has not been ingested again.

OK so it seems we have differing opinions on the trustworthiness of USADA.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

I don't claim to be an expert on PEDs but all that Im reading is that Turinabol can be cleared from the system in weeks and at a maximum a couple of months.

That's not taking into consideration if the drug is being micro dosed.

Who knows for sure though.

Taken from https://www.bjpenn.com/mma-news/ufc...8hfIL6_14FbtqespGfxVvXXXJEZgRzgNrbY0j2KOtin4U

To be clear, this ‘atypical finding’ does not represent a failed drug test for Jon Jones.

UFC VP of Athlete Health and Performance Jeff Novitzky told MMAjunkie that this blip on Jones’s test is likely the result of something called “pulsing” rather than his recent ingestion of a banned substance. Novitzky says the the amount of turinabol detected on this Jon Jones test is equivalent to a “picogram.”

“A picogram is a one-trillionth of a gram,” Novitzky told MMAjunkie. “If you put one grain of salt on the table and split it up into 50 million pieces, a picogram is one of those pieces of that gram of salt. These levels have shown up in the single and double digits of picograms – so such a small amount.”

“There’s been no violation of the anti-doping program,” Novitzky added. “He’s been cleared to fight in terms of the USADA program. … USADA fully analyzed it internally. They reached out to outside experts from around the world. They reached out to another sports league that has seen the same issue. And all of them, independent of us, determined that this was not a reingestion of the substance and this very, very small amount that was occurring and still showing up, according to these expects from around the world, did not provide any performance-enhancing benefit.

“Not much is known about this longterm metabolite. The parent compound is not approved for human use anywhere in the world … but what both USADA and other entities are seeing is that a recurrence, or potential ‘pulsing,’ where you have multiple negative tests and then a positive one for a very low amount – they’re seeing that quite commonly over time. And no one knows how long this could last – it could potentially last forever (in Jones’ system).”

 

[deklares]

Taken from https://www.bjpenn.com/mma-news/ufc...8hfIL6_14FbtqespGfxVvXXXJEZgRzgNrbY0j2KOtin4U

To be clear, this ‘atypical finding’ does not represent a failed drug test for Jon Jones.

UFC VP of Athlete Health and Performance Jeff Novitzky told MMAjunkie that this blip on Jones’s test is likely the result of something called “pulsing” rather than his recent ingestion of a banned substance. Novitzky says the the amount of turinabol detected on this Jon Jones test is equivalent to a “picogram.”

“A picogram is a one-trillionth of a gram,” Novitzky told MMAjunkie. “If you put one grain of salt on the table and split it up into 50 million pieces, a picogram is one of those pieces of that gram of salt. These levels have shown up in the single and double digits of picograms – so such a small amount.”

“There’s been no violation of the anti-doping program,” Novitzky added. “He’s been cleared to fight in terms of the USADA program. … USADA fully analyzed it internally. They reached out to outside experts from around the world. They reached out to another sports league that has seen the same issue. And all of them, independent of us, determined that this was not a reingestion of the substance and this very, very small amount that was occurring and still showing up, according to these expects from around the world, did not provide any performance-enhancing benefit.

“Not much is known about this longterm metabolite. The parent compound is not approved for human use anywhere in the world … but what both USADA and other entities are seeing is that a recurrence, or potential ‘pulsing,’ where you have multiple negative tests and then a positive one for a very low amount – they’re seeing that quite commonly over time. And no one knows how long this could last – it could potentially last forever (in Jones’ system).”

Have always liked your posts so don’t intend to start an argument. My issue is with Jon Jones and USADA having little credibility in my eyes.

You seem to have done some research which I respect. Novitski and USADA may be right here. I really don’t know enough apart from what I’ve read to come to any hard and fast conclusions other than to say I have serious doubts and am unwilling to believe what official sources are saying straight off the bat.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Have always liked your posts so don’t intend to start an argument. My issue is with Jon Jones and USADA having little credibility in my eyes.

You seem to have done some research which I respect. Novitski and USADA may be right here. I really don’t know enough apart from what I’ve read to come to any hard and fast conclusions other than to say I have serious doubts and am unwilling to believe what official sources are saying straight off the bat.

All good. I'm not going to throw a hissy fit if we have a disagreement, particularly when all the facts aren't known.

I don't necessarily have a lot of faith in Jones or USADA either, but with everyone jumping on the "F*ck Jones" bandwagon, I'm merely putting another point of view out there. If what's been reported is false and Jones has legitimately popped again then I'll jump right on that bandwagon, but if the findings are on the up and up and the trace amounts have come from his previous failed test I have no issue with him being able to fight.

The one thing we can all agree on is it definitely sucks for the other fighters on the card who have already arranged tickets/accommodation/flights for friends, family and corners. Hoping they get compensated fairly for the last minute switch.

 

[JG22]

It’s a fair inconvenience but LV to LA is about the best you can do, especially when they just scrapped an LA card.

 

[Stevi_Tigers]

 

[Ry009]

I don't know enough about USADA/WADA/ASADA etc, but have there been other occurrences similar to this where an athlete has positive stemming from a previous suspension?

Just wondering if another athelte had a positive test whether they would be given the same leniency?

I've done no research and comment comes from pure assumption, but i would have thought anyone with anything in there system regardless of amount shouldn't be permitted to fight? What consitutes an amount that isn't deemed performance enhancing?

Just very muddy and murky.

Regardless of whether it was fair or not, absolute disgrace the event has been moved. Zero justification for it IMO.

 

[DazalenkoUBewty]

Da fook

 

[Guy Threepwood]

I don't know enough about USADA/WADA/ASADA etc, but have there been other occurrences similar to this where an athlete has positive stemming from a previous suspension?

Just wondering if another athelte had a positive test whether they would be given the same leniency?

I've done no research and comment comes from pure assumption, but i would have thought anyone with anything in there system regardless of amount shouldn't be permitted to fight? What consitutes an amount that isn't deemed performance enhancing?

Just very muddy and murky.

Regardless of whether it was fair or not, absolute disgrace the event has been moved. Zero justification for it IMO.

The article I referenced earlier mentioned that other sports had seen similar, but didn't name the sports or athletes involved.

I was reading a different forum a bit earlier and there were several people on there indicating that the "pulsing" that Novitzky mentioned was only possible in people who had abused steroids previously. I have no idea if they know what they are talking about or have axes to grind, but if that is the case it's a horrendously dumb defense for the UFC to use.

 

[DazalenkoUBewty]

There's no way he's taking s**t and risking everything. It's just not happening.

 

[deklares]

I don't know enough about USADA/WADA/ASADA etc, but have there been other occurrences similar to this where an athlete has positive stemming from a previous suspension?

Just wondering if another athelte had a positive test whether they would be given the same leniency?

I've done no research and comment comes from pure assumption, but i would have thought anyone with anything in there system regardless of amount shouldn't be permitted to fight? What consitutes an amount that isn't deemed performance enhancing?

Just very muddy and murky.

Regardless of whether it was fair or not, absolute disgrace the event has been moved. Zero justification for it IMO.

Tom Lawlor got caught for picograms in his system and he was banned for 2 years.

The only other similar situation I could find where a banned substance remained in an athletes system for subsequent tests after original suspension. Different substance and the steroid was injected vs. oral ingestion which leaves the system quicker.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...at-its-mission/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Youre right it is murky. To keep Jones on the card -guilty or innocent- while throwing everyone else involved into disarray is at the very least utterly amateurish and at the most bordering on sanctioned cheating.

Some of the stories from fans who have been completely ****ed over from this makes me really sick. The fans coming from O/S have some especially shitty stories.

 

[PoppedCorn]

Full of s**t

They microdose...everyone knows this

So what they're saying is it's a millionth of a grain of sand they've detected that's stayed in the fat in his body from 2017
He Has had multiple tests since then and passed, he then cut weight and the micrograin has now moved into his blood due to weight cutting etc for the up coming fight and theyve detected it

So what they're saying is they know there's no chance it's a new grain of sand since 2017 and is one that laid dormant in his body fat for a year

 

[JG22]

If he’s been tested 8 times in the past year? or so why is it just showing up now, just before the fight.

 

[red+black]

When you sleep with dogs ...

* Jon Jones. * Dana White. * the UFC. If someone *s up, give them a second chance. If they * up again, you cut them loose.

A motto everyone should live by, professionally and personally.

I hope Jon Jones spends NYE in hospital, if not worse.

 

[Andrew Birch]

Full of s**t

They microdose...everyone knows this

So what they're saying is it's a millionth of a grain of sand they've detected that's stayed in the fat in his body from 2017
He Has had multiple tests since then and passed, he then cut weight and the micrograin has now moved into his blood due to weight cutting etc for the up coming fight and theyve detected it

So what they're saying is they know there's no chance it's a new grain of sand since 2017 and is one that laid dormant in his body fat for a year

Tom Lawlor was banned for 2 years for having 17pg/ml of ostarine but Jones is on 60pg/ml of turibunol 3.5 times higher but yeah a millionth of a micrograin of sand lol

 

[Andrew Birch]

all we need now is Jones to pull out of the fight for some reason

When I die, I want Jones to lower me down into my grave just so he can let me down one last time.

 

[deklares]

The last thing you'd want to do is fly whilst being that deep into your weight cut but it's something I guess.

No mention of the fans yet..

 

[Gigantic]

Meanwhile they probably changed Jones flight about 2 weeks ago.

 

[newblueo]

Put aside the drug debate for a second. I count 5 fighters on the card who have failed drug tests lol.

Together they have had 4 fights in 3 years. Jones looked a shadow of what he was in the past.Heck even Carlos has lost more then carlton recently.
Volk v chad is the only good fight as I hate Anderson's style lay ontop and dry hump.

ehhh my old mate Ryan hall is on the card to haha heel hook king!

Who is buying this card lol?

 

[JG22]

Still think Cyborg Nunes is gonna be mad, going under the radar.

 

[deklares]

Still think Cyborg Nunes is gonna be mad, going under the radar.

I think Nunes has power that should relate to 145. Cyborg likes to stand in the pocket and trade too. The question is will her chin stand up to Cyborg's power IMO.

 

[DazalenkoUBewty]

Still think Cyborg Nunes is gonna be mad, going under the radar.

Cracking match-up. I think Nunes can get it done..