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Analysis Umpires

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SurreyBlue said:
It’s doing my head in. If you tackle a guy by holding his one arm and he has no time to get it out it’s automatically holding the ball, but if you tackle a guy correctly and he holds the ball in, goes to ground and makes no attempt to get it out, it’s a ball up. In what world?

At least the umpiring was ok tonight.
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Well the argument would be you can still kick it with one hand free on the ball.
You are allowed to make and attempt and miss the ball and wont be pined.

Assuming you are referring to the acers one from the marking contest, had he tried to put a boot onto it and probably missed it becuase of the nature of the tackle he wouldnt have been pinged.

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Bluebag13 said:
Well the argument would be you can still kick it with one hand free on the ball.
You are allowed to make and attempt and miss the ball and wont be pined.

Assuming you are referring to the acers one from the marking contest, had he tried to put a boot onto it and probably missed it becuase of the nature of the tackle he wouldnt have been pinged.

View attachment 2267654
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You're missing the ball-up scenario. i.e. No prior opportunity, ball locked in by tackle - ball up.
 

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Gointocarlton said:
Acres getting pinged for HTB (free kick resulted in a goal) when he clearly had no prior was an absolute disgraceful decision.
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Ball not pinned, has to make a genuine attempt.
Has been paid all season, and we got one early in the game almost exactly the same.


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ajb72 said:
Ball not pinned, has to make a genuine attempt.
Has been paid all season, and we got one early in the game almost exactly the same.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I get the principle.

But I remember Weitering doing this last year and almost doing a knee.

If you're being swung off balance. Throwing a leg at the ball is stupidity.
 
ajb72 said:
Ball not pinned, has to make a genuine attempt.
Has been paid all season, and we got one early in the game almost exactly the same.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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He was tackled immediately after jumping up to take the ball, to me that's no prior opportunity. He arm was pinned and I realise they pay it but it should be a ball up. To me, there needs to be a small delay between taking possession and being tackled. Otherwise, the "no prior opportunity wording is redundant. The wording should be changed to "if you take e possession and the ball is not (a) knocked out in the tackle or (b) disposed of correctly, a free kick id paid for HTB. The genuine attempt thing is BS also, he was making an attempt (to free his arm) but it was pinned. Again, "make a genuine attempt" is redundant terminology given the way they are adjudicating.
 
Bluebag13 said:
Well the argument would be you can still kick it with one hand free on the ball.
You are allowed to make and attempt and miss the ball and wont be pined.

Assuming you are referring to the acers one from the marking contest, had he tried to put a boot onto it and probably missed it becuase of the nature of the tackle he wouldnt have been pinged.

View attachment 2267654
Click to expand...
I’m sorry, these interpretations of the rule look good. Problem is, they don’t equate to the rulings.
When the player with the ball makes no attempt to get rid of it, and goes to ground holding it in., they have called ball up, even though he had prior but didn’t want it lost out in the open. So may times this year - 2nd or 3rd flow from the right = wrong. This has been so evident in the 3 rounds.
Also, if a player is held by one arm and attempts to try and kick, he is penalised, even though the ball has come loose. Your first flow chart is incorrect. No if’s but’s or maybes. You show me many flow charts but they don’t relate to the umpires calls.
You’ve just highlighted what I’ve raised.
Sorry
 
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Bluebag13 said:
Well the argument would be you can still kick it with one hand free on the ball.
You are allowed to make and attempt and miss the ball and wont be pined.

Assuming you are referring to the acers one from the marking contest, had he tried to put a boot onto it and probably missed it becuase of the nature of the tackle he wouldnt have been pinged.

View attachment 2267654
Click to expand...
But he might have done a knee. Stupid position to put players in.


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katmanblue said:
But he might have done a knee. Stupid position to put players in.


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Correct. It’s a disaster waiting to occur and was only bought in when master coach Hardwick whinged about it.
Mind you, he was the first coach to introduce another rule let go, push in the back. His Richmond team were well known for pushing players to the ground behind play. Now it’s not legal and they are trying to stamp it out. Just nonsense.
 
ajb72 said:
Ball not pinned, has to make a genuine attempt.
Has been paid all season, and we got one early in the game almost exactly the same.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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... except in that case, the player actually - you know - dropped the ball. As in, incorrect disposal.

In any case, it's just as shit a rule as the last one. Punish the player first to the ball. Brilliant.
 
SurreyBlue said:
Correct. It’s a disaster waiting to occur and was only bought in when master coach Hardwick whinged about it.
Mind you, he was the first coach to introduce another rule let go, push in the back. His Richmond team were well known for pushing players to the ground behind play. Now it’s not legal and they are trying to stamp it out. Just nonsense.
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Here's an idea: coaches who are paid to compete in the sport should express no public opinions on the rules, cognisant of their undue influence over them.
 

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slashin_velvet said:
We were getting everything in the first half - my question for those responsible for the AFL is regarding the swing of frees for/against.

It may be anecdotal, but when a team appears to get a significant "rub of the green" in the first half, it often seems to go the other way in the second half to "balance it out" - would be interested to know if there is statistical support for this - is it implicit bias? Do the umpires get the frees for/against stats at half time? Does the umpires coach have an influence?
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I feel like it happens every week.

Where they pay them matters the most.. a lot of the time there are a bunch of quick free kicks in succession at the end of the game in positions that will have no influence. Such as the ones we got at the end of hawks game
 
SurreyBlue said:
I’m sorry, these interpretations of the rule look good. Problem is, they don’t equate to the rulings.
When the player with the ball makes no attempt to get rid of it, and goes to ground holding it in., they have called ball up, even though he had prior but didn’t want it lost out in the open. So may times this year - 2nd or 3rd flow from the right = wrong. This has been so evident in the 3 rounds.
Also, if a player is held by one arm and attempts to try and kick, he is penalised, even though the ball has come loose. Your first flow chart is incorrect. No if’s but’s or maybes. You show me many flow charts but they don’t relate to the umpires calls.
You’ve just highlighted what I’ve raised.
Sorry
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No need for so many sorrys.

Seems pretty clear to me and there always mistakes that happen.
 
BluStreak said:
Why doesn't Voss voice concerns about the treatment of Cripps or Harry / Charlie?
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He did. Then the umpiring group as a whole turned feral agains Crippa and gave him nothing. Still many games, he is receiving very little compared to other so called ‘stars’. Fortunately they had no option but to give him Brownlow votes. Hence the big number and flowered Naicos up at the same time. 😍
 
Family has been discussing for 18 months- the AFL has everything to gain from making the game as confusing and unpredictable as possible. Every decision that is debated fills their coffers. Provides media coverage. Money in pockets. No one can pinpoint an error - they walk away chest out and head high. Nothing to see here. The commentators are equally as complicit.
OUR game is sooooo far away from the game we all love.
 

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BluStreak said:
Why doesn't Voss voice concerns about the treatment of Cripps or Harry / Charlie?
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This really bothers me. Other coaches have come out and have gone on record saying that some of their players don't get the protection that they rightly deserve.

Us on the other hand just cop it and stay silent. The amount of times H and Charlie were/are mauled, held, pushed, shepparded to a contest, etc. was/is silly. It has to be more than just "just power through it" -- oppo players need to be held accountable for illegal acts.

It's like once the media started whining about Charlie and H getting free kicks in 2023, it almost stopped cold.
 
Alice said:
Family has been discussing for 18 months- the AFL has everything to gain from making the game as confusing and unpredictable as possible. Every decision that is debated fills their coffers. Provides media coverage. Money in pockets. No one can pinpoint an error - they walk away chest out and head high. Nothing to see here. The commentators are equally as complicit.
OUR game is sooooo far away from the game we all love.
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Yep … they more grey the game is the better from an AFL viewpoint
 
Alice said:
Family has been discussing for 18 months- the AFL has everything to gain from making the game as confusing and unpredictable as possible. Every decision that is debated fills their coffers. Provides media coverage. Money in pockets. No one can pinpoint an error - they walk away chest out and head high. Nothing to see here. The commentators are equally as complicit.
OUR game is sooooo far away from the game we all love.
Click to expand...

Yep, the rules are ambiguous enough that they can choose what to focus on on a game by game basis.

I feel like we are heading towards wwe style outcomes
 
Alice said:
Family has been discussing for 18 months- the AFL has everything to gain from making the game as confusing and unpredictable as possible. Every decision that is debated fills their coffers. Provides media coverage. Money in pockets. No one can pinpoint an error - they walk away chest out and head high. Nothing to see here. The commentators are equally as complicit.
OUR game is sooooo far away from the game we all love.
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And one fangroup can get putted against another on the turn of a decision: to one club, the free kick is absolutely there, it's the opposition's sour grapes and being a sore loser and not knowing the rules that sees them complaining.

Nevermind that shoe is on the other foot a week later.
 

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