Updating the "Team of the Century"

[Byron Street]

This is the first thread that I have created. I am 74, and grew up (from age 6 to age 21) in a house in Byron Street, in downtown Footscray. I have followed the Bulldogs since 1949, and saw E. J. play his first game in 1951. I have been living outside of Australia since 1998, but watch the Dogs "live", every week, courtesy of the miracle of modern technology.

I thought for my first thread I would offer something whose authenticity would be enhanced by the fact that I have been a devoted Dogs fan since 1949. There are many pertinent questions--e.g., which was the better team, Footscray in 1954 or the Western Bulldogs in 2016?

Well, here is my best team for the time I have been following the Dogs, 1949-2017. I've done this from memory, so there could be a couple of important omissions. I invite your comments.


Best Bulldogs Team, 1949–2017


Back Pocket: Wally Donald (followed closely by Dale Morris)
FB: Herb Henderson (followed, a fair way back, by Brian Lake)
BP Ruck. Gary Dempsey

HBF: Bob Murphy
CHB: Ted Whitten (Captain)
HBF: Bubba Smith

W: Doug Hawkins
C: Scott West
W: Marcus Bontempelli

HFF: Nathan Brown
CHF: Chris Grant (Vice-Captain)
HFF: Brad Johnson

FP: Bernie Quinlan
FF: Kelvin Templeton
FP: Tony Liberatore

R: John Schultz
RR Don Ross
Ro: George Bissett

19–22: Jack Collins, Simon Beasley, Scott Wynd, Brian Royal

Coach: Luke Beveridge
Assistant Coaches: Charlie Sutton, Terry Wallace, Rodney Eade
President: Peter Gordon

Comments:

1. Donald, Henderson, and Whitten were the keys of a magnificent backline that had less than 1000 points scored against it in the 1954 home-and-away games. 1954 premiership half-back flankers Jim Gallagher and Alan Martin were also chosen in Victorian representative sides. The 1954 Bulldogs’ backline might well be the greatest defensive unit in VFL/AFL history.

2. Don Ross, 1954 premiership centre-man, always beat Melbourne’s Ron Barassi as a ruck-rover. He was the only player in the VFL who could do that.

3. The rovers George Bissett and Tony Liberatore were very good, but, relatively speaking, are not that strong for this team.

4. Charlie Sutton was a fine, very tough player, and an inspirational leader, but not quite good enough for this team!

5. Charlie Sutton thought that Jack Collins was as good as Ted Whitten. Collins was selected to play centre-half-back, centre-half-forward, and full-forward for Victoria (in different years, of course)

6. For the years 1997 to 2000, Terry Wallace was a wonderfully innovative coach.

 

[gandaal]

Great effort and a really interesting post. I have one comment and one question.

How incredible is it to see a guy as young as Bontempelli already in a team like this? It's says a lot about the impact he's made on that club in such a short time.

Was Tony ever much of a forward pocket? I remember him being a midfielder, and then a rather nasty tagger.

 

[HalloweenJack]

Great effort. I was a bit surprised that John Jillard didn't remain in your team. JJ, as I understand, was a great HBF. I knew him in his last few years and he was a great man and very humble. He always spoke in glowing terms about EJ.

 

[gandaal]

B Michael Sexton, Steven Silvagni, Kade Simpson
HB Andrew McKay, Peter Dean, Sam Docherty
C Craig Bradley, Brett Ratten, Chris Judd
HF Wayne Johnston, Stephen Kernahan, Marc Murphy
F Eddie Betts, Brendan Fevola, Kenny Hunter
R Justin Madden, Greg Williams, Anthony Koutoufidies
Int Lance Whitnall, Fraser Brown, Bryce Gibbs, Patrick Cripps

Coach: Parkin

This is my Carlton best team of the last 30 years that I've been following football. It's dominated by the 1995 team with 11 from that great side.

 

[HalloweenJack]

Great team gandaal. A quick correction though because The Dominator is Wayne Johnston. I would have found room for Kenny Hunter.

 

[gandaal]

Oops.

And I'll throw out Waite and bring in Kenny. I was 7 when Kenny retired so the memory's a bit fuzzy.

 

[HalloweenJack]

I saw Kenny Hunter in his first senior game for Claremont at Claremont Oval. He lasted about 5 minutes before John Wynne from my team West Perth broke his jaw after Kenny courageously backed into a pack. Wynne accidently kicked him in the face after taking the mark and falling. Kenny was as brave as any footballer I have ever seen.

 

[Blueyboy74]

I'll have a go at Richmond for the last 50 years 1967 - 2017:

B: M.Malthouse D.Clay K.Sheedy
HB: F.Bourke A.Rance M.Keane
C: B.Wood G.Raines W.Campbell
HF: B.Barrott R.Hart M.Rioli
F: D.Weightman M.Richardson J.Riewoldt
FOLL: M.Lee D.Martin K.Bartlett
INT: M.Roach M.Knights T.Cotchin B.Deledio

 

[Doss]

Oops.

And I'll throw out Waite and bring in Kenny. I was 7 when Kenny retired so the memory's a bit fuzzy.

Don't get me wrong, I really rate Docherty, but is giving him a spot in a team of the last 30 years perhaps just slightly premature at this stage?

His was the name that stood out there for me. Interested in your reasoning and who you have him in ahead of.

 

[gandaal]

Don't get me wrong, I really rate Docherty, but is giving him a spot in a team of the last 30 years perhaps just slightly premature at this stage?

His was the name that stood out there for me. Interested in your reasoning and who you have him in ahead of.

The last 15 years have been the worst era in Carltons history. If this was a best Carlton team of the last 50 years it would look very different, and a lot stronger, with the great teams of the 70s and 80s added to the mix. Players like Docherty and Cripps wouldn't be in the team if I was 10 years older. Nor would Sexton, Lance and Brown as good as they were.

Right now I have a mix of 3 defensive defenders and three run and carry attacking defenders. You could easily stay the same and look for another run and carry player to replace Doc, or replace him with a shut down defender and ask for more run from Dean and Sexton.

So there's plenty of options because it's wide open. Are they better than Docherty? I don't think so.

I'll discuss the options in a later post.

 

[Monkey King]

B Michael Sexton, Steven Silvagni, Kade Simpson
HB Andrew McKay, Peter Dean, Sam Docherty
C Craig Bradley, Brett Ratten, Chris Judd
HF Wayne Johnston, Stephen Kernahan, Marc Murphy
F Eddie Betts, Brendan Fevola, Kenny Hunter
R Justin Madden, Greg Williams, Anthony Koutoufidies
Int Lance Whitnall, Fraser Brown, Bryce Gibbs, Patrick Cripps

Coach: Parkin

This is my Carlton best team of the last 30 years that I've been following football. It's dominated by the 1995 team with 11 from that great side.

In my time watching Carlton.

B Geoff Southby, Stephen Silvagni, Kenny Hunter
HB Andrew McKay, David McKay, Bruce Doull
C Craig Bradley, Greg Williams, Anthony Koutoufidies
HF Wayne Johnston, Stephen Kernahan, Alex Jesaulenko
F Eddie Betts, Brendan Fevola, Peter Bosustow
R Mike Fitzpatrick, Brett Ratten, Chris Judd
Int Rod Ashman, Wayne Harmes, Trevor Keogh, Kade Simpson

What a backline. What a midfield. What a forward line. Bloody good team that.

 

[CrazyJoeFevola]

Monkey King Brilliant side. Only change I'd make is probably Harry Madden on the bench for Simmo.

 

[Aeglos]

B Michael Sexton, Steven Silvagni, Kade Simpson
HB Andrew McKay, Peter Dean, Sam Docherty
C Craig Bradley, Brett Ratten, Chris Judd
HF Wayne Johnston, Stephen Kernahan, Marc Murphy
F Eddie Betts, Brendan Fevola, Kenny Hunter
R Justin Madden, Greg Williams, Anthony Koutoufidies
Int Lance Whitnall, Fraser Brown, Bryce Gibbs, Patrick Cripps

Coach: Parkin

This is my Carlton best team of the last 30 years that I've been following football. It's dominated by the 1995 team with 11 from that great side.

imo swap Judd and Kouta.
By the time Judd got to you guys he'd slowed down a fair bit and won 90% of his ball on the inside

 

[Wallaby]

I'll have a go at Richmond for the last 50 years 1967 - 2017:

B: M.Malthouse D.Clay K.Sheedy
HB: F.Bourke A.Rance M.Keane
C: B.Wood G.Raines W.Campbell
HF: B.Barrott R.Hart M.Rioli
F: D.Weightman M.Richardson J.Riewoldt
FOLL: M.Lee D.Martin K.Bartlett
INT: M.Roach M.Knights T.Cotchin B.Deledio

Hmm - not bad. A couple of 'differences of opinion' here...

Maybe Mike Green instead of Mark Lee. Green was a phenomenal finals player (BOG 1st semi, Prelim and Granny in 1969). He retired at the end of 71, missed 72 (no wonder we lost) and was coaxed back for 73-75.

Mervyn Keane was a fine HBF/ruckrover, but I think I would prefer Joel Bowden there. More skilled, able to play big or small (I know it's fashionable to bag Bowden, but he really was very good).

I think the side would be better if Stewart, Cotchin or Knights came in instead of Barrott. I know Billy is a legend, but any of those other guys would let Bartlett play more forward - he was pretty good there.

Good KPFs! We have 5 to choose from. Hart and Riewoldt are very similar types, Roach and Cloke the big bruisers. Richo was Richo. Take your pick..........

 

[Brutalitops]

B Michael Sexton, Steven Silvagni, Kade Simpson
HB Andrew McKay, Peter Dean, Sam Docherty
C Craig Bradley, Brett Ratten, Chris Judd
HF Wayne Johnston, Stephen Kernahan, Marc Murphy
F Eddie Betts, Brendan Fevola, Kenny Hunter
R Justin Madden, Greg Williams, Anthony Koutoufidies
Int Lance Whitnall, Fraser Brown, Bryce Gibbs, Patrick Cripps

Coach: Parkin

This is my Carlton best team of the last 30 years that I've been following football. It's dominated by the 1995 team with 11 from that great side.

Brave of you to leave out the flying doormat. Royce Hart said he was the toughest backman he ever faced. You mustve only caught the tail end of his playing days, but he was still bloody brilliant. Its a little early to name Doc just yet for mine. Ang Christou might be a better fit there if you missed out on seeing Doull.

 

[gandaal]

Brave of you to leave out the flying doormat. Royce Hart said he was the toughest backman he ever faced. You mustve only caught the tail end of his playing days, but he was still bloody brilliant. Its a little early to name Doc just yet for mine. Ang Christou might be a better fit there if you missed out on seeing Doull.

Ang had a couple of good years but had plenty of years where he really struggled. His career is probably a little overrated because of his friendship with Koutoufidies.

Doull retired 31 years ago, just outside of my 30 year limit.

 

[Hamingja]

My time following Geelong:

B: Sanderson Scarlett Bews
HB: Enright Taylor Milburn
C: Dangerfield Selwood Ablett Jnr
HF: Johnson Brownless Bartel
F: Chapman Ablett Snr Hawkins
R: Ottens Couch Hocking
I: Stoneham Bairstow Corey Riccardi

Looking forward to the centre line next year

 

[Blueyboy74]

Hmm - not bad. A couple of 'differences of opinion' here...

Maybe Mike Green instead of Mark Lee. Green was a phenomenal finals player (BOG 1st semi, Prelim and Granny in 1969). He retired at the end of 71, missed 72 (no wonder we lost) and was coaxed back for 73-75.

Mervyn Keane was a fine HBF/ruckrover, but I think I would prefer Joel Bowden there. More skilled, able to play big or small (I know it's fashionable to bag Bowden, but he really was very good).

I think the side would be better if Stewart, Cotchin or Knights came in instead of Barrott. I know Billy is a legend, but any of those other guys would let Bartlett play more forward - he was pretty good there.

Good KPFs! We have 5 to choose from. Hart and Riewoldt are very similar types, Roach and Cloke the big bruisers. Richo was Richo. Take your pick..........

Good points and having Green or The General in the ruck was the one I wrestled with most. In the end I went the General since with a TOC midfield you want ruck dominance and I rate him the better pure ruckman averaging 18.5 hit-outs per game to Green's 7.5.

In fact Mark Lee's career averages (13.5 disposals, 3.8 marks, 0.4 goals, 18.5 hit-outs) stack right up with those considered the best in his era such as Peter Moore (13.8, 4.7, 1.0, 12.7), Simon Madden (12.2, 5.5, 1.5, 13.8) and Matt Rendall (15.3, 4.7, 0.6, 13.9). His career average of 18.5 hit-outs also compares favourably with other champion ruckmen like:

Jim Stynes - 11.8
Harry Madden - 17.2
Barry Round - 7.5
Mike Fitzpatrick - 15.0
Len Thompson - 15.4
Gary Dempsey - 19.7
Sam Newman - 9.4
Len Thompson - 15.4

Could argue the toss over Billy v Cotch, Stewy & Knighta but went with Bill since I had to put him on a HFF and he had the better goal average.

Bowden's stats stack up well with Merv Keane's but if you normalised the disposals for the era then they are pretty close and I guess I am still haunted by some of JB's junk stats particularly later in his career.

 

[guruisatiger]

B.-- D.kellaway. Gaspar. Keane
Hb.Bourke. . Rance. Cameron
C. Knights. Rioli.. Deledio
HF.Martin.. Richo. KBu
FF.. Flea. Disco. Daffy
R. Lee..Raines. Cotchin
Inter. Campbell. Jbowden. Rogers. Reiwoldt
From 1980 till now

 

[Monkey King]

B.-- D.kellaway. Gaspar. Keane
Hb.Bourke. . Rance. Cameron
C. Knights. Rioli.. Deledio
HF.Martin.. Richo. KBu
FF.. Flea. Disco. Daffy
R. Lee..Raines. Cotchin
Inter. Campbell. Jbowden. Rogers. Reiwoldt
From 1980 till now

No Jim Jess? Surely The Ghost gets a guernsey over guys like Bowden and Cameron?

 

[Snake_Baker]

Martyn Dench Archer
Pickett Glendinning Jarrard
Greig Foote Dwyer
Blight Carey Schimmelbusch
Harvey Spencer J. Krakeour
Teasdale Cable Aylett

Stevens Schwass Dugdale Kekovich

I maintain that the North half forward line is the strongest line of any clubs TOTC.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Martyn Dench Archer
Pickett Glendinning Jarrard
Greig Foote Dwyer
Blight Carey Schimmelbusch
Harvey Spencer J. Krakeour
Teasdale Cable Aylett

Stevens Schwass Dugdale Kekovich

I maintain that the North half forward line is the strongest line of any clubs TOTC.

Franklin Brereton Buckenara

Yeah, nice try Snakey, but I don't think so.

 

[Procrastinator35]

In my time watching Carlton.

B Geoff Southby, Stephen Silvagni, Kenny Hunter
HB Andrew McKay, David McKay, Bruce Doull
C Craig Bradley, Greg Williams, Anthony Koutoufidies
HF Wayne Johnston, Stephen Kernahan, Alex Jesaulenko
F Eddie Betts, Brendan Fevola, Peter Bosustow
R Mike Fitzpatrick, Brett Ratten, Chris Judd
Int Rod Ashman, Wayne Harmes, Trevor Keogh, Kade Simpson

What a backline. What a midfield. What a forward line. Bloody good team that.

Hard to fault any of those first 18 selections really....Though I'd have Big Nic in ahead of Keogh on the bench, but appreciate that you may not have seen him.

 

[Procrastinator35]

A HAWKTHORN 22

B: Gary Ayres Chris Langford Kelvin Moore
H.B: Peter Knights Chris Mew Luke Hodge
C: Shane Crawford Sam Mitchell Robert Dipierdomenico
HF: Lance Franklin Dermott Brereton Gary Buckenara
F: Peter Hudson Jason Dunstall Leigh Matthews
R: Don Scott Michael Tuck John Platten
Int: Cyril Rioli Graham Arthur Darren Jarman Shaun Burgoyne

Note: That full forward line might be a tad slow in today's footy....LOL

 

[Snake_Baker]

Franklin Brereton Buckenara

Yeah, nice try Snakey, but I don't think so.

You're trippin'

Carry on.