Opinion Vent & Offtopic

17er

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We need to team up with Southport and get in on some Pokies Action. Need to sure up our existence by getting onboard the great cash cow.
No worries, mate. Obviously it boils down to a moral debate, but that's something we'll just differ on. But I can respect your view, of course.
Those ships have long since sailed, gentlemen. You are hardly the first to come up with the idea and more will come after you, just as there will be people like me saying that you are out of your minds. But here's some proof. Yesterday, Collingwood announced that they have sold their two gaming licences, with Geelong and the Western Bulldogs to follow. Melbourne sold off its licences in April. Now why would they do that without some kind of assurances from the AFL that everything would be ok?

There will still be clubs which promote gambling and you can argue all you like that there isn't anything wrong with it, but the AFL doesn't want its club involved with it and will be providing incentive to clubs to cease and desist or else miss out on development money. Besides, you are overlooking the elephant in the room. When Southport Sharks ends its 10 year Patron Sponsorship at the end of 2020, don't you think they'll renew? And when they do renew, where do you think the money is going to come from? Why on Earth would they want a rival club taking away their customers and be paying that club to help do so?

Let the local clubs decide what model is best for them to operate under, but forget about the Suns swimming against the tide to defy the AFL. There's a lot more money in the AFL Broadcast Rights pie than relying on destroying families with poker machines - and if you don't believe they are machines of misery then you've led a protected and privileged life and have been lucky not to have been impacted. For many of the rest of us, it is an issue close to home and I, for one, would cancel my membership if the club opened a pokies venue.
 

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Mr Bods

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Those ships have long since sailed, gentlemen. You are hardly the first to come up with the idea and more will come after you, just as there will be people like me saying that you are out of your minds. But here's some proof. Yesterday, Collingwood announced that they have sold their two gaming licences, with Geelong and the Western Bulldogs to follow. Melbourne sold off its licences in April. Now why would they do that without some kind of assurances from the AFL that everything would be ok?

There will still be clubs which promote gambling and you can argue all you like that there isn't anything wrong with it, but the AFL doesn't want its club involved with it and will be providing incentive to clubs to cease and desist or else miss out on development money. Besides, you are overlooking the elephant in the room. When Southport Sharks ends its 10 year Patron Sponsorship at the end of 2020, don't you think they'll renew? And when they do renew, where do you think the money is going to come from? Why on Earth would they want a rival club taking away their customers and be paying that club to help do so?

Let the local clubs decide what model is best for them to operate under, but forget about the Suns swimming against the tide to defy the AFL. There's a lot more money in the AFL Broadcast Rights pie than relying on destroying families with poker machines - and if you don't believe they are machines of misery then you've led a protected and privileged life and have been lucky not to have been impacted. For many of the rest of us, it is an issue close to home and I, for one, would cancel my membership if the club opened a pokies venue.
You were going so well until you dictated to me (and jackenny) that I’ve “led a protected and privileged life”. 17er-you wouldn’t have a clue about the paths both of us have walked.

When we become the GC Sharks those beautiful poker machines will nourish and provide insurance to ensure we keep on going through any lean Times and help pay for our celebration drinks and dinners at the Club after our many wins.
It’s going to be great.
 

17er

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You were going so well until you dictated to me (and jackenny) that I’ve “led a protected and privileged life”. 17er-you wouldn’t have a clue about the paths both of us have walked.

When we become the GC Sharks those beautiful poker machines will nourish and provide insurance to ensure we keep on going through any lean Times and help pay for our celebration drinks and dinners at the Club after our many wins.
It’s going to be great.
Mr Bods, I said "if you don't believe they are machines of misery then you've led a protected and privileged life and have been lucky not to have been impacted." I don't think you need a grammar lesson to know what IF means. You know as well as I do that pokies wreck lives, but we also both know they are virtually a licence to print money. So let the Shark bleed their members and sponsor the Suns.

Once, I would have agreed with you on the GC Sharks, but I have been convinced otherwise by passionate Suns fans who hate the Sharks that it would be a poor idea. Talk to any Port fan and they'll tell you their club is reviled around SA and that the Power are the 2nd club and will never be number 1 because the SANFL fans have such long memories. The Crows earnt their popularity through fulfilling their stated ambition of being "the pride of South Australia".

I want the Suns to be the very best and definitely the best in Queensland. We know that our QAFL clubs are better than Brisbane's and we know that our Academy will in time produce better players. I want us to be like the Crows, forging our own identity with our own brand and doing it without pokies, major points of difference to the Brisbane Lions, and Port Adelaide, for that matter.
 

Iva Bigun

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Just a quick aside in regards to the Lions pokies.

The Lions sports club is at Springwood, across the road from the Springwood Hotel. This is going back over 5 years, but Springwood Hotel used to bring in over $1m per month in pokie revenue, and hey only has 40 pokie machines.

It's probably been 18 months since I visited the Lions at Springwood. The place is badly in need of major renovations. The food is bad, and the atmosphere is a step above a morgue. As a sporting club, it looks like it's stuck in the 80's. Looking at the place, the Lions do not appear to be interested in maximising the potential revenue of 200 machines in what is essentially one of the top gambling areas of SEQ.
It was really poorly designed and I agree with your comments about the 80’s feel of the place. The premiership cups also look awkwardly placed. It could be a great venue but needs to be gutted and started again. Perhaps they will build something at Springwood if the facility ever gets built. As a lions fan how do you feel about the Springwood idea, it has the potential to be a Saints at Seaford cock up of the players don’t want to live out there or travel everyday for training. I always thought the Coorparoo kangaroos ground where they used to train was a perfect venue, 5 mins to the Gabba and space to build
 

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It was really poorly designed and I agree with your comments about the 80’s feel of the place. The premiership cups also look awkwardly placed. It could be a great venue but needs to be gutted and started again. Perhaps they will build something at Springwood if the facility ever gets built. As a lions fan how do you feel about the Springwood idea, it has the potential to be a Saints at Seaford cock up of the players don’t want to live out there or travel everyday for training. I always thought the Coorparoo kangaroos ground where they used to train was a perfect venue, 5 mins to the Gabba and space to build
My understanding is the Coorparoo site is on top of old landfill, so it’s prohibited to build to the scale that the Springfield offers. We’re hoping to build a 15,000 seat stadium, with the capacity to add more, plus a multi-storey, multipurpose training facility that will offer alternative income streams.

The players don’t have to live out there. They can live either side of the river, around Corinda and Sherwood, and be a 10 to 15 minute drive from Springfield.

Just means most of the team will have to relocate from Bulimba and Hawthorn.
 

Sunraysia

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It was really poorly designed and I agree with your comments about the 80’s feel of the place. The premiership cups also look awkwardly placed. It could be a great venue but needs to be gutted and started again. Perhaps they will build something at Springwood if the facility ever gets built. As a lions fan how do you feel about the Springwood idea, it has the potential to be a Saints at Seaford cock up of the players don’t want to live out there or travel everyday for training. I always thought the Coorparoo kangaroos ground where they used to train was a perfect venue, 5 mins to the Gabba and space to build
Dropped in there for Lunch one day when travelling thru.
The service was lousy - I lost on the pokies (as you do) and it wasn't an enjoyable venue at all.
 

jackenny

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Those ships have long since sailed, gentlemen. You are hardly the first to come up with the idea and more will come after you, just as there will be people like me saying that you are out of your minds. But here's some proof. Yesterday, Collingwood announced that they have sold their two gaming licences, with Geelong and the Western Bulldogs to follow. Melbourne sold off its licences in April. Now why would they do that without some kind of assurances from the AFL that everything would be ok?

There will still be clubs which promote gambling and you can argue all you like that there isn't anything wrong with it, but the AFL doesn't want its club involved with it and will be providing incentive to clubs to cease and desist or else miss out on development money. Besides, you are overlooking the elephant in the room. When Southport Sharks ends its 10 year Patron Sponsorship at the end of 2020, don't you think they'll renew? And when they do renew, where do you think the money is going to come from? Why on Earth would they want a rival club taking away their customers and be paying that club to help do so?

Let the local clubs decide what model is best for them to operate under, but forget about the Suns swimming against the tide to defy the AFL. There's a lot more money in the AFL Broadcast Rights pie than relying on destroying families with poker machines - and if you don't believe they are machines of misery then you've led a protected and privileged life and have been lucky not to have been impacted. For many of the rest of us, it is an issue close to home and I, for one, would cancel my membership if the club opened a pokies venue.
Firstly, I want to reiterate your point that Collingwood are selling their gaming licenses. This is for purely commercial reasons and they still stand to make a great deal of money, so in effect they're still profiting from the "misery" of pokies (just in one large sum rather than increments). It would be a false pretence to say this is some great moral move by the Pies, when in fact those pokies will still be in operation and they'll still be raking in the doe. No AFL assurances necessary.

Secondly, the AFL are the biggest hypocrites when it comes to 'pokies are evil' propaganda. For instance, one of their biggest business partners is CrownBet. It's a weird case of cognitive dissonance that people harp on about the evils of pokies, and laud the AFL's stance and individual clubs for opting out, while those same clubs and the AFL itself are still heavily sponsored by and in corporate partnerships with betting agencies - and will continue to be for years to come. As I said, I view pokies as no different to any other form of gambling, and I think people should understand that pokies are just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to what the AFL are raking in from the gambling industry as a whole.

Lastly and personally speaking, I am no stranger to growing up in a household where gambling and alcohol abuse definitely caused a shadow over my family (speaking of addiction in general terms here), but in saying that, pokies or alcohol weren't the actual problem - if my mother didn't have alcohol, she'd sniff fumes or spray deodorant in her mouth to get her high, or take a pill, or all of the above - and when it came to gambling away the household's money, my mother certainly loved sitting at a pokie machine, but she blew a chunk of money betting with TAB, too (hell, she was just terrible with money full-stop - to such a point that my step-dad controls my parents' finances nowadays, and as for alcohol, she simply gave up cold-turkey - although it probably helps that she takes medication). I am still incredibly proud of my mother for giving up the two things that simply made her non-functioning, of course. My family suffered pretty badly for it. To put it in some perspective (avoiding the really horrible stuff that nobody wants to read about), we had Christmas presents donated to us as kids by our church. We moved constantly. Debtors galore. We would've been homeless if not for the generosity of a church member who rented out a house to my family (at a reduced rate). No doubt my family and I were blessed in a lot of ways (I am not religious, but my life experience has coloured my views on churches being a force for good), but that's not to say I am no stranger to what we're talking about first-hand. In any case, my mother didn't clean up her act and marry my step-father until I was 16, and by that time I'd already left home. So in my pretty visceral experience with gambling addiction and etc, seems to me people are likely to use more avenues than one to get their outlet from, and it stems from personal issues that need addressing more than those actual outlets. In my view, pokie machines are just one avenue for problem gamblers to feed their urge. The issue is the urge itself. (this is obviously a lot of personal info, probably bordering TMI - but it's to let you know I'm really not speaking out of my ass on this)

That's my perspective, anyway. I still don't see pokies as a misery, but this perspective isn't coming from a protected and privileged childhood. I do think addiction specifically is a misery, though.
 
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Big Red Machine

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Dropped in there for Lunch one day when travelling thru.
The service was lousy - I lost on the pokies (as you do) and it wasn't an enjoyable venue at all.
Can confirm, I used to live around the corner and only went there when I was forced to for someone's birthday (Tasteless bastards) or when they had poker tournaments on (Actually not horrible for pub poker standards)

But hey it fits right in in Logan so who am I to judge?
 

Mr Bods

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Big Red Machine

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Ladies and Gents,

Are the laws crazy in this digital age? Yes.

Does the suppression order need to be obeyed. Yes.
From the top.

This is as far as I think we'll take this for now. There are ways to find out with minimal searching.

Lets move it along to something a bit more wholesome

Thank you all for your understanding in this matter.
 
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SUNS

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From the top.

This is as far as I think we'll take this for now. There are ways to find out with minimal searching.

Lets move it along to something a bit more wholesome

Thank you all for your understanding in this matter.
 

17er

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Firstly, I want to reiterate your point that Collingwood are selling their gaming licenses. This is for purely commercial reasons and they still stand to make a great deal of money, so in effect they're still profiting from the "misery" of pokies (just in one large sum rather than increments). It would be a false pretence to say this is some great moral move by the Pies, when in fact those pokies will still be in operation and they'll still be raking in the doe. No AFL assurances necessary.

Secondly, the AFL are the biggest hypocrites when it comes to 'pokies are evil' propaganda. For instance, one of their biggest business partners is CrownBet. It's a weird case of cognitive dissonance that people harp on about the evils of pokies, and laud the AFL's stance and individual clubs for opting out, while those same clubs and the AFL itself are still heavily sponsored by and in corporate partnerships with betting agencies - and will continue to be for years to come. As I said, I view pokies as no different to any other form of gambling, and I think people should understand that pokies are just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to what the AFL are raking in from the gambling industry as a whole.

Lastly and personally speaking, I am no stranger to growing up in a household where gambling and alcohol abuse definitely caused a shadow over my family (speaking of addiction in general terms here), but in saying that, pokies or alcohol weren't the actual problem - if my mother didn't have alcohol, she'd sniff fumes or spray deodorant in her mouth to get her high, or take a pill, or all of the above - and when it came to gambling away the household's money, my mother certainly loved sitting at a pokie machine, but she blew a chunk of money betting with TAB, too (hell, she was just terrible with money full-stop - to such a point that my step-dad controls my parents' finances nowadays, and as for alcohol, she simply gave up cold-turkey - although it probably helps that she takes medication). I am still incredibly proud of my mother for giving up the two things that simply made her non-functioning, of course. My family suffered pretty badly for it. To put it in some perspective (avoiding the really horrible stuff that nobody wants to read about), we had Christmas presents donated to us as kids by our church. We moved constantly. Debtors galore. We would've been homeless if not for the generosity of a church member who rented out a house to my family (at a reduced rate). No doubt my family and I were blessed in a lot of ways (I am not religious, but my life experience has coloured my views on churches being a force for good), but that's not to say I am no stranger to what we're talking about first-hand. In any case, my mother didn't clean up her act and marry my step-father until I was 16, and by that time I'd already left home. So in my pretty visceral experience with gambling addiction and etc, seems to me people are likely to use more avenues than one to get their outlet from, and it stems from personal issues that need addressing more than those actual outlets. In my view, pokie machines are just one avenue for problem gamblers to feed their urge. The issue is the urge itself. (this is obviously a lot of personal info, probably bordering TMI - but it's to let you know I'm really not speaking out of my ass on this)

That's my perspective, anyway. I still don't see pokies as a misery, but this perspective isn't coming from a protected and privileged childhood. I do think addiction specifically is a misery, though.
Thanks for sharing. Always good to have a perspective that comes from an unexpected direction. For the record, I am opposed to all forms of gambling after seeing it destroy my father's life. He's 70, penniless and as his alcoholic dementia increases it looks more likely that I'm going to have to intervene to look after the selfish prick and pay all the associated costs that go with aged care. His last remaining protest against entering aged care is that it would cost him all of his pension and he'd have no money left for gambling. He'd rather die alone in squalor and have money to drink and gamble - he's a year removed from a heart bypass and stroke - than live in 24 hour care and have to give up the two things that have wrecked his life.

It is interesting that you consider all gambling to be the same. My grandmother was the one who infected the whole family, but her gambling was mostly by necessity. In the 50s and 60s, when pokies and casinos were banned in Queensland, people used to buy raffle tickets. The prizes would often be very attractive to women, who were their main targets, and would often include groceries and luxury items like hams. Her rationale was that she couldn't feed 8 kids if the old man drank away his paycheque, so instead of spending every last penny on food, she had tickets in everything. She won big too, but on balance it was just paying it forward until she hit the jackpot. She died penniless in a nursing home, but before the end she put her pension into the pokies, Keno and the nags, going for trips to Twin Towns with all the other Grannies to blow the family inheritance.

My grandparents were heavily involved in the Currumbin RSL, first as founding members in the 40s after the war - both served the entire war in the Navy and Air Force - and then building the new club in the 70s. These days it's a pokie palace, but they do have good food and great bands - the money from the pokies pays for the whole party. There's a modicum of misery, yet the community is served. At least that's the justification.

My question is, why should the Suns pile in on top of the Casino, RSLs, Surf Clubs, Workers Clubs, Footy Clubs, Golf Clubs and Hotels to try to command a bunch of pokies? Pokies vacuum up $2 Billion a year in Queensland and the number of licences is capped. Where are the machines going to come from? Metricon is an isolated stadium and punters simply aren't going to take a hike out there without an associated event. And there are 4 such events this Summer that usually wouldn't add to the bottom line, so the club's revenues look like being positive again in 2019 after years of running in the red until now.

Your unique take on pokies does you credit. I disagree, but you're the one who's got to live with it and you've made your peace. My inclination, based on my own experience and hearing about families such as yours, is to oppose pokies and gaming of all forms from being promoted to families. The Suns is and should always be a family club. There is no need to tarnish that by introducing pokies and I don't believe there will ever be a pokies venue licenced to the Suns.
 

Mr Bods

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Thanks for sharing. Always good to have a perspective that comes from an unexpected direction. For the record, I am opposed to all forms of gambling after seeing it destroy my father's life. He's 70, penniless and as his alcoholic dementia increases it looks more likely that I'm going to have to intervene to look after the selfish prick and pay all the associated costs that go with aged care. His last remaining protest against entering aged care is that it would cost him all of his pension and he'd have no money left for gambling. He'd rather die alone in squalor and have money to drink and gamble - he's a year removed from a heart bypass and stroke - than live in 24 hour care and have to give up the two things that have wrecked his life.

It is interesting that you consider all gambling to be the same. My grandmother was the one who infected the whole family, but her gambling was mostly by necessity. In the 50s and 60s, when pokies and casinos were banned in Queensland, people used to buy raffle tickets. The prizes would often be very attractive to women, who were their main targets, and would often include groceries and luxury items like hams. Her rationale was that she couldn't feed 8 kids if the old man drank away his paycheque, so instead of spending every last penny on food, she had tickets in everything. She won big too, but on balance it was just paying it forward until she hit the jackpot. She died penniless in a nursing home, but before the end she put her pension into the pokies, Keno and the nags, going for trips to Twin Towns with all the other Grannies to blow the family inheritance.

My grandparents were heavily involved in the Currumbin RSL, first as founding members in the 40s after the war - both served the entire war in the Navy and Air Force - and then building the new club in the 70s. These days it's a pokie palace, but they do have good food and great bands - the money from the pokies pays for the whole party. There's a modicum of misery, yet the community is served. At least that's the justification.

My question is, why should the Suns pile in on top of the Casino, RSLs, Surf Clubs, Workers Clubs, Footy Clubs, Golf Clubs and Hotels to try to command a bunch of pokies? Pokies vacuum up $2 Billion a year in Queensland and the number of licences is capped. Where are the machines going to come from? Metricon is an isolated stadium and punters simply aren't going to take a hike out there without an associated event. And there are 4 such events this Summer that usually wouldn't add to the bottom line, so the club's revenues look like being positive again in 2019 after years of running in the red until now.

Your unique take on pokies does you credit. I disagree, but you're the one who's got to live with it and you've made your peace. My inclination, based on my own experience and hearing about families such as yours, is to oppose pokies and gaming of all forms from being promoted to families. The Suns is and should always be a family club. There is no need to tarnish that by introducing pokies and I don't believe there will ever be a pokies venue licenced to the Suns.
My bent will always be not about the Suns Building a Club but us becoming the GC Sharks and hence inheriting their gaming machines.
If the Suns ever built a club it would have to have some Gaming or it wouldn’t survive.
 

17er

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My bent will always be not about the Suns Building a Club but us becoming the GC Sharks and hence inheriting their gaming machines.
If the Suns ever built a club it would have to have some Gaming or it wouldn’t survive.
The Suns have already built a club. It's called Metricon Stadium. It cost the State Government $72 million, Commonwealth Government $36 million, Local Government $23 million and the AFL $13 million (plus $$$$). For the club to make a big enough profit to be viable into the future, this is the asset on which to build on. The two revenue streams the club has at the moment that show the club's viability are memberships and sponsorship, which each run at around $7 million. Without the stadium you couldn't have either, so what the club needs to do better, in addition improving attendances and memberships in order to attract more sponosrship, is built secondary and tertiary income streams.

Merchandising for the Suns runs at around $400K, but in order to capitalise on merch it helps when you win the flag - the only guaranteed method of getting a sales spike. Of course, what would be awesome is for the club to embrace creative ideas and produce lines of Suns clothing and merch that are less corporate and more edgy - stuff you would wear in the street on the weekend.

Facilities at Metricon are under-utilised because the team isn't performing. Once those wins begin to pile up and the Suns become the hot ticket in town, the facilities are going to be found wanting. Horse and cart stuff here, which Docklands Stadium had plenty of issues with in the early days - their first ever AFL game they ran out of pies before Quarter time and Spotless Catering lost the contract. Once 25K becomes the benchmark crowd then gamedays have the opportunity to become massive events - including the cricket.

American Football franchises worked out a long time ago that building these crazy big stadiums with 100K seats or more was useless if the nosebleed seats had a poor view of the game and you weren't able to deliver hospitality to large portions of the crowd. Metricon is built for corporate hospitality and with greater crowds will continue to expand these services. I've worked at some of the best stadiums in the country - MCG, Docklands, Flemington, the Gabba (yes, it is elite) - and in each there are million$ made on non-footy/non-sporting functions. It's all tied up in sponsorship - if your company is going to pay $200K for a corporate box you are going to demand signage - which will double when cricket events grow to 11 a year.
 

GcSunsfan

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We need to team up with Southport and get in on some Pokies Action. Need to sure up our existence by getting onboard the great cash cow.
The sooner we team up with the sharks the better.
I could care less about all the sob stories about people losing everything no one is holding a gun to their heads and forcing them to play the pokies.

I love going to the sharks once a week and having a feed and putting $10 in the pokies and I would enjoy it even more if i knew some of that money was going to the mighty Suns
 

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The sooner we team up with the sharks the better.
I could care less about all the sob stories about people losing everything no one is holding a gun to their heads and forcing them to play the pokies.

I love going to the sharks once a week and having a feed and putting $10 in the pokies and I would enjoy it even more if i knew some of that money was going to the mighty Suns
Southport Sharks sponsor the Gold Coast Suns to the tune of $1 million a year and have done since Foundation. That's $8 million down and 2 years left on the deal. The Sharks could always pony up more $$ next time.
 

jackenny

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Your unique take on pokies does you credit. I disagree, but you're the one who's got to live with it and you've made your peace. My inclination, based on my own experience and hearing about families such as yours, is to oppose pokies and gaming of all forms from being promoted to families. The Suns is and should always be a family club. There is no need to tarnish that by introducing pokies and I don't believe there will ever be a pokies venue licenced to the Suns.
I would be surprised if the Suns invested in pokies. That horse has bolted, honestly. The reason clubs like the Pies and Hawks can rest easy, at least in my opinion, is that they invested in these licenses ages ago, have made up for their initial investments (these licenses aren't free, so it's not really a license to print money), but realistically pokies and social clubs aren't the only kinds of businesses the Suns can invest in to make a profit, anyway. As you pointed out, there's money to be made utilising their very best asset: a huge stadium. The Gold Coast is the perfect spot for a huge stadium, too - one of the more beautiful spots in Queensland, a perfect spot to host international functions, including the Commonwealth Games (personally, I grew up in the Wide Bay area, before moving down to Victoria for uni/work, but I have a sister who lives on the Gold Coast who I see every Christmas).

But going back, I still find Melbourne a poor example of how to do this, because their business strategy (as they put it), is to live off the large sum for selling their pokies while twiddling their thumbs, hoping for greater gate takings to make up for the revenue hole. As opposed to Collingwood who I find immensely more sensible, taking a far more proactive stance, and stand to make a greater lump sum after an extremely lucrative deal with the Melbourne Racing Club. This is speaking from a purely business perspective, of course.

Morally, well, we just disagree, but there's absolutely no harm in that, IMO. Thank you for sharing your experiences in any case. I have to admit the mention of your father going through dementia struck pretty similar to issues with my mum nowadays, too. She's taking medication already to try and stave off its effects (her mother had dementia, so it's probably genetic - although I'm no medical professional, my mum is... you'd be shocked how high up she is in the QLD health hierarchy considering all the stuff I've told you, amazing how quick things turned around for her when she gave up booze and gambling).
 

Iva Bigun

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Thanks for sharing. Always good to have a perspective that comes from an unexpected direction. For the record, I am opposed to all forms of gambling after seeing it destroy my father's life. He's 70, penniless and as his alcoholic dementia increases it looks more likely that I'm going to have to intervene to look after the selfish prick and pay all the associated costs that go with aged care. His last remaining protest against entering aged care is that it would cost him all of his pension and he'd have no money left for gambling. He'd rather die alone in squalor and have money to drink and gamble - he's a year removed from a heart bypass and stroke - than live in 24 hour care and have to give up the two things that have wrecked his life.

It is interesting that you consider all gambling to be the same. My grandmother was the one who infected the whole family, but her gambling was mostly by necessity. In the 50s and 60s, when pokies and casinos were banned in Queensland, people used to buy raffle tickets. The prizes would often be very attractive to women, who were their main targets, and would often include groceries and luxury items like hams. Her rationale was that she couldn't feed 8 kids if the old man drank away his paycheque, so instead of spending every last penny on food, she had tickets in everything. She won big too, but on balance it was just paying it forward until she hit the jackpot. She died penniless in a nursing home, but before the end she put her pension into the pokies, Keno and the nags, going for trips to Twin Towns with all the other Grannies to blow the family inheritance.

My grandparents were heavily involved in the Currumbin RSL, first as founding members in the 40s after the war - both served the entire war in the Navy and Air Force - and then building the new club in the 70s. These days it's a pokie palace, but they do have good food and great bands - the money from the pokies pays for the whole party. There's a modicum of misery, yet the community is served. At least that's the justification.

My question is, why should the Suns pile in on top of the Casino, RSLs, Surf Clubs, Workers Clubs, Footy Clubs, Golf Clubs and Hotels to try to command a bunch of pokies? Pokies vacuum up $2 Billion a year in Queensland and the number of licences is capped. Where are the machines going to come from? Metricon is an isolated stadium and punters simply aren't going to take a hike out there without an associated event. And there are 4 such events this Summer that usually wouldn't add to the bottom line, so the club's revenues look like being positive again in 2019 after years of running in the red until now.

Your unique take on pokies does you credit. I disagree, but you're the one who's got to live with it and you've made your peace. My inclination, based on my own experience and hearing about families such as yours, is to oppose pokies and gaming of all forms from being promoted to families. The Suns is and should always be a family club. There is no need to tarnish that by introducing pokies and I don't believe there will ever be a pokies venue licenced to the Suns.
Inheritance is BS, If you earned it, spend it.

Give your kids the best education and support you can but ultimately make their own success in life
 
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If he did it! But still, this year 72 women have been murdered in Australia and 20 kids, most of them by their ex partners. Why has it taken 30 years to work out it was this guy?
Shit Police work. Most people have no understanding of just how dumb/corrupt/lazy and incompetent many police officers around the world are.
 

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Shit Police work. Most people have no understanding of just how dumb/corrupt/lazy and incompetent many police officers around the world are.
You got that right. Police have a toxic culture which is 100% unionised so that none of them ever gets convicted of anything and the worst cops are protected from being uncovered instead of the same effort going into protecting the weak and vulnerable.
 

Iva Bigun

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You got that right. Police have a toxic culture which is 100% unionised so that none of them ever gets convicted of anything and the worst cops are protected from being uncovered instead of the same effort going into protecting the weak and vulnerable.
Sorry but I don’t agree, there are good and bad in all workplaces. To tarnish the entire culture as toxic is about as accurate as the Vics media’s “Suns are a basket case” story line.
 
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Sorry but I don’t agree, there are good and bad in all workplaces. To tarnish the entire culture as toxic is about as accurate as the Vics media’s “Suns are a basket case” story line.
The fact is that Police often simply don't face the same level of Treatment(by fellow officers) or justice as ordinary citizens do when they are either suspected of, or convicted of a crime. I really don't know how the ''boys club'' mentality isn't seen by some, perhaps others don't watch shows like Four Corners & Foreign Correspondent or have a keen interest in cases where police are found to either be suspects in a crime or are being accused of corruption as I do.

Every time the cops take on a ''He's one of us, we protect our own'' approach they grow the divide of mistrust between communities and themselves and plant another seed of a ''it's us vs them'' mentality, which is a natural defensive response to a stressful job where over time the perceived threats can force a person into that protective group think mentality. There lies the problem, that ''brotherhood'' mentality can become a slippery slope not unlike criminal culture.

It only takes 1 cop, who's heavy handed and beats someone to a pulp in their cell to start a chain reaction of Police covering for each other, (because hey,that guy was a scumbag junkie who spat in officer such & such's face and deserved it anyway, so why should such & such lose his job and his livelihood over that loser) that is ultimately Police corruption, it can happen that easy and there is almost certainly a culture of ''don't snitch on your mates'' that is undeniably similar to that in criminal cultures.

So too summarise, I am not saying that all cops are bad and corrupt but until they start dobbing in their own and facing the same penalties as the rest of us they do not deserve the peoples trust or respect as an organisation and their ''brotherhood'' can most definitely be called a ''Toxic culture".

Just my two cents worth.
 

Iva Bigun

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Many years ago I was bashed by a police officer, my parents complained and I was not believed. Until his partner a young police woman stood up and told the truth, showing courage and a willingness to do what is right.

There is good and bad in all sectors of life
 
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