VFL/AFL Reserves & Under-19 Records?

rbartlett

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I do not know the answer to that. Perhaps they do, I imagine people asking here for assistance are hoping to find all the details in one spot, wishing to avoid going from club to club. It's simply my guess that many of the older records (perhaps especially when it comes to Reserves and Under-19s) wouldn't be kept, at least by some clubs.

Does anyone have a more reliable answer to the question that's been posed? Rhett ( rbartlett ), perhaps?
Well, Richmond as an example have never had a list of U19 results or Reserve results.
They have a strong Footy Record collection, but there is nothing existing at the club that list U19/Reserve results
Only recently have we come across gamexgame stats for U19/Reserves players from 1978 onwards in the collectoin.
Hence all that is now in / continues to be updated in Tigerland Archive.
Hope that sheds some light ?
 

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mianfei

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So has anyone managed to get the complete scores for the V/AFL Reserves from 1919-1999? If not we are planning on moving onto the Reserves straight after we finish the VFA (which should be by early August).
I don’t think anyone has complete Reserves scores; however there is a section on Hawthorn Reserves elsewhere on BigFooty (click here and subsequent pages) which has all the match scores but not quarter-by-quarter.

The article – which I have posted in myself – says that Under-19 scores are hard to obtain, but reading the Sun a few days ago I did note that on the infamous wet day of 23 May 1953 (when a champion Footscray defence came close to holding Fitzroy scoreless in the seniors) Hawthorn’s Under-19s were held by Collingwood to 0-7 (7). Thus, if that’s any guide results of Under-19 matches should be available from at least 1953 till the competition was disbanded after the close of the 1991 season.

The problem is quarter-by-quarter scores – which can be very hard to obtain as I can testify from working on the WA(N)FL over a number of years on Wikipedia.
 

worbod

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Whilst not the same thing, one stat which is available are the overall reserves win-loss records of all teams from 1919-1999, as printed in Kevin Taylor's "Footy Stats 2000".
 

mianfei

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Whilst not the same thing, one stat which is available are the overall reserves win-loss records of all teams from 1919-1999, as printed in Kevin Taylor's "Footy Stats 2000".
Would the Under-19 records have been compiled in 1991 or 1992 when that competition was disbanded?

There are some fascinating known statistics – for instance that St. Kilda’s Under-19s from 1977 to 1982 won only twenty and drew three of 131 games (a success rate of 16.41%, five percent worse than Hawthorn from 1925 to 1953), and that St. Kilda’s Reserves between 1970 and 1981 never won more than seven matches in any season and had an overall record of 63—197—2 or a success rate of 24.43%.

Geelong
’s reserves in 1930 and Essendon’s Under-19s in 1950 both went through the whole season undefeated – at a time when variable weather conditions made doing so more difficult than it would be today. Melbourne’s Under-19s in 1967 stand as the last club in any grade to finish winless, whilst Hawthorn’s reserves were winless in 1932, though they provided the Gardiner Medal winner in Dick Logan. (For comparison the best performance in the Brownlow for a club with no wins is 17 votes, nine shy of the winner, by North Melbourne’s John Lewis in 1931, followed by 13 votes and seventh position by Kevin Murray in 1964). The Hawks’ reserves were also winless, but had one draw each, in 1945 and 1946.
 

rbartlett

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stemline

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Hawthorn's U19 record appears to be
Played 898
Won 392
Lost 498
Drew 8

I'm missing final scores for pretty much all of 1946, 1947 and 1948, but have the rest. (I do have the final W/L/D numbers for each year). I've spent time at the Vic Library, can't really dig anything up on those seasons with regards to game scores. If anyone has any of them, I'd love you hear from you.
 

rbartlett

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Hawthorn's U19 record appears to be
Played 898
Won 392
Lost 498
Drew 8

I'm missing final scores for pretty much all of 1946, 1947 and 1948, but have the rest. (I do have the final W/L/D numbers for each year). I've spent time at the Vic Library, can't really dig anything up on those seasons with regards to game scores. If anyone has any of them, I'd love you hear from you.
Just incase you havent got this one
1947 Rd5, 17 May, W67, Richmond 15.18.108 def Hawthorn 6.5.41
 

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Gibbsy

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Yeah that's the current source we have for those years, but would like to get the q-q.
Gigs, australianfootball and anyone else who is interested...
Here's the 2000 VFL Reserves round by round results, each in their own individual file saved from the old VFL website via the Wayback Machine. Note that these files didn't have the venues on the match detail page but I can glean that info from elsewhere if need be.

All matches include quarter by quarter scores, best players, and goal kickers, except....

  • Rd 1 FRA v PM – no bests / goals
  • Rd 2 BH v FRA – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 2 NBAL v SAN – no QBQ
  • Rd 2 PM v WIL – no QBQ
  • Rd 2 WER v SPR– no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 3 FRA v COB – no QBQ
  • Rd 3 NBAL v PM – no QBQ
  • Rd 3 SAN v NBUL – no QBQ
  • Rd 3 WER v BH – no QBQ
  • Rd 3 WIL v SPR – no QBQ
  • Rd 4 SPR v NB – no QBQ
  • Rd 11 WIL v COB – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 12 NBAL v SPR – no QBQ
  • Rd 13 BH v COB – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 13 NBUL v PM – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 14 SAN v WER – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 18 BH v COB – Box Hill won on forfeit
  • QF 1 SAN v BH – no QBQ / bests / goals

I will get around to doing 2001 soon as I believe it's available; the pre-2000 years may prove a little tougher.

Cheers,
Gibbsy
 

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Gibbsy

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Moderator #239
Season 2001 of the VFL Reserves now available!

Again, same source, and again all matches include quarter by quarter scores, best players, and goal kickers, except....

  • Rd 4 WIL v SPR – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 10 PM v FRA – no bests / goals for FRA
  • Rd 10 SPR v COB – no bests / goals for SPR
  • Rd 13 PM v WER – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 13 BH v COB – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 14 NBAL v SPR – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • SF 1 WER v COB – no QBQ / bests / goals
Enjoy :)
 

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Gibbsy

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That's brilliant. Are the goalkickers and best players available online anywhere for 2002 onwards?
In a way, yes, via the SLV Football Record archive. 2002 records are scanned, but everything 2003 onwards is all digitally imported. Still, text recognition exists for every Record on the site so it's just a matter of extracting the data manually (which is time consuming but certainly worth it for a site like AF.com)

Here's an example from '02. They have QbQ, Bests, and Goals for the VFL, TAC Cup, WAFL, SANFL, QSL, AFL Canberra and Sydney AFL. Most likely the Tassie league as well but I didn't look past the few rounds.

VFL Rd 1 2002.png
 

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Sorry, I wasn't clear - I don't think that's VFL Reserves though, is it? Whereas the stuff you posted on the weekend was... Just wondering if you have access to Gls/Bst for VFL Reserves beyond 2001...

I'd be very keen on obtaining them from you if you do... Cheers
 
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Gibbsy

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Sorry, I wasn't clear - I don't think that's VFL Reserves though, is it? Whereas the stuff you posted on the weekend was... Just wondering if you have access to Gls/Bst for VFL Reserves beyond 2001...

I'd be very keen on obtaining them from you if you do... Cheers
Haha, I just blanked out. You're right, that's VFL seniors above. Dunno what I was thinking!
I may be able to get some more, bear with me a few days
 

barrackers

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Sorry, I wasn't clear - I don't think that's VFL Reserves though, is it? Whereas the stuff you posted on the weekend was... Just wondering if you have access to Gls/Bst for VFL Reserves beyond 2001...

I'd be very keen on obtaining them from you if you do... Cheers
Sporting pulse still has goals/best for a few years although unlike 2011 onwards they're not linked to the main VFL page. Of those which have goals/best:

2003-2005 - on a very quick look 2003, 2004 seem complete, 2005 seems to stop at R10
http://www.sportingpulse.com/comp_info.cgi?c=1-2975-0-33668-0&pool=1&round=0&a=FIXTURE

2010 - seems to be all of 2010
http://websites.sportstg.com/comp_info.cgi?round=1&a=ROUND&client=1-118-10449-102873-0&pool=1
 

stemline

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Sporting pulse still has goals/best for a few years although unlike 2011 onwards they're not linked to the main VFL page. Of those which have goals/best:

2003-2005 - on a very quick look 2003, 2004 seem complete, 2005 seems to stop at R10
http://www.sportingpulse.com/comp_info.cgi?c=1-2975-0-33668-0&pool=1&round=0&a=FIXTURE

2010 - seems to be all of 2010
http://websites.sportstg.com/comp_info.cgi?round=1&a=ROUND&client=1-118-10449-102873-0&pool=1
Thanks very much for those.

Unfortunately the second half of 2005 seems to be missing, but that's still a good get for a couple of complete seasons.

Cheers
 

Gibbsy

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Thanks very much for those.

Unfortunately the second half of 2005 seems to be missing, but that's still a good get for a couple of complete seasons.

Cheers
Might be a sage idea to back all those web pages up / download them to a zip if you could

Ideally australianfootball (Oliver Gigacz) can make good use of these
 

Gibbsy

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Sorry, I wasn't clear - I don't think that's VFL Reserves though, is it? Whereas the stuff you posted on the weekend was... Just wondering if you have access to Gls/Bst for VFL Reserves beyond 2001...

I'd be very keen on obtaining them from you if you do... Cheers
True to my word, here's the 2002 season :thumbsu:

Like my other posts, all matches include quarter by quarter scores, best players, and goal kickers, except....

  • Rd 1 NBAL v WIL – no bests / goals for WIL
  • Rd 2 PM v BH – no bests for BH
  • SGW Rd SPR v WIL – no bests / goals
  • Rd 16 SPR v COB – no bests / goals
  • Rd 19 SPR v WIL – no bests / goals
The 'SGW Round' is the State Game Weekend Round that saw two VFL Reserves games played on the same weekend that the VFL rep team played in a state game. So that they could still align each round name with the VFL senior competition, this round wasn't given a number and was basically considered an 'in between' round that occurred in the week off between Rounds 10 and 11. To avoid confusion with the source I've listed all the rounds as they were originally listed, but you may note that the Australian Football website lists the SGW Round as Round 11 and all subsequent rounds get pushed back to the next number, which I think is the best way to list it in posterity.

Enjoy
Gibbsy
 

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Gigs, australianfootball and anyone else who is interested...
Here's the 2000 VFL Reserves round by round results, each in their own individual file saved from the old VFL website via the Wayback Machine. Note that these files didn't have the venues on the match detail page but I can glean that info from elsewhere if need be.

All matches include quarter by quarter scores, best players, and goal kickers, except....

  • Rd 1 FRA v PM – no bests / goals
  • Rd 2 BH v FRA – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 2 NBAL v SAN – no QBQ
  • Rd 2 PM v WIL – no QBQ
  • Rd 2 WER v SPR– no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 3 FRA v COB – no QBQ
  • Rd 3 NBAL v PM – no QBQ
  • Rd 3 SAN v NBUL – no QBQ
  • Rd 3 WER v BH – no QBQ
  • Rd 3 WIL v SPR – no QBQ
  • Rd 4 SPR v NB – no QBQ
  • Rd 11 WIL v COB – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 12 NBAL v SPR – no QBQ
  • Rd 13 BH v COB – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 13 NBUL v PM – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 14 SAN v WER – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 18 BH v COB – Box Hill won on forfeit
  • QF 1 SAN v BH – no QBQ / bests / goals

I will get around to doing 2001 soon as I believe it's available; the pre-2000 years may prove a little tougher.

Cheers,
Gibbsy
I got hold of the Box Hill annual report, so can give you some of the missing info here -

R2 Box Hill 6.5 13.5 20.10 22.12 (144) d. Frankston 2.1 5.6 10.8 12.10 (82).
BH Goals: R.Ablett 7, T.Hedge 3, E.Parthenedis 3, P.Ginaopoulos 2, M.Matthews 2, P.Beaumont, D.Holland, A.Huggins, D.Loats, L.Picioane.
BH Best: Not published :(

R3 - they are missing QBQ also.

R13 BH 5.7 11.12 18.14 29.18 (192) d. Coburg-Fitzroy 3.2 4.4 5.6 7.7 (49)
BH Goals: K.Simkin 8, T.Hazell 4, J.Baird 3, T.Bayford 2, A.Clark 2, D.Hueston 2, A.Huggins 2, P.O'Connor 2, A.Seddon 2, P.Beaumont, A.Hartin.
BH Best: L.Jenkins, K.Simkin, B.Hartin, A.McCartney, R.Ablett, T.Bayford.

Sorry they don't list opposition Goals/Best.
 

stemline

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Season 2001 of the VFL Reserves now available!

Again, same source, and again all matches include quarter by quarter scores, best players, and goal kickers, except....

  • Rd 4 WIL v SPR – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 10 PM v FRA – no bests / goals for FRA
  • Rd 10 SPR v COB – no bests / goals for SPR
  • Rd 13 PM v WER – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 13 BH v COB – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • Rd 14 NBAL v SPR – no QBQ / bests / goals
  • SF 1 WER v COB – no QBQ / bests / goals
Enjoy :)
Again, got the Box Hill annual report -

R13 BH 2.3 2.11 3.15 4.18 (42) d. by Coburg 1.2 1.2 6.4 7.5 (47)
BH Goals: M.Ball, L.Morse, P.O'Connor, J.Solomon.
BH Best: S.Habberfield, M.Watts, B.Neagle, J.Solomon.

For the best players missing from the Box Hill game in 2002, the annual report lists them as Not Published :(
 
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