VFL to become 'Eastern AFL' in 2021?

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MegaA

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Mar 20, 2018
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Not all clubs. There are not any Box Hill supporters left who are not also Hawthorn supporters. A coupe of dozen were still going t games after the merger but all dropped off after the club adopted the Hawthorn jumper around a decade ago. Also I am pretty sure not single Springvale fan still goes to games at Casey.
Bullants are a little different - they have a sister club Northen Bullants in the VAFA who play nearby, and Preston Bullants is a strong junior club who also play at Cramer St.

The post said the old VFA clubs, i wouldnt consider Box Hill, Casey or Sandringham to be old VFA clubs because reality is that their AFL affiliates have taken over their club and are moreso reserve teams for their conterpart rather than a old VFA club. The stand alone clubs of Werribee, Williamstown, Port Melbourne, Coburg, Frankston are the ones that comment was directed to all of which have supporters who put their club ahead of any other club *including AFL clubs*. Personally i know several Port supporters who have not missed a single home and away game for years, others have been members for decades.
 

Rickee

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The post said the old VFA clubs, i wouldnt consider Box Hill, Casey or Sandringham to be old VFA clubs because reality is that their AFL affiliates have taken over their club and are moreso reserve teams for their conterpart rather than a old VFA club. The stand alone clubs of Werribee, Williamstown, Port Melbourne, Coburg, Frankston are the ones that comment was directed to all of which have supporters who put their club ahead of any other club *including AFL clubs*. Personally i know several Port supporters who have not missed a single home and away game for years, others have been members for decades.
Box Hill entered the VFA in 1951, Sandringham in 1929 and Casey (under it's former identity of Springvale) in 1982. Those clubs are most certainly part of the history of the VFA. As we saw with Preston, I'd suggest if Hawthorn, Melbourne and St Kilda decided to pull out of those clubs there would be ample opportunity to reform as stand alone clubs, Sandi retains their original identity (for now) and link with the Dragons and Casey has the backing of the the council and the precinct at Casey Fields. It might be harder for Box Hill, but they could get there.
 

Tackle Bag

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Box Hill entered the VFA in 1951, Sandringham in 1929 and Casey (under it's former identity of Springvale) in 1982. Those clubs are most certainly part of the history of the VFA. As we saw with Preston, I'd suggest if Hawthorn, Melbourne and St Kilda decided to pull out of those clubs there would be ample opportunity to reform as stand alone clubs, Sandi retains their original identity (for now) and link with the Dragons and Casey has the backing of the the council and the precinct at Casey Fields. It might be harder for Box Hill, but they could get there.
Casey might have council backing but no one follows them. Huge waste of money by Casey Council. Maybe if they separated from Melbourne and filled their list with local guys they might get some traction.
 

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Derby103

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Apr 20, 2006
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Casey might have council backing but no one follows them. Huge waste of money by Casey Council. Maybe if they separated from Melbourne and filled their list with local guys they might get some traction.
I agree with that. I wonder now if Springvale's decision to join the VFA in 1982 was a good one or not. Yes, the club won some VFA flags and played in front of big crowds and featured on TV. But it was all over in less than 20 years, and now there is no Springvale FC, just a zombie club controlled by Melbourne. On the other hand, big neighbouring clubs like Noble Park remained in lower-profile suburban competitions and are probably stronger than they've ever been these days.

Box Hill attracted very small crowds when I first started regularly following VFA matches in 1981. The crowd at the Box Hill v Oakleigh match early that season was just 866 as Box Hill was still very weak at the time (and had been for a decade). But there was a large latent supporter base just waiting for the club to improve. When Box Hill played Oakleigh in the last round of 1983, a crowd of 6250 watched Oakleigh take the finals spot on offer. The same two clubs attracted 10,736 to the 1984 Second Division grand final which easily outdrew the crowd at the First Division GF that year. I wouldn't think that any of that support still exists. Football followers can tell the difference between a club that is striving to win a flag on its own account and a team that is topped up by AFL fringe players who are mainly out to advance themselves.
 

Breretonisahood

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I agree with that. I wonder now if Springvale's decision to join the VFA in 1982 was a good one or not. Yes, the club won some VFA flags and played in front of big crowds and featured on TV. But it was all over in less than 20 years, and now there is no Springvale FC, just a zombie club controlled by Melbourne. On the other hand, big neighbouring clubs like Noble Park remained in lower-profile suburban competitions and are probably stronger than they've ever been these days.

Box Hill attracted very small crowds when I first started regularly following VFA matches in 1981. The crowd at the Box Hill v Oakleigh match early that season was just 866 as Box Hill was still very weak at the time (and had been for a decade). But there was a large latent supporter base just waiting for the club to improve. When Box Hill played Oakleigh in the last round of 1983, a crowd of 6250 watched Oakleigh take the finals spot on offer. The same two clubs attracted 10,736 to the 1984 Second Division grand final which easily outdrew the crowd at the First Division GF that year. I wouldn't think that any of that support still exists. Football followers can tell the difference between a club that is striving to win a flag on its own account and a team that is topped up by AFL fringe players who are mainly out to advance themselves.
Box Hill would collapse if they tried to stand alone. Neighbouring clubs Balwyn, Doncaster and Blackburn in the EFL have more supporters.
 

footyfan1978

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Have not really looked at this for months with so much in the air of Co-Vid related effects on footy making it so harder for anyone to really plan ahead well.
So 2021 looks to be a transition year of some sorts.
So it got announced 22 teams will play in for lack of better words, Hard Yakka Workwear Eastern Seaboard League in 2021
16 rounds from April but I not heard any other info than that on whom playing whom how many times and what type of finals series is planned.
I doubt they got that far planned either and had to wait until AFL list sizes sorted out.

From what I can gather AFL clubs will work with list sizes of 44 in 2021 which leaves their reserves team in Eastern league here needing some sort of top up players each week. I do not know if there is some planned supplementary list for this league for those clubs or will be allowed to play a few under 19 players in their team each week from the Under 19 Nab League. I think the later seems likely. Most AFL clubs are going to need 3 to 8 top up players most weeks.

With no mention of what home and away series is planned or finals series I had a brief thought about it and think the best way of dealing with this transitional 2021 year is to have two ladders for the 16 rounds.
Maybe honour Phil Cleary for the second tier community clubs with a Phil Cleary Ladder and Ron Barassi for his visions of expanded national league with the Ron Barassi Ladder
The 11 clubs that are reserve teams for AFL clubs compete on Ron Barassi Ladder and the 11 community based second-tier clubs on the Phil Cleary Ladder.

Barassi Group
Brisbane Lions
Gold Coast
GWS Giants
Sydney Swans
Carlton
Collingwood
Essendon
Footscray
Geelong
North Melbourne
Richmond

Phil Cleary Group
Aspley
Southport
Coburg
Frankston
Preston Bullants
Port Melbourne
Werribee
Williamstown
Sandringham
Box Hill Hawks
Casey Demons

You play the 10 teams in your group and then 6 other games against teams from other group in those 16 rounds and then after 4 months the bottom three teams from both ladders are eliminated for the season.
You then have the top 8 teams from both ladders play a four week final 8 series for both ladders and then the two winners of each group meet in the grand final after that for the East Coast Premiership title for 2021 transitional season.

I think it makes sense to try to have Aspley and Southport play each other twice, Lions and Suns twice and then one game against Swans or Giants to round out their 16 home and away rounds to cut down on costs of interstate travel. The other clubs based in Victoria can work out the best balance of how to play their 6 games from other group but cannot see any need for any clubs needing to travel interstate beyond 4 or 5 times in those 16 home and away rounds if they use some common sense to keep interstate trips to a reasonable level. They should also try to align AFL clubs reserve teams playing same club their senior club in AFL are doing on same weekend as much as possible. We do not need this bullshit situation of emergency players not getting a game in either side on same weekend so most of their reserve games should be played as either curtain raisers to allow most of emergencies to play or their game on Sunday arvo, after AFL team already played so all emergencies can play in their reserve team when their senior team did not need them.
 

JohnRhys

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Have not really looked at this for months with so much in the air of Co-Vid related effects on footy making it so harder for anyone to really plan ahead well.
So 2021 looks to be a transition year of some sorts.
So it got announced 22 teams will play in for lack of better words, Hard Yakka Workwear Eastern Seaboard League in 2021
16 rounds from April but I not heard any other info than that on whom playing whom how many times and what type of finals series is planned.
I doubt they got that far planned either and had to wait until AFL list sizes sorted out.

From what I can gather AFL clubs will work with list sizes of 44 in 2021 which leaves their reserves team in Eastern league here needing some sort of top up players each week. I do not know if there is some planned supplementary list for this league for those clubs or will be allowed to play a few under 19 players in their team each week from the Under 19 Nab League. I think the later seems likely. Most AFL clubs are going to need 3 to 8 top up players most weeks.

With no mention of what home and away series is planned or finals series I had a brief thought about it and think the best way of dealing with this transitional 2021 year is to have two ladders for the 16 rounds.
Maybe honour Phil Cleary for the second tier community clubs with a Phil Cleary Ladder and Ron Barassi for his visions of expanded national league with the Ron Barassi Ladder
The 11 clubs that are reserve teams for AFL clubs compete on Ron Barassi Ladder and the 11 community based second-tier clubs on the Phil Cleary Ladder.

Barassi Group
Brisbane Lions
Gold Coast
GWS Giants
Sydney Swans
Carlton
Collingwood
Essendon
Footscray
Geelong
North Melbourne
Richmond

Phil Cleary Group
Aspley
Southport
Coburg
Frankston
Preston Bullants
Port Melbourne
Werribee
Williamstown
Sandringham
Box Hill Hawks
Casey Demons

You play the 10 teams in your group and then 6 other games against teams from other group in those 16 rounds and then after 4 months the bottom three teams from both ladders are eliminated for the season.
You then have the top 8 teams from both ladders play a four week final 8 series for both ladders and then the two winners of each group meet in the grand final after that for the East Coast Premiership title for 2021 transitional season.

I think it makes sense to try to have Aspley and Southport play each other twice, Lions and Suns twice and then one game against Swans or Giants to round out their 16 home and away rounds to cut down on costs of interstate travel. The other clubs based in Victoria can work out the best balance of how to play their 6 games from other group but cannot see any need for any clubs needing to travel interstate beyond 4 or 5 times in those 16 home and away rounds if they use some common sense to keep interstate trips to a reasonable level. They should also try to align AFL clubs reserve teams playing same club their senior club in AFL are doing on same weekend as much as possible. We do not need this bullshit situation of emergency players not getting a game in either side on same weekend so most of their reserve games should be played as either curtain raisers to allow most of emergencies to play or their game on Sunday arvo, after AFL team already played so all emergencies can play in their reserve team when their senior team did not need them.

Is this official or just your own idea ?
 

footyfan1978

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So it got announced 22 teams will play in for lack of better words, Hard Yakka Workwear Eastern Seaboard League in 2021
16 rounds from April but I not heard any other info than that on whom playing whom how many times and what type of finals series is planned.
I doubt they got that far planned either and had to wait until AFL list sizes sorted out.


With no mention of what home and away series is planned or finals series I had a brief thought about it and think the best way of dealing with this transitional 2021 year is to have two ladders for the 16 rounds.
Is this official or just your own idea ?
Me just having a 5 minute idea of what they could do.
I doubt they be doing what I thought about.
 

TheTassieHawk

Debutant
Oct 12, 2019
140
98
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Have not really looked at this for months with so much in the air of Co-Vid related effects on footy making it so harder for anyone to really plan ahead well.
So 2021 looks to be a transition year of some sorts.
So it got announced 22 teams will play in for lack of better words, Hard Yakka Workwear Eastern Seaboard League in 2021
16 rounds from April but I not heard any other info than that on whom playing whom how many times and what type of finals series is planned.
I doubt they got that far planned either and had to wait until AFL list sizes sorted out.

From what I can gather AFL clubs will work with list sizes of 44 in 2021 which leaves their reserves team in Eastern league here needing some sort of top up players each week. I do not know if there is some planned supplementary list for this league for those clubs or will be allowed to play a few under 19 players in their team each week from the Under 19 Nab League. I think the later seems likely. Most AFL clubs are going to need 3 to 8 top up players most weeks.

With no mention of what home and away series is planned or finals series I had a brief thought about it and think the best way of dealing with this transitional 2021 year is to have two ladders for the 16 rounds.
Maybe honour Phil Cleary for the second tier community clubs with a Phil Cleary Ladder and Ron Barassi for his visions of expanded national league with the Ron Barassi Ladder
The 11 clubs that are reserve teams for AFL clubs compete on Ron Barassi Ladder and the 11 community based second-tier clubs on the Phil Cleary Ladder.

Barassi Group
Brisbane Lions
Gold Coast
GWS Giants
Sydney Swans
Carlton
Collingwood
Essendon
Footscray
Geelong
North Melbourne
Richmond

Phil Cleary Group
Aspley
Southport
Coburg
Frankston
Preston Bullants
Port Melbourne
Werribee
Williamstown
Sandringham
Box Hill Hawks
Casey Demons

You play the 10 teams in your group and then 6 other games against teams from other group in those 16 rounds and then after 4 months the bottom three teams from both ladders are eliminated for the season.
You then have the top 8 teams from both ladders play a four week final 8 series for both ladders and then the two winners of each group meet in the grand final after that for the East Coast Premiership title for 2021 transitional season.

I think it makes sense to try to have Aspley and Southport play each other twice, Lions and Suns twice and then one game against Swans or Giants to round out their 16 home and away rounds to cut down on costs of interstate travel. The other clubs based in Victoria can work out the best balance of how to play their 6 games from other group but cannot see any need for any clubs needing to travel interstate beyond 4 or 5 times in those 16 home and away rounds if they use some common sense to keep interstate trips to a reasonable level. They should also try to align AFL clubs reserve teams playing same club their senior club in AFL are doing on same weekend as much as possible. We do not need this bullshit situation of emergency players not getting a game in either side on same weekend so most of their reserve games should be played as either curtain raisers to allow most of emergencies to play or their game on Sunday arvo, after AFL team already played so all emergencies can play in their reserve team when their senior team did not need them.
Personally I would go with a top 5 or top 6 in each group/conference rather than having 16 of 22 sides make finals.
 

Rickee

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The last couple of official social media posts I've read have named this comp the "VFL and East Coast Second-Tier Competition". Which surely can't be the final official name. Still nothing on fixtures or anything of the sort, which is troubling as it's almost December, and the comp usually starts in March.
 

The Victorian

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The last couple of official social media posts I've read have named this comp the "VFL and East Coast Second-Tier Competition". Which surely can't be the final official name. Still nothing on fixtures or anything of the sort, which is troubling as it's almost December, and the comp usually starts in March.
We are still waiting for AFLW fixtures and that starts in Feb
 

GrumpyOldMan_NC

Monday's Expert
Feb 1, 2018
175
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Here's a report on what the AFL has planned for VFL next year, 'lab rat' for the AFL. Rule changes, three players from both sides in the 50 for ALL stoppages, player on mark only allowed 'minimal' lateral movement and kick out 15 metres out rather than 10. Thoughts anyone? Should the VFL be used for experiments?

 

footyfan1978

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Personally I would go with a top 5 or top 6 in each group/conference rather than having 16 of 22 sides make finals.
Not against a top 5 but the reason I was thinking 8 was simply because 16 rounds is so much shorter than 22 rounds you need more teams involved for a few more weeks so AFL clubs still got their players out of their senior 22 playing a few more matches beyond the end of July. Basically if you do it a final 8 from both ladder groups you get 6 out of 22 teams finished for the season at end of July, then 4 more eliminated a week later, then 4 more a week later, and again a week after that. The other problem you introduce if you do not make it a final 8 is the top team does not play the week after 16 rounds is completed in the final 5 and often if they win their first final they then get another rest the week after. That is not ideal for keeping players out of your senior team playing some matches to be ready for seniors in late August and coming AFL finals. We want these second tier teams having as much games as possible, not less.
 

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Dogs till i die

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Here's a report on what the AFL has planned for VFL next year, 'lab rat' for the AFL. Rule changes, three players from both sides in the 50 for ALL stoppages, player on mark only allowed 'minimal' lateral movement and kick out 15 metres out rather than 10. Thoughts anyone? Should the VFL be used for experiments?

Don't like them.

I can see the game being stopped unduly at ball ups / throw ins and umpires directing players to move back inside the 50m arc. A secondary stoppage occurs immediately and we do it all again. The delays will give more time for the remaining 24 players to gather around the stoppage. I also heard 1 player of each side needs to be positioned inside each goal square for play to restart.

The lateral movement on the mark will also cause angst as did the 50s paid for players encroaching in the protected area. Umpires will need to be on the ball and immediately call play on if the kicker makes any movement sideways otherwise the kicker will be advantaged.

I see what these rules are trying to do, particularly the stoppage/ 50m rule so I'll give them a chance. The 15m rule doesn't bother me.
 

Breretonisahood

Senior List
Feb 26, 2013
200
252
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Don't like them.

I can see the game being stopped unduly at ball ups / throw ins and umpires directing players to move back inside the 50m arc. A secondary stoppage occurs immediately and we do it all again. The delays will give more time for the remaining 24 players to gather around the stoppage. I also heard 1 player of each side needs to be positioned inside each goal square for play to restart.

The lateral movement on the mark will also cause angst as did the 50s paid for players encroaching in the protected area. Umpires will need to be on the ball and immediately call play on if the kicker makes any movement sideways otherwise the kicker will be advantaged.

I see what these rules are trying to do, particularly the stoppage/ 50m rule so I'll give them a chance. The 15m rule doesn't bother me.
It’s easy to see how coaches will exploit the new stoppage zone rule. If you want to shut down the opposition’s momentum make sure that during play you have as many players as possible outside the 50m zones. This will create even more congestion. This means that when a stoppage occurs much more time is spent getting players back into the 50m zones. You’d also instruct players to move as slowly as possible into the zones once the stoppage occurs. I don’t think the rules say that the players closest to the 50m arc are the players that have to go back into the 50m zone.
 

Walshawk

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The last couple of official social media posts I've read have named this comp the "VFL and East Coast Second-Tier Competition". Which surely can't be the final official name. Still nothing on fixtures or anything of the sort, which is troubling as it's almost December, and the comp usually starts in March.
Only 16 rounds (which is a joke - less than suburban leagues), usually starts early April reckon might start the week after Easter in 2021. I doubt there will be conferences with separate ladders or finals, more likely groupings to allow NSW and Qld teams to play each other twice. Like the AFL do now with the top/middle/bottom six. Some teams won’t play each other at all which is weird.
Like they did when they merged the VFL and reserves in 2000, they are trying to eliminate stand alone clubs by stealth. Better to be up front and announce that is the intention and allow those clubs to explore options elsewhere.
 

GrumpyOldMan_NC

Monday's Expert
Feb 1, 2018
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It’s easy to see how coaches will exploit the new stoppage zone rule. If you want to shut down the opposition’s momentum make sure that during play you have as many players as possible outside the 50m zones. This will create even more congestion. This means that when a stoppage occurs much more time is spent getting players back into the 50m zones. You’d also instruct players to move as slowly as possible into the zones once the stoppage occurs. I don’t think the rules say that the players closest to the 50m arc are the players that have to go back into the 50m zone.
Yes I'm not a big fan of these changes. I don't know about time lost at stoppages though. My reading of it is they are trying to cut down on overall congestion so it's more like netball where they expect those three defenders and forwards at each end to stay in their 50s. Not sure on what happens if one or more are out, maybe a free at the stoppage? Time wasting 50m?
 

MRobbo

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16 rounds is only for 2021 because of Covid back to normal in 2022

Can’t start before Friday April 23, Victorian state government did a deal for local sport where cricket can be played until April 18.

Don’t expect VFL/East Coast fixture until new year maybe as late as February it is rumoured they may be looking at a rolling fixture like the AFL so you might only see actual dates for first 4 rounds When full fixture is released.

AFLW and VFLW fixtures are due first week of December with season starting on February 1.
 

Glorious One

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16 rounds is only for 2021 because of Covid back to normal in 2022

Can’t start before Friday April 23, Victorian state government did a deal for local sport where cricket can be played until April 18.

Don’t expect VFL/East Coast fixture until new year maybe as late as February it is rumoured they may be looking at a rolling fixture like the AFL so you might only see actual dates for first 4 rounds When full fixture is released.

AFLW and VFLW fixtures are due first week of December with season starting on February 1.
Will be interesting to see if the coverage of this comp is still Vic centric? I can’t imagine too many people tuning into Swans reserves v GWS or GC reserves.
 

NorthernBastard

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16 rounds is only for 2021 because of Covid back to normal in 2022

Can’t start before Friday April 23, Victorian state government did a deal for local sport where cricket can be played until April 18.

Don’t expect VFL/East Coast fixture until new year maybe as late as February it is rumoured they may be looking at a rolling fixture like the AFL so you might only see actual dates for first 4 rounds When full fixture is released.

AFLW and VFLW fixtures are due first week of December with season starting on February 1.
pretty sure it's Feb 27th they're due to start
 

Cummo

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Nov 26, 2020
3
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Essendon
You forgot Coburg.

The AFL have waived fees and are subsidising travel for the standalone clubs in 2021 but how long do you think they will absorb that? I think 2021 will be a test for the standalone clubs to see if they can survive "on their own" in the league.

Eastern AFL would be good but like the upset poster above that offers no solutions, I also wonder what Port Melbourne, Williamstown, Sandringham, Werribbee and Frankston do going forward that used to play in the VFA. Until we know exact AFL list sizes for future it is hard to know if actual reserves sides for AFL clubs will happen. If lists stay big, this is very possible to do.
 

Walshawk

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Mar 24, 2017
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16 rounds is only for 2021 because of Covid back to normal in 2022

Can’t start before Friday April 23, Victorian state government did a deal for local sport where cricket can be played until April 18.

Don’t expect VFL/East Coast fixture until new year maybe as late as February it is rumoured they may be looking at a rolling fixture like the AFL so you might only see actual dates for first 4 rounds When full fixture is released.

AFLW and VFLW fixtures are due first week of December with season starting on February 1.
If the VFLW can start Feb 1, surely the. VFL can start before April 23. There are enough grounds.
 

MegaA

Rookie
Mar 20, 2018
32
42
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My guess and
You forgot Coburg.

The AFL have waived fees and are subsidising travel for the standalone clubs in 2021 but how long do you think they will absorb that? I think 2021 will be a test for the standalone clubs to see if they can survive "on their own" in the league.
My guess and my guess only is that they will absorb cost of travel and waive licencing fees for the first 2 years, year 3 they will tell clubs to pay for license and year 4 to pay for both but who knows, it may not even last 4 years !
 

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