Vic Clubs take $77m in Pokies revenue

Remove this Banner Ad

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
39,680
58,542
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
People often accuse me of copy paste efforts.
I don't need to do that, I'm an old fashioned user of a keyboard and can touch type. I type very quickly. Never need to do any copy and paste.
Ever.
The thing that gets me is the support for Hawthorn, who hail from the leafy Eastern suburbs, to run mega pokie facilities in the poorest part of town, miles and miles away from their main constituency.
People come out in big numbers supporting them. Not actual Hawthorn supporters mind you, but supporters of other clubs.
Supporters of other clubs come out supporting Hawthorn's inalienable right to establish a pokie emporium in one of the poorest parts of Melbourne, where they can fleece money from people least capable of losing money.
Now the residents of Hawthorn East have double, maybe triple the disposable income of the residents of Deer Park.
Why isn't Hawthorn taking pokie money from the residents of Hawthorn East?
1. Because they would not be allowed to establish such a pokie emporium in the leafy Eastern suburbs, and
2. Even if they did establish such a facility, would it mean they would take double or triple the takings that they get in Deer Park? Of course not!
Why not?
Because people of that education and income level do NOT put 5% to 25% of their disposable income into pokies.
A quirk of pokies is that the people most able to lose money on pokies do not spend a cent on them.
Those least able to lose money on them, blow it all.
And that is why we find Hawthorn far, far away from their main constituency, in Deer Park, far, far away from the leafy Eastern suburbs.
Now someone like you may wish to applaud Hawthorn's efforts in ruining the lives of many people in far away Deer Park, but I prefer to stick to what's right and call it out.
You do realise that the way you post doesn't come across as intelligent right?
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
39,680
58,542
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
1. The Age G. Baum 21.8.17

Baum said, re respected & experienced finance journalist A. Kohler

"Kohler said he hated pokies.'Yeah, so do I' said Goyder".

"The context is that Victorians lost about $94m last year on pokies owned by football clubs (Vic. AFL clubs- my words) at 17 venues around Melbourne".



2. Poker machines are vile, & create enormous levels of human misery/family breakups/devestation etc.

Their nos. are vastly & cynically overrepresented in cities, & regions in the countryside, where persons on much lower socio-economic backgrounds reside.

The lower income demographics, by a very wide margin, are the major victims of the vile machines- which are psychologically designed to be addictive for many vulnerable people.

Fortunately, their future is very doubtful now (at least generating the revenues they have traditionally attracted).
All people who want to play in NSW will need to first apply for a govt. supplied Pre-Commitment Card (The legislation is certain to be introduced in NSW, as the NSWLNP govt. has obtained majority support in the Upper House). Pokie dens will become totally cashless, ID will be required to play, & losses will be limited to the loss that the player previously nominated for themselves. Relatives etc. can apply to have problem gamblers banned from all dens.
Don't get me wrong I don't like pokies and I don't like my club having pokies.
I'd rather we didn't, it's not the only thing I'd change about how my club is run given the choice.

My issue is with GG and their obsession with one club
 

jatz14

Norm Smith Medallist
Dec 13, 2011
8,224
9,722
WA
AFL Club
West Coast
Other Teams
Perth Glory W-League
If you are a junkie or a gambling addict, who's choice is it to blast up or drop a weeks wages into a machine? Get help and stop being a selfish irresponsible child.
The point of an addiction, is that it is very hard to do that. That's why it's an addiction. Otherwise, it would just be called a behavior.

On moto g(6) plus using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Gigantor

Brownlow Medallist
May 13, 2012
15,063
5,148
AFL Club
GWS
Other Teams
Brumbies, Socceroos
You do realise that the way you post doesn't come across as intelligent right?
Nor do the responses.
So we are even on that score.
I simply add that it is not I supporting Hawthorn's inalienable right to fleece the most impoverished people of Melbourne.
Others are trying to do that.
Is that a question of intellect?
Or is it a question of morals, ethics, concern for those less fortunate than ourselves?
The Trumpian response would be to reverse that and express concern for a very wealthy football club.
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
39,680
58,542
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
Nor do the responses.
So we are even on that score.
I simply add that it is not I supporting Hawthorn's inalienable right to fleece the most impoverished people of Melbourne.
Others are trying to do that.
Is that a question of intellect?
Or is it a question of morals, ethics, concern for those less fortunate than ourselves?
The Trumpian response would be to reverse that and express concern for a very wealthy football club.
Why Hawthorn though, why not all clubs that profit off pokies?
Why not all pokies?
Why not the governments that allow them?
Why don't you b*tch about Woolworths who own more pokies than anyone.

But I know why. You've got an issue with Hawthorn and don't actually care about pokies
 

Johnny Bananas

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 10, 2010
6,968
8,928
A sugar refinery
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
If it's part of a bigger problem like some sort of significant social demography disadvantage, life changing abuse or trauma in earlier life then an addict deserves help. If it's by selfish choice then they are idiots.
Are you aware that several doctors specialising in addiction believe it to be a genetic predisposition? If people have different brain chemistry around a substance or behaviour due to genetics, is it fair to judge them for not having the thought processes and resistance levels that others do?
 

Johnny Bananas

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 10, 2010
6,968
8,928
A sugar refinery
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Why Hawthorn though, why not all clubs that profit off pokies?
Hawthorn do make the most out of any club. Although they're really not far ahead of my own club, who should also exit pokies. It's a harder proposition for poorer clubs to do that though, especially those carrying ongoing debt. That's why North's stance on pokies is particularly admirable.

Why not the governments that allow them?
Why don't you b*tch about Woolworths who own more pokies than anyone.
I mean, we are in The Footy Industry rather than SRP. Also, as I said on the previous page, we should expect better from not-for-profit organisations that claim to benefit the community than we do from corporate hucksters.
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
39,680
58,542
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
Hawthorn do make the most out of any club. Although they're really not far ahead of my own club, who should also exit pokies. It's a harder proposition for poorer clubs to do that though, especially those carrying ongoing debt. That's why North's stance on pokies is particularly admirable.


I mean, we are in The Footy Industry rather than SRP. Also, as I said on the previous page, we should expect better from not-for-profit organisations that claim to benefit the community than we do from corporate hucksters.
All fine arguments and not a di for leafy constituent among them
 

Chubberson

Cancelled
Apr 12, 2011
1,721
1,890
radelaide
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Are you aware that several doctors specialising in addiction believe it to be a genetic predisposition? If people have different brain chemistry around a substance or behaviour due to genetics, is it fair to judge them for not having the thought processes and resistance levels that others do?
How many excuses does someone need? be better.
 

Chubberson

Cancelled
Apr 12, 2011
1,721
1,890
radelaide
AFL Club
Hawthorn
So a genetic issue is an excuse now? Do you say the same thing to people with Down's Syndrome?
Where is your unequivocal proof that a singular choice repeated is due to genetics? Good luck finding that.
Comparing an addict to child with a disability is false equivalence mr know it all. One of my kids who I've stayed home with to bring up (because wife and I had to) is severely autistic and to compare the two is doing the disabled child a massive disservice. At least they try their best every day. Addiction at it's core is selfishness, not genetics.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Johnny Bananas

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 10, 2010
6,968
8,928
A sugar refinery
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Where is your unequivocal proof that a singular choice repeated is due to genetics? Good luck finding that.
Comparing an addict to child with a disability is false equivalence mr know it all. One of my kids who I've stayed home with to bring up (because wife and I had to) is severely autistic and to compare the two is doing the disabled child a massive disservice. At least they try their best every day. Addiction at it's core is selfishness, not genetics.
And where did you get your medical degree from?

Here's your proof, happy reading.

 

Ned_Flanders

Premium Platinum
Aug 22, 2009
63,437
117,470
AFL Club
Richmond
Other Teams
76'ers
People often accuse me of copy paste efforts.
I don't need to do that, I'm an old fashioned user of a keyboard and can touch type. I type very quickly. Never need to do any copy and paste.
Ever.
The thing that gets me is the support for Hawthorn, who hail from the leafy Eastern suburbs, to run mega pokie facilities in the poorest part of town, miles and miles away from their main constituency.
People come out in big numbers supporting them. Not actual Hawthorn supporters mind you, but supporters of other clubs.
Supporters of other clubs come out supporting Hawthorn's inalienable right to establish a pokie emporium in one of the poorest parts of Melbourne, where they can fleece money from people least capable of losing money.
Now the residents of Hawthorn East have double, maybe triple the disposable income of the residents of Deer Park.
Why isn't Hawthorn taking pokie money from the residents of Hawthorn East?
1. Because they would not be allowed to establish such a pokie emporium in the leafy Eastern suburbs, and
2. Even if they did establish such a facility, would it mean they would take double or triple the takings that they get in Deer Park? Of course not!
Why not?
Because people of that education and income level do NOT put 5% to 25% of their disposable income into pokies.
A quirk of pokies is that the people most able to lose money on pokies do not spend a cent on them.
Those least able to lose money on them, blow it all.
And that is why we find Hawthorn far, far away from their main constituency, in Deer Park, far, far away from the leafy Eastern suburbs.
Now someone like you may wish to applaud Hawthorn's efforts in ruining the lives of many people in far away Deer Park, but I prefer to stick to what's right and call it out.
your question 1) shows you how stupid you are

pokies go in pubs.

look at a map and see how many pubs are in hawthorn/camberwell, and you will have your answer
 

Gralin

Super Moderator
Apr 8, 2010
39,680
58,542
Melbourne
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Buffalo Bills
Good for you, it's never individual choice is it?
Pokies are specifically designed to target people who have issues
Majority of their revenue comes from problem gamblers

It's not a fair fight and it's not a business model that works without those people who are willing to bankrupt themselves and their families for their next win
 

telsor

Hall of Famer
Aug 29, 2004
32,892
31,544
Here
AFL Club
Richmond
Other Teams
Habs
Good for you, it's never individual choice is it?
Sure it's a choice, most things are a choice, but that doesn't mean the scales aren't heavily weighted in favor of one choice over another.

An alcoholic has a choice about drinking, but it's widely acknowledged that that choice is a tougher one than it is for most.

I suffer depression. I have a choice not to kill myself, but I can tell you some days it's a tougher fight than most will ever face (I'm glad for them, but at the same time know they will never understand how someone can stand at a busy intersection waiting to cross, see a truck approaching and consider it as an opportunity to take a step forward and only stop yourself due to knowing how much trauma that would case the driver).

You don't know the path others are taking, and how their lives are being pushed one way or another. Try to show some compassion and understanding sometime and accept that just because you can do something, others necessarily in the same position.
 

GoEaglesGoSGIO

Club Legend
Mar 19, 2020
2,361
5,074
AFL Club
West Coast
They are insidious but on a par with horse racing, casinos, on-line sports betting. There’s always another avenue for addicts to get their fix.
Disagree a bit in that pokies target the elderly (do in W.A atleast) which I think makes it much more morally repulsive then the others
 

Remove this Banner Ad