Opinion VICBias - Genuine Discussion

BlueandGoldforever

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You've just explained where Oakley forget a major factor in his vision. At the time there were 11 clubs from vic when WC and bears came in.

His ideal model in theory is great but in reality flawed, he forgot about the fan bases of 5 of those clubs...................... fast forward to 1996 and the AFL cornered Fitzroy into surrendering their licence to make way for Port in 1997........................... fast forward a couple of years later and HQ realised the bulk of the Roys fans were not going to come back. Regret sets in.

......................... Fast forward to now and there are STILL 10 clubs in vic, if you could put two and two together it's obvious that the market is still viable for those 10 clubs.

In short: Fans = revenue, more than half the league's revenue = vic.

That last statement you could literally end the thread right there.
But that was then, media rights brings in far more revenue now than crowd attendances, which is why having four teams in NSW and QLD is so important. The revenue landscape has changed, and I am not saying for the better because watching professional sport needs spectators, but the reality is that the AFL model is not sustainable in its current format. That has been proven with the Coronavirus impact clearly revealing that the AFL, and most other professional sports, having insufficient savings to survive.
 

Gavin Excell

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But that was then, media rights brings in far more revenue now than crowd attendances, which is why having four teams in NSW and QLD is so important. The revenue landscape has changed, and I am not saying for the better because watching professional sport needs spectators, but the reality is that the AFL model is not sustainable in its current format. That has been proven with the Coronavirus impact clearly revealing that the AFL, and most other professional sports, having insufficient savings to survive.
Disagree

The stability of last few years and the incredible tv rights deal has meant until Covid the comp has been financially as strong as ever.
 

Dank Academy

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You're refusing to answer the question.

Yes, some grounds can be wired with lots of prep time and cost to provide less than ideal quality broadcasts in pre season.

But where are the grounds in SA for nine games a week. Where will the teams stay. Will the SA Government let them and their families in.

Your hatred of Victoria is quite bizarre. You're inventing things whole clothe.

Envy I think is more accurate. Just get over it.
You make some fair points, but why would accommodation be an issue - Do you think there are no hotels in SA?
Re. The grounds, Adelaide, Thebarton and Norwood would be the logical options (Thebarton/Norwood both used for broadcast for AFLW and SANFL).

The issue would be the compulsory lockdown (unless near a golf course )


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Rich01

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But that was then, media rights brings in far more revenue now than crowd attendances, which is why having four teams in NSW and QLD is so important. The revenue landscape has changed, and I am not saying for the better because watching professional sport needs spectators, but the reality is that the AFL model is not sustainable in its current format. That has been proven with the Coronavirus impact clearly revealing that the AFL, and most other professional sports, having insufficient savings to survive.
Not true. Needing a line of credit to get them through this time doesn’t show the AFL in its current format is unsustainable. The AFL has shown over a solid period of time that it has been successful in generating more than enough revenue to sustain 18 teams.
 

RobR

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Well im guessing - and this is just a guess right - i could be wrong here

but seeing as the hubs were going to be in sa and wa that the wa and sa players werent going to be against it.

And as its turned out - its the wa and sa players that now have to move and the aflpa is silent on this....
It's the probably the right idea, 4 clubs move while 14 clubs stay at home.
 

kranky al

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You make some fair points, but why would accommodation be an issue - Do you think there are no hotels in SA?
Re. The grounds, Adelaide, Thebarton and Norwood would be the logical options (Thebarton/Norwood both used for broadcast for AFLW and SANFL).

The issue would be the compulsory lockdown (unless near a golf course )


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But victorias the only state that can do these things
 

JeanLucGoddard

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You make some fair points, but why would accommodation be an issue - Do you think there are no hotels in SA?
Obviously there are. But where do you find 18 complexes suitable for AFL teams and their families within Adelaide and the surrounds?

Look at what the WA clubs have demanded/require in Queensland.

Melbourne wouldn't have 18 either. I'm not bagging SA here.

Re. The grounds, Adelaide, Thebarton and Norwood would be the logical options (Thebarton/Norwood both used for broadcast for AFLW and SANFL).

The issue would be the compulsory lockdown (unless near a golf course )
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Yeah suspected the grounds would be less of an issue.

But the set up for AFLW and SANFL is far less than what audiences expect for the main game AFL season.

They aren't ready to go like Docklands and Meth Park are.
 

Dank Academy

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Obviously there are. But where do you find 18 complexes suitable for AFL teams and their families within Adelaide and the surrounds?

Look at what the WA clubs have demanded/require in Queensland.

Melbourne wouldn't have 18 either. I'm not bagging SA here.



Yeah suspected the grounds would be less of an issue.

But the set up for AFLW and SANFL is far less than what audiences expect for the main game AFL season.

They aren't ready to go like Docklands and Meth Park are.
Yeah I’m not really sure about the complexes required, so I’m not going to pretend to know, but just wanted to point out that accommodation and facilities for game day wouldn’t be the issue.

My perspective is that it’s an unwise move to have one state risk the health implications of accommodating the whole league, and I’m glad the AFL haven’t followed that line of thinking.


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JeanLucGoddard

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Yeah I’m not really sure about the complexes required, so I’m not going to pretend to know, but just wanted to point out that accommodation and facilities for game day wouldn’t be the issue.

My perspective is that it’s an unwise move to have one state risk the health implications of accommodating the whole league, and I’m glad the AFL haven’t followed that line of thinking.


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It isn't a perfect situation.

Thing I find so amazing is how, for all their big tough talk, West Coast just folded like the evening paper and allowed themselves to be humiliatingly relocated to the Gold Coast.

Speaks volumes that they couldn't get an exemption from McGowan, or bend the AFL to their mighty will.
 

Farang83150

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It isn't a perfect situation.

Thing I find so amazing is how, for all their big tough talk, West Coast just folded like the evening paper and allowed themselves to be humiliatingly relocated to the Gold Coast.

Speaks volumes that they couldn't get an exemption from McGowan, or bend the AFL to their mighty will.
LOL...It really hurts you that Simpson didn't want anything to do with nth after retirement doesn't it.........why don't any big name players want to go to nth regardless of how much borrowed money you put on offer....why are you so offended that we're the Haves and your SO the Have not's...lol
 

PerthblueGold

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It isn't a perfect situation.

Thing I find so amazing is how, for all their big tough talk, West Coast just folded like the evening paper and allowed themselves to be humiliatingly relocated to the Gold Coast.

Speaks volumes that they couldn't get an exemption from McGowan, or bend the AFL to their mighty will.
we will soon see if WCE allowing themselves to be humiliatingly relocated to the Gold Coast is a negative...Imagine the angst it will cause in the competition if they come home 5-0.....
 

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Elmer_Judd

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Seems a bit weird to think Adam Simpson, a Victorian is now a dyed in the Wool West Coastian.

He seems to me now more a an Eagles person than a Shinboner, despite being a 2 time premiership player with North.

He definitely has at least one more flag in him before his time is done with the Eagles.

It's also an interesting fact that 3 out of 4 West Coast Flags were coached by Victorians.
 

telsor

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But that was then, media rights brings in far more revenue now than crowd attendances, which is why having four teams in NSW and QLD is so important. The revenue landscape has changed, and I am not saying for the better because watching professional sport needs spectators, but the reality is that the AFL model is not sustainable in its current format. That has been proven with the Coronavirus impact clearly revealing that the AFL, and most other professional sports, having insufficient savings to survive.
Firstly, you really should do the maths on media rights...It's 'only' about a quarter of AFL/club revenue..


But more to the point, why do you think the media pays money for the rights to anything?

media buys rights to event
people watch event
media sells views to advertisers
advertisers sell product to those viewers.


Nowhere in there is "well, there are lots of people who could maybe watch but don't, so we'll pay for them too...."


NSW/QLD is an investment by the AFL to grow the game in the hope that it will get people playing, attending and viewing in 10,20,50 years time, and it'll pay off then. (personally I'm not so confident, but that is the theory). For now though, it brings in virtually nothing, because no advertiser is going to pay for people who don't watch, and TV networks would be stupid to fork out for something that wont bring in any income for them.

Why do you think ratings are such a big deal? It's ACTUAL viewers (not potential ones) that bring in the $$$.

Look at other sports...netball, for example...Hugely popular sport in terms of participants, so the potential audience is massive, but in terms of TV ratings, it really doesn't pull the audience, so the TV rights for it is practically nothing. AFL in NSW/QLD is (in the eyes of TV execs and advertisers) just like netball.


There would be a bit of a premium for 'national audience', but not that much...broadcasting nationally simply doesn't mean that much for advertisers when half the country isn't watching.
 

Rich01

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we will soon see if WCE allowing themselves to be humiliatingly relocated to the Gold Coast is a negative...Imagine the angst it will cause in the competition if they come home 5-0.....
I’m not sure it will elicit the angst you imagine. In fact, many would agree it would be a great result for them.
 

Coaster2012

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So again like RUNVS the big plan is to reinvent everything that's ever happened in footy history because viccos suck.

We invented footy. That's why it is based here. Get over it.
It's not based there because it was invented there. What a simple deduction. Basketball was invented in Canada, yet is based in America. It's based in Vic because it's the largest populated footy state. Pretty simple really. It isnt because you are some holy creator of the game. If WA had triple the population, their state league would have been more supported and thus, would have been the basis of a new national league.

It isn't a perfect situation.

Thing I find so amazing is how, for all their big tough talk, West Coast just folded like the evening paper and allowed themselves to be humiliatingly relocated to the Gold Coast.

Speaks volumes that they couldn't get an exemption from McGowan, or bend the AFL to their mighty will.
What narrative are you trying to paint here? What volumes are they apparently speaking? Are we humiliated? Because West Coast failed to change the law? Not even Palmer could fly into the state with his billions. I'd say that's more a reflection of the state government having strong leadership than WC being somehow embarrassed?

They are flying to QLD and will play them all as away games and will give no advantage to Vic sides. All the games are very winnable too, with Brisbane being the only real threat. Sets them up for a string of home games to end the season. The AFL didnt have to do that, but they will.

Seems like a big win for WC. Far from a "humiliation" as your trying to depict.
 
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Tiger Toffee

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we will soon see if WCE allowing themselves to be humiliatingly relocated to the Gold Coast is a negative...Imagine the angst it will cause in the competition if they come home 5-0.....
So Marc McGowan has finally come to his senses and is opening up the WA border on July 6 and relaxing the 14 day prison term for arrivals, bout time he got with the program.
 

blue harvest

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They are flying to QLD and will play them all as away games and will give no advantage to Vic sides. All the games are very winnable too, with Brisbane being the only real threat. Sets them up for a string of home games to end the season. The AFL didnt have to do that, but they will.
Just on this away game thing.
Won't Port and Crows want all away games too?
Who will be the away team when Eagles/Freo play Crows/Port in QLD?
 

jihg

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Imagine the outcry if you will if say North Melbourne sold a game to be played in say China against a non-Victorian team and got a nice chunk of change for it to help them out but it is an away game and they still get their 11 home games.

Richmond have played Port 32 times 11 times in Melbourne all the rest including one home final in Adelaide imagine the outcry if it was the other way around.
 

Coaster2012

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Imagine the outcry if you will if say North Melbourne sold a game to be played in say China against a non-Victorian team and got a nice chunk of change for it to help them out but it is an away game and they still get their 11 home games.

Richmond have played Port 32 times 11 times in Melbourne all the rest including one home final in Adelaide imagine the outcry if it was the other way around.
Not sure how North voluntarily playing in China for cash relates to WC being forced to relocate due to a pandemic.
 

Ace It Up

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Yeah well it seems like once again its our boys have to sacrifice whilst victorians scream if they feel aggrieved.
In one of your responses to my earlier post, you knew you were wrong and almost admitted it. But you just couldn't follow through with it and conclusively say so. Then, a few posts later you sadly run out that same (wrong and unproven) old chestnut - whilst the victorian teams scream if they feel aggrieved.
 

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