Society/Culture Victoria Cross winner Ben Roberts-Smith - Allegations of war crimes

Remove this Banner Ad

Rad Roo

Premiership Player
Suspended
Aug 2, 2017
3,393
1,607
AFL Club
North Melbourne
Hmmm, kicking unarmed elderly men off a cliff, slitting throats of little boys, raping girls/women, this is a conduct of a democratic nation bring peace and freedom to the less civilised nation? If so, fu** democracy. Aus would do better without a military or at least be like new zealand, i.e. be smart, be aware of the current state of world affairs and not act against the best interest of the nation.

Of course, aussie politicans thinks dragging the nation into an abyss is in the best interest of the nation. Well then...
 
Last edited:

Kwality

Hall of Famer
Aug 14, 2011
30,877
11,536
Trafalgar
AFL Club
West Coast
Other Teams
Mclaren Mercedes F1
Hmmm, kicking unarmed elderly men off a cliff, slitting throats of little boys, raping girls/women, this is a conduct of a democratic nation bring peace and freedom to the less civilised nation? If so, fu** democracy. Aus would do better without a military or at least be like new zealand, i.e. be smart, be aware of the current state of world affairs and not act against the best interest of the nation.

Of course, aussie politicans thinks dragging the nation into an abyss is in the best interest of the nation. Well then...
Here are a few people you'd love living next door to your Mum.
List of terrorist incidents in Australia - Wikipedia
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Schneebly11

Senior List
Apr 7, 2020
287
476
AFL Club
Richmond
Why are only the foot soliders punished, what about the commanding officers, surely the ben robert smith type can't be doing this on their own...
Despite only having the rank of Corporal or Sergeant, SAS patrol commanders have a lot of power. They’re in command of patrols out in the field, and reported back to officers on base most of the time. They were known to lie and conceal their crimes, coerce new soldiers into committing these crimes and threatening anyone who tried to speak out against them.

So primary command responsibility for ordering the murders rests with the patrol commanders, and in some cases they pulled the trigger themselves. However it does seem that there was quite active talk on the base about what the patrol commanders were ordering at the time, and at least some soldiers attempted to report the crimes up the chain of command.

But senior commanders knew they had to achieve results, and they couldn’t risk getting the patrol commanders offside, so they buried their heads in the sand. How far up the chain of command this knowledge went is unknown but it had to have gone some way up. Whether or not this is punishable by law is a question for lawyers. But there’s enough evidence to charge around 20 soldiers with direct participation in war crimes, assuming the AFP and Commonwealth has the balls to prosecute. That’s anyone’s guess at the moment.
 

Kwality

Hall of Famer
Aug 14, 2011
30,877
11,536
Trafalgar
AFL Club
West Coast
Other Teams
Mclaren Mercedes F1
How did being in Afghanistan prevent or protect against any of those incidents? If anything Western foreign policy allowed the growth of violent Islamism and allowed condition to fester which made a breeding ground for extemism
They went into Afghanistan as Bin Laden et al was in residence.
Staying there was crazy, they (the US & Allies) should have done the job & got out.
 

Boston tiger

Norm Smith Medallist
May 10, 2010
6,380
4,595
Where it all began
AFL Club
Richmond
This is atypical of nations with a colonial mentality where in their minds, they are bringing civilisation/peace/democracy to barbaric lands but in reality, they are doing exactly what the taliban, al qaeda are purportly doing. I do not pay tax to fund childkillers. This Ben Robert Smith needs to be given the harshest penalty and stripped of all award, military rank and kicked out of the military. Him and people like him are complete disgrace to the nation. In fact, the entire SAS needs to be disbanded and australia needs to have a deep cleanout out of the pro-american bootlicker.

Australia is a land to getaway from all the troubles of other parts of the world wherever they maybe. Unfortunately, the supposedly representatives of the people pull out all stops to drag aus back into conflict with other nations and some far more powerful than australia. USA today is no longer the post WW2 hegemonic USA that could stamp out all opposition through the might of their economy, technology and moral superiority.

I cannot stop but laugh at stupid aussies politicians wanting to stand up to china. Please, try to stand up to a tsunami, see how you go. In fact, try 3 things, first run at the tsunami (that's what aussie gov is doing), then try standing your ground, lastly try to run along with the tsunami. I wonder which method would give you the greatest chance at survival. That's right folks, Aus can only achieve survival as the best outcome.
We have paid our dues to the USA and so this is the pay off. ...strong support from the most powerful country on earth. Enjoy it.. some have a payed a price for it.
 

Gough

Moderator
Sep 29, 2006
53,928
94,861
AFL Club
Hawthorn
They went into Afghanistan as Bin Laden et al was in residence.
Staying there was crazy, they (the US & Allies) should have done the job & got out.
They couldn't do the job in twenty years, we lost, the Taliban will be back. Something that any passing glance at history would have suggested would happen. If we'd really wanted to nail the WTC bombers the Saudis would have been targeted.
 

Malifice

Moderator
Oct 2, 2007
36,271
33,599
Perth
AFL Club
Carlton
Hmmm, kicking unarmed elderly men off a cliff, slitting throats of little boys, raping girls/women, this is a conduct of a democratic nation bring peace and freedom to the less civilised nation?
There were no allegations of rape, and it wasnt the nation doing the crimes.

It was a few individuals, who are being prosecuted.

We're not an undemocratic bunch of human rights violators like China.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Schneebly11

Senior List
Apr 7, 2020
287
476
AFL Club
Richmond
They went into Afghanistan as Bin Laden et al was in residence.
Staying there was crazy, they (the US & Allies) should have done the job & got out.
Bin Laden left Afghanistan in December 2001. The US intelligence agencies knew this. Al Qaeda bases and armed personnel in Afghanistan were wiped out at Tora Bora in December 2001. Most of their senior leaders were subsequently captured in other countries.

So why were Australian Special Forces shooting captured civilians in the head and slitting the throats of kids as late as 2013?
It’s been known for a long time that the Taliban can’t be fully eradicated and negotiations have been ongoing with the them since 2007. So it really hasn’t been about wiping out the Taliban either.

Opium poppies? Lithium? Pipelines? The nation borders China? Lots of reasons for a western presence in Afghanistan.....
 

Gough

Moderator
Sep 29, 2006
53,928
94,861
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Bin Laden left Afghanistan in December 2001. The US intelligence agencies knew this. Al Qaeda bases and armed personnel in Afghanistan were wiped out at Tora Bora in December 2001. Most of their senior leaders were subsequently captured in other countries.

So why were Australian Special Forces shooting captured civilians in the head and slitting the throats of kids as late as 2013?
It’s been known for a long time that the Taliban can’t be fully eradicated and negotiations have been ongoing with the them since 2007. So it really hasn’t been about wiping out the Taliban either.

Opium poppies? Lithium? Pipelines? The nation borders China? Lots of reasons for a western presence in Afghanistan.....
The war on drugs was forgotten when it came to Afghanistan.
 

Kwality

Hall of Famer
Aug 14, 2011
30,877
11,536
Trafalgar
AFL Club
West Coast
Other Teams
Mclaren Mercedes F1
Bin Laden left Afghanistan in December 2001. The US intelligence agencies knew this. Al Qaeda bases and armed personnel in Afghanistan were wiped out at Tora Bora in December 2001. Most of their senior leaders were subsequently captured in other countries.

So why were Australian Special Forces shooting captured civilians in the head and slitting the throats of kids as late as 2013?
It’s been known for a long time that the Taliban can’t be fully eradicated and negotiations have been ongoing with the them since 2007. So it really hasn’t been about wiping out the Taliban either.

Opium poppies? Lithium? Pipelines? The nation borders China? Lots of reasons for a western presence in Afghanistan.....
You are correct & I agree. I did say they should have obliterated Bin Laden & Co & got out, they didnt take out Bin Laden but that is a different story.
Bin Laden was the reason the Allies went to Afghanistan.
 

jerry springer

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 3, 2002
17,116
7,971
In a good place
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
NBA Winning Machines/Dallas Cowboys
Why are only the foot soliders punished, what about the commanding officers, surely the ben robert smith type can't be doing this on their own...
The days of a captain "going down with the ship" are long gone, it just never happens these days (rightly or wrongly)

you fu** up,you individually get the boot (or it gets covered up)
 

Schneebly11

Senior List
Apr 7, 2020
287
476
AFL Club
Richmond
Bin Laden was the reason the Allies went to Afghanistan.
I don’t think the Bush administration initially had plans for Afghanistan, it wasn’t on the radar of Project for a New American Century nor was it one of the “7 countries in 5 years” named by Wesley Clark.

But he US public needed revenge against the target that had hit them first, soBush had to bomb Afghanistan before anywhere else (even though it later came out figures like Rumsfeld pushed for attacking Iraq first).

I would say that some time later the US realised long term Afghanistan could serve a purpose for US Imperial goals. Therefore more troops and the starting of the SOTG rotations in 2006
 

Kwality

Hall of Famer
Aug 14, 2011
30,877
11,536
Trafalgar
AFL Club
West Coast
Other Teams
Mclaren Mercedes F1
I don’t think the Bush administration initially had plans for Afghanistan, it wasn’t on the radar of Project for a New American Century nor was it one of the “7 countries in 5 years” named by Wesley Clark.

But he US public needed revenge against the target that had hit them first, soBush had to bomb Afghanistan before anywhere else (even though it later came out figures like Rumsfeld pushed for attacking Iraq first).

I would say that some time later the US realised long term Afghanistan could serve a purpose for US Imperial goals. Therefore more troops and the starting of the SOTG rotations in 2006
I've given up trying to follow why the US do many things & am not familiar with your references.
 

Kwality

Hall of Famer
Aug 14, 2011
30,877
11,536
Trafalgar
AFL Club
West Coast
Other Teams
Mclaren Mercedes F1
There were no allegations of rape, and it wasnt the nation doing the crimes.

It was a few individuals, who are being prosecuted.

We're not an undemocratic bunch of human rights violators like China.
The OP made the rape allegation up, just a bit of mayo .... sick one that OP.
 

Pie eyed

Premium Platinum
Jun 26, 2007
39,115
17,208
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Magpies
Pretty sure that's not really a thing in Australia

Veterans are entitled to some money from the DVA to assist with the funeral, but they only know if the family fills out the paperwork... I think the RSL offers flags and poppies and stuff for the funeral, but again you have to fill out the paperwork to get it

I've been to a few funerals where you wouldn't know the deceased was a vet, but in most cases they probably would have wanted it that way... they lived a decent life after getting out and I never got the sense that their military years were a huge part of their identity
My stepfather passed away from natural causes just before Christmas. He joined out of school, served for 30 years and did 3 tours of Vietnam.
The RSL are sending two reps, one to salute him and one to play the last post at his memorial service , when his ashes are interred with his parents and brother. The RSL supplied dedicated "assistant" to walk my mother through the entire process of getting the death certificates, doing any and all service related paperwork, any and all DVA related paperwork, her receiving his pension, changing her over to the DVA Gold Card etc.
They did all of this gratis.
Not even an inkling of thanks being required.
I was actually impressed.
AS far as I know they were informed by DVA.
I know my family did not inform them.
 

Power Raid

TheBrownDog
Oct 15, 2004
70,666
60,904
West Perth
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
I don’t think the Bush administration initially had plans for Afghanistan, it wasn’t on the radar of Project for a New American Century nor was it one of the “7 countries in 5 years” named by Wesley Clark.

But he US public needed revenge against the target that had hit them first, soBush had to bomb Afghanistan before anywhere else (even though it later came out figures like Rumsfeld pushed for attacking Iraq first).

I would say that some time later the US realised long term Afghanistan could serve a purpose for US Imperial goals. Therefore more troops and the starting of the SOTG rotations in 2006
copper for the electrical revolution (renewables and EVs)

second largest copper reserves globally but currently undefined, so most don't think of how rich and strategic Afgan is along with Iran and Pakistan
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Remove this Banner Ad