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Victoria Park nostalgia

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Allan McAllister’s grand plan had its merits. Too bad the club was broke at the time, and the AFL wanted to increase their ticket takings on the newly nationalised competition.

Still, Carlton hung on to their facilities, and it’s a steaming pile of pig shite.
 
Playing it out what would that parcel of land even be worth? Based on what I could find online the ground itself is circa 20,000 sqm maybe double that again for the entire site and you’re left with 40,000 sqm of public land in an area devoid of public land. A little more digging has a sqm of vacant land valued at $5-7k which I feel is a little conservative given the scarcity and circumstances of the council, but if we use the top figure you’re talking $280m which is 3x ish club revenue to buy it in its current state…

I don’t even want to bother investigating what a funding structure looks like to buy a parcel of land like that let alone what we’d have to tip in to bring it to AFL standard for a football club (keeping in mind the Tassie stadium will probably be north of $1.5b once all is said and done). Suffice to say it’s the most ridiculous idea I’ve ever seen floated on here. There’s a reason Hawhorn had to spend $40m (I think) on an ex landfill site in Dingley in order to find a new base. Without government support (in this case Yarra council) gifting us the land (😆) it’s not possible.
 

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Scodog10 said:
Playing it out what would that parcel of land even be worth? Based on what I could find online the ground itself is circa 20,000 sqm maybe double that again for the entire site and you’re left with 40,000 sqm of public land in an area devoid of public land. A little more digging has a sqm of vacant land valued at $5-7k which I feel is a little conservative given the scarcity and circumstances of the council, but if we use the top figure you’re talking $280m which is 3x ish club revenue to buy it in its current state…

I don’t even want to bother investigating what a funding structure looks like to buy a parcel of land like that let alone what we’d have to tip in to bring it to AFL standard for a football club (keeping in mind the Tassie stadium will probably be north of $1.5b once all is said and done). Suffice to say it’s the most ridiculous idea I’ve ever seen floated on here. There’s a reason Hawhorn had to spend $40m (I think) on an ex landfill site in Dingley in order to find a new base. Without government support (in this case Yarra council) gifting us the land (😆) it’s not possible.
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just buy it
 
Vicky Park said:
Nail meets head.

I lived in Yarra for 20 years, and I consulted to the Council (on and off) for 30 years. And they never tired of trying to increase the extent of parks and public reserves in the municipality.

They ain’t selling Vic Park to anyone, least of all our club.
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Goddam them for putting ratepayers interests first!
 
IIRC Vic Park was a perpetual gift to the council, so the council cant sell it to us ot to anyone.

The terms of the gift specified it was a place of recreation for the residents of Collingwood.

The council very much indulged the club for many decades, allowing us to build grandstands and other infrastructure, and when we fenced it in and charged entry I believe we were in breach of the terms of the gift.

Basically I was never ours and we cant buy it even if we had the 300-400 mill to buy it, plus a billion to build the grandstand.

Carlton don't own Princes Park either, they stitched up the council and may had wangled some kind of listing to ensure it stays a footy ground? Not sure.

The MCG is a trust now, the MCC cant run it or even afford it, but their political connections get them money from the government.
 
parano1a said:
Eddie McGuire tried when he was President. The council wouldn't budge.
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No he didn’t.
Eddie was one of the first to understand that we needed to leave VP.

And thank god he did.
 
jmac70 said:
No he didn’t.
Eddie was one of the first to understand that we needed to leave VP.

And thank god he did.
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Indeed. A lot of myths ITT.

I think it would take an act of Parliament to make the land available for sale. We're big but we don't have the political clout of Hawthorn, Geelong or Melbourne.

Casting the council as the bad guys is absurd, for decades the council was extremely generous, to the point they probably broke the law looking after us.

It would be about as plausible/possible to propose a stadium on the Convent/Children's farm site as it wouldn't be to redevelop Vic Park.

Alternately we could widen the bridge over the Eastern Freeway and pop a stadium on that. The train would stop under the grandstand, carpark (ten levels) would exit onto the freeway or Hoddle street (with misleading signs so Crow fans would end up in Springvale).
 

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Cyclops said:
IIRC Vic Park was a perpetual gift to the council, so the council cant sell it to us ot to anyone.

The terms of the gift specified it was a place of recreation for the residents of Collingwood.

The council very much indulged the club for many decades, allowing us to build grandstands and other infrastructure, and when we fenced it in and charged entry I believe we were in breach of the terms of the gift.

Basically I was never ours and we cant buy it even if we had the 300-400 mill to buy it, plus a billion to build the grandstand.

Carlton don't own Princes Park either, they stitched up the council and may had wangled some kind of listing to ensure it stays a footy ground? Not sure.

The MCG is a trust now, the MCC cant run it or even afford it, but their political connections get them money from the government.
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That gift story is a myth.
 
sideswipe said:
That gift story is a myth.
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No, this is from the Victoria park Conservation Management Plan which is linked from the Collingwood website:


Trenerry, through his agent in Australia, proposed that ten and a quarter acres of the land be transferred to the Collingwood Council, for community recreation use, on the proviso that Council spend in the order of 250 pounds per acre, making and improving thesurrounding streets. Clearly, this would make Trenerry’s subdivision more attractive to prospective purchasers. The notion that the future site of Victoria Park was ‘gifted’ to the Collingwood Council by Trenerry is also not the case, given the financial outlay required by Council as part of this transaction. The deal was struck with Council in May 1878, with only one significant restriction in place, and that was a covenant which deemed that Council could not sell the recreation reserve to any private individuals. This would later prove to be a major impediment to the football club, when it sought to acquire freehold at Victoria Park. The terms of the transaction were also later amended to allow for charging public admission to the ground.
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Its plausible the gift was a cover for an actual transaction as suggested here, but in law the land was a gift, and there was a caveat on the gift that precluded the sale of the ground to the club. The council had to bend the agreement to allow us to charge entry.
 
Cyclops said:
No, this is from the Victoria park Conservation Management Plan which is linked from the Collingwood website:




Its plausible the gift was a cover for an actual transaction as suggested here, but in law the land was a gift, and there was a caveat on the gift that precluded the sale of the ground to the club. The council had to bend the agreement to allow us to charge entry.
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That suggests it wasn’t a gift. And it would be a covenant, not a caveat.
 

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sideswipe said:
That suggests it wasn’t a gift. And it would be a covenant, not a caveat.
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Well I'm using the term caveat loosely, thank you for the correction. The point stands, Vic Park was a gift, with restrictions on its use or resale. That's not a myth, those are the facts as reported by the club.

Stremski's plausible work points out the grubby reality that the council improved Trennery's land by building roads on his housing estate, so there's a transacion involved behind the scenes, but in law the land was a gift.
Mostfamousclub_Pies said:
So there’s still hope. It’s a shame Collingwood supporters didn’t protest back in 1999. We are a take lot at times.
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There is almost zero chance it would ever happen, the council wouldn't budge, you'd need parliament to intervene, and we'd need maybe 1.3 billion.

I recall Pert as CEO saying we aspired to having our own ground, so never say never, but Vic Park is probably lost to us.
 
AFL suburban grounds have so many issues. Waverley, Icon, VIC Park and moorabbin just from memory have all suffered major political, residential and financial issues. Times have changed and the suburban model is just dead. Only sentiment remains. An offer that they can’t refuse for VP would probably be the end of the pies. It has the feel of the 90s when the club was a financial disaster.
 
YouBeauty said:
Should I buy a Ferrari?
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Nah get an Aston Martin and a Tom Ford Suit. And whenever asked, say your name is "Bond. James Bond."

You should be getting hot milf pussy positively hurled at you in obscene quantities. Like drowning in milf pussy 24/7.
 

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