Scandal Victorian AFL dominance leads to investigation?

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Freomaniac

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And then the Royal Commission happened and the colllusion between the AFL/MCC and Vic State Government was solidified to make sure the dice was always firmly weighted towards Victoria.
Back in 2006 there was an AFL investigation about the Victorian clubs under performing.

2006 is the only season that freo actually finished above all 10 victorian sides. Freo, west coast, Sydney and crows were the preliminary finalists of that 2006 season
 

sprockets

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It's not Victoria's dominance, it's Richmond's dominance. Don't hang your hats on OUR dominance Vics.
 

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powerrrrrrrrrrrr

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This is a parody response too right? :tearsofjoy:

GWS entered the comp in 2012, Gold Coast entered the comp in 2011.

Last time Richmond had a pick in the top 10 - 2012 pick 9 for Nick Vlastuin (going by your theory this should have been pick 5), & Pick 6 for Reece Conca in 2010.

Most of our premiership players were late picks, rookie picks or traded players. Our "Stars" such as Martin, Cotchin & Riewoldt all came much earlier than any talk of the expansion team joining the comp so you cant say any team was compromised during that period because if anything check the facts Carlton and Melbourne actually received better picks (compensation) than us when we were so called stocking up on picks.

2017 Premiership team:

Broad pick 67 2015
Rance pick 8 2007
Grimes - Preseason draft not even the national draft 2010
Houli - via Essendon 2011
Astbury pick 35 2009
Vlastuin pick 9 2012
McIntosh pick 31 2012
Cotchin pick 2 2007
Townsend via GWS 2016 (4th round selection)
Lambert pick 46 rookie draft 2014
Martin pick 3 2009
Caddy via Geelong 2016 (2nd round pick)
Butler pick 67 2014
Riewoldt pick 13 2006
Rioli pick 15 2015
Nankervia - via Sydney 2016 (3rd round pick)
Prestia - via Gold Coast 2016 (1st round pick)
Grigg via Carlton 2011 (player swap)
Ellis pick 15 2011
Edwards pick 26 2007
Graham pick 53 2016
Castagna pick 29 rookie draft 2015


Your theory has as many holes in it as swiss cheese. Do your homework before you talk nonsense. LOL

Stocking up on picks which formed the base of our dominance?????? LMAO

Try again, your theory is shithouse.

Mate you have done the research for me which further supports my reasoning. Richmond picked up a number of their key players to their era of dominance in the couple years before the gcs and gws compromised drafts.

Martin 2009
Cotchin 2007
Riewoldt 2006
Rance 2007

Let’s say those years those players were drafted were the years that draft concessions were held and all those 4 went to other clubs?

Those 4 players were crucial to Richmond dominance.

Im not saying Richmond still wouldn’t have been good. All I’m saying is that a couple players here and there at different teams at non Victorian teams could have got them a premiership and is one of the contributing factors to the recent dominance by only a couple teams
 
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HairyO

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Have only won 1 Grand Final in 8 years though and Victorians clubs were not doing that badly before the AFL launched an investigation.

1 in 8
2 in 9

Makes quite a difference.

Melbourne and St Kilda havent won in 55 years. Do they get some special treatment ?
 

bumsonseats

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This is a parody response too right? :tearsofjoy:

GWS entered the comp in 2012, Gold Coast entered the comp in 2011.

Last time Richmond had a pick in the top 10 - 2012 pick 9 for Nick Vlastuin (going by your theory this should have been pick 5), & Pick 6 for Reece Conca in 2010.

Most of our premiership players were late picks, rookie picks or traded players. Our "Stars" such as Martin, Cotchin & Riewoldt all came much earlier than any talk of the expansion team joining the comp so you cant say any team was compromised during that period because if anything check the facts Carlton and Melbourne actually received better picks (compensation) than us when we were so called stocking up on picks.

2017 Premiership team:

Broad pick 67 2015
Rance pick 8 2007
Grimes - Preseason draft not even the national draft 2010
Houli - via Essendon 2011
Astbury pick 35 2009
Vlastuin pick 9 2012
McIntosh pick 31 2012
Cotchin pick 2 2007
Townsend via GWS 2016 (4th round selection)
Lambert pick 46 rookie draft 2014
Martin pick 3 2009
Caddy via Geelong 2016 (2nd round pick)
Butler pick 67 2014
Riewoldt pick 13 2006
Rioli pick 15 2015
Nankervia - via Sydney 2016 (3rd round pick)
Prestia - via Gold Coast 2016 (1st round pick)
Grigg via Carlton 2011 (player swap)
Ellis pick 15 2011
Edwards pick 26 2007
Graham pick 53 2016
Castagna pick 29 rookie draft 2015


Your theory has as many holes in it as swiss cheese. Do your homework before you talk nonsense. LOL

Stocking up on picks which formed the base of our dominance?????? LMAO

Try again, your theory is shithouse.

Looks very much like the Hawthorn model.
We picked up some higher end talent before GWS and GC were even a thing.
Then when these clubs came to be we switched our tactic to trading for need ie. Hale, Gibson, Gunston, Burgoyne etc
Many of these were moneyball trades.
Draft wise we had a lot of success with picks in the 40s and beyond.
The basis of our success was the 2004/05 drafts - Roughead, Franklin, Lewis, Birchall......Cyril 2007
Throw in Hodge and Mitchell circa 2001/02 and that is the nucleus of our premiership run..........All but Buddy are 4 x premiership players.
GWS and GC foundered in 2009 and first played 2011/12 resectively.

I think you can also say that the Geelong model was again not dissimilar - funnily enough, this is exactly what Hawthorn modeled our rebuild on.
We were in essence a couple of years behind the Geelong rebuild.

Unlike Geelong (more recently) and now Richmond, Hawthorn has not had access to Free Agents - in fact we lost arguably the best player in the competition in his prime for a packet of peanuts.

It frustrates me that opposition supporters find the need to discredit what other clubs do when they are successful.
There is always a reason that is out of their control why their club has not had the same success.
It is always someone else's fault
I guess that is the world we live in.
 

bumsonseats

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Mate you have done the research for me which further supports my reasoning. Richmond picked up a number of their key players to their era of dominance in the couple years before the gcs and gws compromised drafts.

Martin 2009
Cotchin 2007
Riewoldt 2006
Rance 2007

Let’s say those years those players were drafted were the years that draft concessions were held and all those 4 went to other clubs?

Those 4 players were crucial to Richmond dominance.

Im not saying Richmond still wouldn’t have been good. All I’m saying is that a couple players here and there at different teams at non Victorian teams could have got them a premiership and is one of the contributing factors to the recent dominance by only a couple teams

I dont get your point
Port Adelaide had exactly the same opportunity.

Stop looking for a scapegoat and look in your own backyard.
Perhaps give Kochy a call and ask why your club wasnt better managed.
 

powerrrrrrrrrrrr

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I dont get your point
Port Adelaide had exactly the same opportunity.

Stop looking for a scapegoat and look in your own backyard.
Perhaps give Kochy a call and ask why your club wasnt better managed.

Actually we didn’t get the same opportunity because of the concessions.

In 2011 we finished 16th with only GC above us and so missed out on the number 1 pick and instead our first pick was pick 6. Yes we then got Wingard who was good for us early but we missed the chance to take Coniglio who went at 2 or Patton at 1.

Then in 2012 we finished 14th and would have had pick 3 if GC and GWS weren’t bottom 2 and instead got pick 7.

In 2010 we should have had pick 7 but instead had pick 16 due to GC concessions. We picked Ben Jacobs and missed Prestia, Heppell and Tom Lynch we could have otherwise picked who went after pick 7.

Yes we still got two good players with our lower draft picks but it’s also the affect it has on the whole draft order.

Then there is also the mini draft which altered the order of picks again over those years between.

The whole point I’m making is that Port lost 2 prelims, Adelaide and Freo lost a GF and Lions lost a prelim and with this change in draft picks from 8/9 years earlier those teams missed some key players they could have picked and it could have been the difference between a premiership for those interstate teams the premierships for Richmond or Hawks.

We will never know what would have occurred but it is a valid Point and can’t just be brushed off as you get defensive.

Using the Hawks 2004 draft as an example. Let’s say GC got their draft concessions that year and that meant Hawks didn’t get Roughead and pick 2, Franklin at 5 or Lewis at 7 because they went to GC. You can not argue that if the Hawks did not get those three that they would have developed into the same side they did.

Draft concessions played a huge role between 2010 onwards and a number of interstate teams were on the bottom at that time and were affected in who they had access to which has long term affects in the premiership
 
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OnlyPowerForever

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This is a parody response too right? :tearsofjoy:

GWS entered the comp in 2012, Gold Coast entered the comp in 2011.

Last time Richmond had a pick in the top 10 - 2012 pick 9 for Nick Vlastuin (going by your theory this should have been pick 5), & Pick 6 for Reece Conca in 2010.

Most of our premiership players were late picks, rookie picks or traded players. Our "Stars" such as Martin, Cotchin & Riewoldt all came much earlier than any talk of the expansion team joining the comp so you cant say any team was compromised during that period because if anything check the facts Carlton and Melbourne actually received better picks (compensation) than us when we were so called stocking up on picks.

2017 Premiership team:

Broad pick 67 2015
Rance pick 8 2007
Grimes - Preseason draft not even the national draft 2010
Houli - via Essendon 2011
Astbury pick 35 2009
Vlastuin pick 9 2012
McIntosh pick 31 2012
Cotchin pick 2 2007
Townsend via GWS 2016 (4th round selection)
Lambert pick 46 rookie draft 2014
Martin pick 3 2009
Caddy via Geelong 2016 (2nd round pick)
Butler pick 67 2014
Riewoldt pick 13 2006
Rioli pick 15 2015
Nankervia - via Sydney 2016 (3rd round pick)
Prestia - via Gold Coast 2016 (1st round pick)
Grigg via Carlton 2011 (player swap)
Ellis pick 15 2011
Edwards pick 26 2007
Graham pick 53 2016
Castagna pick 29 rookie draft 2015


Your theory has as many holes in it as swiss cheese. Do your homework before you talk nonsense. LOL

Stocking up on picks which formed the base of our dominance?????? LMAO

Try again, your theory is shithouse.
I read 8 of those players were first round draft picks earlier than 15. Great drafting to nail them and build a premiership team really.

You know, just for reference, in all Port Adelaide's sh*tness that we dropped to in the 2008-12 period, we never got a pick 1,2,3.
 

OnlyPowerForever

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Clearly the mods moving this thread are in the AFL's court that there's nothing to see here.

I guess threads abouy home games at Kardinia Park, or an AFL team from Tasmania, or Melbourne being the forefather of football belongs on the main page, but criticism of the Victorian bias of the AFL doesn't.
 

bumsonseats

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Actually we didn’t get the same opportunity because of the concessions.

In 2011 we finished 16th with only GC above us and so missed out on the number 1 pick and instead our first pick was pick 6. Yes we then got Wingard who was good for us early but we missed the chance to take Coniglio who went at 2 or Patton at 1.

Then in 2012 we finished 14th and would have had pick 3 if GC and GWS weren’t bottom 2 and instead got pick 7.

In 2010 we should have had pick 7 but instead had pick 16 due to GC concessions. We picked Ben Jacobs and missed Prestia, Heppell and Tom Lynch we could have otherwise picked who went after pick 7.

Yes we still got two good players with our lower draft picks but it’s also the affect it has on the whole draft order.

Then there is also the mini draft which altered the order of picks again over those years between.

The whole point I’m making is that Port lost 2 prelims, Adelaide and Freo lost a GF and Lions lost a prelim and with this change in draft picks from 8/9 years earlier those teams missed some key players they could have picked and it could have been the difference between a premiership for those interstate teams the premierships for Richmond or Hawks.

We will never know what would have occurred but it is a valid Point and can’t just be brushed off as you get defensive.

Using the Hawks 2004 draft as an example. Let’s say GC got their draft concessions that year and that meant Hawks didn’t get Roughead and pick 2, Franklin at 5 or Lewis at 7 because they went to GC. You can not argue that if the Hawks did not get those three that they would have developed into the same side they did.

Draft concessions played a huge role between 2010 onwards and a number of interstate teams were on the bottom at that time and were affected in who they had access to which has long term affects in the premiership

Yeah......I'm not buying

In the 5 drafts prior to the GC entering the draft (2005 - 2009), you had 4 top 10 picks, including 2 top 5 picks.
You also had 4 other first round picks ranging from 14 - 16.

Respective ladder positions over that time are also remarkably similar
HAW Port
2004: 16th Prem
2005: 14th 6th
2006: 11th 12th
2007: 5th 2nd
2008: Prem 13th
2009: 9th 10th

The obvious difference is in our respective premiership years, and 2005
Otherwise not overly dissimilar.
So I would argue that our draft resources in the 5 years prior to GC and GWS were not at all dissimilar.
 

vozzon

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Actually we didn’t get the same opportunity because of the concessions.

In 2011 we finished 16th with only GC above us and so missed out on the number 1 pick and instead our first pick was pick 6. Yes we then got Wingard who was good for us early but we missed the chance to take Coniglio who went at 2 or Patton at 1.

Then in 2012 we finished 14th and would have had pick 3 if GC and GWS weren’t bottom 2 and instead got pick 7.

In 2010 we should have had pick 7 but instead had pick 16 due to GC concessions. We picked Ben Jacobs and missed Prestia, Heppell and Tom Lynch we could have otherwise picked who went after pick 7.

Yes we still got two good players with our lower draft picks but it’s also the affect it has on the whole draft order.

Then there is also the mini draft which altered the order of picks again over those years between.

The whole point I’m making is that Port lost 2 prelims, Adelaide and Freo lost a GF and Lions lost a prelim and with this change in draft picks from 8/9 years earlier those teams missed some key players they could have picked and it could have been the difference between a premiership for those interstate teams the premierships for Richmond or Hawks.

We will never know what would have occurred but it is a valid Point and can’t just be brushed off as you get defensive.

Using the Hawks 2004 draft as an example. Let’s say GC got their draft concessions that year and that meant Hawks didn’t get Roughead and pick 2, Franklin at 5 or Lewis at 7 because they went to GC. You can not argue that if the Hawks did not get those three that they would have developed into the same side they did.

Draft concessions played a huge role between 2010 onwards and a number of interstate teams were on the bottom at that time and were affected in who they had access to which has long term affects in the premiership

Add in Geelong had very good father son picks, Hawks, Pies (cloke and shaw f/s's) and Saints had priority picks as well. There rebuilds were accelerated. Rance was a priority pick as well, but a later one.

The advantages some teams got while re building has shaped future of most clubs. More picks to pick up talent early on helped.
 

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powerrrrrrrrrrrr

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Yeah......I'm not buying

In the 5 drafts prior to the GC entering the draft (2005 - 2009), you had 4 top 10 picks, including 2 top 5 picks.
You also had 4 other first round picks ranging from 14 - 16.

Respective ladder positions over that time are also remarkably similar
HAW Port
2004: 16th Prem
2005: 14th 6th
2006: 11th 12th
2007: 5th 2nd
2008: Prem 13th
2009: 9th 10th

The obvious difference is in our respective premiership years, and 2005
Otherwise not overly dissimilar.
So I would argue that our draft resources in the 5 years prior to GC and GWS were not at all dissimilar.

I think you are actually missing the whole point of my original posts and misinterpreting this thread.

I am not stating that Port specifically have been hard done by and deserve the premiership or that the hawks and Richmond didn’t deserve their premierships or recruit well.

The thread is a discussion about why Victorian teams have won majority of recent GFs over interstate teams and this was simply a potential reason why we have seen that. It is not the only reason, but it potentially plays a part in why we have seen two dynasties over the past decade.

As I have previously mentioned, numerous interstate teams have come very close on multiple occasions to winning Gfs over the last 10 years which is relevant to the discussion as a number of those teams lost high draft positions when the concessions were in place.

Fremantle, Adelaide and Swans have lost GFs while lions and Port have lost Prelims. Players drafted during those concession drafts are now in their prime and could have made a difference depending how the draft would have unfolded if that wasn’t the case with GC and GWS.

If that was the case and these interstate teams won these GFs, this thread would not exist. I will also say that I am in no way saying this is the only reason they lost and it’s all a big anti-vic conspiracy. of course, we will never know how the drafts would have unfolded if the expansion teams didn’t exist but every team in the comp would have very different lists.

If you cant have an open discussion without for some reason taking offence or think it’s an attack on your side then so be it.
 

Crow_Magnon

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It was only epic because your team played in it and it was a close game. In the history of Grand finals it was too low scoring to be epic.

Give me a 2018 West Coast v Collingwood GF over 2005 & 2006 any day.
2006 GF was higher scoring than 2018...2005 was a slog, but 2006 was as good a GF that we'd had for many years.
 

bumsonseats

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I think you are actually missing the whole point of my original posts and misinterpreting this thread.

I am not stating that Port specifically have been hard done by and deserve the premiership or that the hawks and Richmond didn’t deserve their premierships or recruit well.

The thread is a discussion about why Victorian teams have won majority of recent GFs over interstate teams and this was simply a potential reason why we have seen that. It is not the only reason, but it potentially plays a part in why we have seen two dynasties over the past decade.

As I have previously mentioned, numerous interstate teams have come very close on multiple occasions to winning Gfs over the last 10 years which is relevant to the discussion as a number of those teams lost high draft positions when the concessions were in place.

Fremantle, Adelaide and Swans have lost GFs while lions and Port have lost Prelims. Players drafted during those concession drafts are now in their prime and could have made a difference depending how the draft would have unfolded if that wasn’t the case with GC and GWS.

If that was the case and these interstate teams won these GFs, this thread would not exist. I will also say that I am in no way saying this is the only reason they lost and it’s all a big anti-vic conspiracy. of course, we will never know how the drafts would have unfolded if the expansion teams didn’t exist but every team in the comp would have very different lists.

If you cant have an open discussion without for some reason taking offence or think it’s an attack on your side then so be it.

Seems you have taken offence to facts that do not align with your argument.

Have you given consideration to the fact that perhaps these clubs were just better managed and had as a result had better playing lists.
I would contend that the Geelong sides 07 - 11 and the 3peat Hawthorn teams would have beaten most sides.
The 07 Geelong and the 2014 Hawthorn premierships sides would have won if they played the GF on the moon.

And I would have loved having higher draft picks if GC and GWS didnt enter the competition. Every club would have went up the order.
It is what you do with the pick that matters. I can speak from a Hawthorn perspective and say that our club made some pretty bold trades - and embarked on a strategy a trading our first rounder for need post 2009.

The facts show that for a 5 or 6 year period, our 2 clubs had more or less the same draft resources.
Your club just went about it a different way.
 

OnlyPowerForever

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Yeah......I'm not buying

In the 5 drafts prior to the GC entering the draft (2005 - 2009), you had 4 top 10 picks, including 2 top 5 picks.
You also had 4 other first round picks ranging from 14 - 16.

Respective ladder positions over that time are also remarkably similar
HAW Port
2004: 16th Prem
2005: 14th 6th
2006: 11th 12th
2007: 5th 2nd
2008: Prem 13th
2009: 9th 10th

The obvious difference is in our respective premiership years, and 2005
Otherwise not overly dissimilar.
So I would argue that our draft resources in the 5 years prior to GC and GWS were not at all dissimilar.
Do you really want to play this game? Selective information, not the full box and dice.
Every team gets a first round draft pick, a second round draft pick, etc..

But does Pick 9 count as a top 10 draft pick for Port Adelaide if we traded it as part of the Burgoyne deal? If so, what does the 2005 draft look like for Hawthorn?

Here are the raw numbers as best as I could put together (top 2 rounds each year). Try to make a case that they are "not overly dissimilar."

Hawthorn
2004 = Priority Pick 2, Pick 5, 7, 21, 26
2005 = Priority Pick 3, Pick 6, 14 (traded in), 18 (traded in)
2006 = Pick 6, 24, 33 (traded in)
2007 = Pick 12, 29
2008 = Pick 16, 34
2009 = Pick 9 (traded out), 24 (traded out), 25 (traded out)

Port Adelaide
2004 = Pick 11, 19
2005 = Pick 14 (traded out), Pick 30
2006 = Pick 5, 23
2007 = Pick 16, 28 (traded in), 33
2008 = Pick 4, 22
2009 = Pick 8, 9 (traded in), 16 (Traded in), Pick 24 (traded out)
 

RichLeMonde

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How about we aim for a sample size greater than one?

Lets make a rule that any time it's a Vic vs non-Vic GF the non-Vic club gets to host the game.

I bet we'd start to see a distinct trend emerge over time.
A distinct trend? You mean like the fact that in GFs between non-Vics and Vics (all at the G), the non-Vics have a winning percentage of exactly 50?
 

RichLeMonde

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You do realise there's over 100 years of data that strongly suggests the home team has an advantage over the away team right?
There is some truth to this, but the advantage is closely linked to home crowd, rather than other factors, like travel. One way that this was demonstrated was a study of NBA teams, who found that when 2 teams who shared a city played (and so there was no real travel), but the home team basically got to pack out the entire stadium just with their fans, they had exactly the same increase in winning percentage as did home teams who were playing a team that had travelled interstate. So it's mainly about crowd. And crowd isn't a factor on AFL GF day due to ticketing arrangements. So it's not really a true 'home' GF for a Vic team because the single biggest factor in HGA advantage is taken out, the crowd. This explains why interstate v Vic GFs have a 50-50 split.

It's why I laugh when numpties say Adelaide would have beaten Richmond in 17 if the GF was in Adelaide, because Adelaide had beaten them there in the H&A. If the GF was in Adelaide and had the same ticketing arrangements as any other GF, with a crowd fairly evenly split between supporters of both teams and corporate, then Adelaide wouldn't have had much HGA, and they would have been duly flogged by Richmond, as they were in the actual GF.
 

Freomaniac

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Do you really want to play this game? Selective information, not the full box and dice.
Every team gets a first round draft pick, a second round draft pick, etc..

But does Pick 9 count as a top 10 draft pick for Port Adelaide if we traded it as part of the Burgoyne deal? If so, what does the 2005 draft look like for Hawthorn?

Here are the raw numbers as best as I could put together (top 2 rounds each year). Try to make a case that they are "not overly dissimilar."

Hawthorn
2004 = Priority Pick 2, Pick 5, 7, 21, 26
2005 = Priority Pick 3, Pick 6, 14 (traded in), 18 (traded in)
2006 = Pick 6, 24, 33 (traded in)
2007 = Pick 12, 29
2008 = Pick 16, 34
2009 = Pick 9 (traded out), 24 (traded out), 25 (traded out)

Port Adelaide
2004 = Pick 11, 19
2005 = Pick 14 (traded out), Pick 30
2006 = Pick 5, 23
2007 = Pick 16, 28 (traded in), 33
2008 = Pick 4, 22
2009 = Pick 8, 9 (traded in), 16 (Traded in), Pick 24 (traded out)

Keep in mind, when Port won the flag in 2004, They traded heavily to get Josh Carr from your mob. Traded picks 11, 27 and 43 to get him, that was our 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounders for him.

Port then traded out picks 27 and 45 to get aron shattock
 

Freomaniac

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There is some truth to this, but the advantage is closely linked to home crowd, rather than other factors, like travel. One way that this was demonstrated was a study of NBA teams, who found that when 2 teams who shared a city played (and so there was no real travel), but the home team basically got to pack out the entire stadium just with their fans, they had exactly the same increase in winning percentage as did home teams who were playing a team that had travelled interstate. So it's mainly about crowd. And crowd isn't a factor on AFL GF day due to ticketing arrangements. So it's not really a true 'home' GF for a Vic team because the single biggest factor in HGA advantage is taken out, the crowd. This explains why interstate v Vic GFs have a 50-50 split.

It's why I laugh when numpties say Adelaide would have beaten Richmond in 17 if the GF was in Adelaide, because Adelaide had beaten them there in the H&A. If the GF was in Adelaide and had the same ticketing arrangements as any other GF, with a crowd fairly evenly split between supporters of both teams and corporate, then Adelaide wouldn't have had much HGA, and they would have been duly flogged by Richmond, as they were in the actual GF.

Also, In those finals series Richmond played in from 2017-2020, Tigers beat Brisbane at the Gabba and Port in a prelim in Adelaide oval.
 

Swanks McSwankserton

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If you add up ladder finishes in 2010 and 2011 you get:
1. Brisbane 28
2. Richmond 27
3. Port Adelaide 26
=4. Melbourne, Adelaide 25
6. Essendon 22
7. West Coast 20
8. North Melbourne 18
=9. Gold Coast, Fremantle 17
11. Bulldogs 14
12. Carlton 13
13. Sydney 12
14. Hawthorn 10
15. St. Kilda 9
16. Geelong 4
17. Collingwood 2

So Richmond lost more than any of the non-vic sides save Brisbane when expansion f***** the drafts.
 

OnlyPowerForever

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If you add up ladder finishes in 2010 and 2011 you get:
1. Brisbane 28
2. Richmond 27
3. Port Adelaide 26
=4. Melbourne, Adelaide 25
6. Essendon 22
7. West Coast 20
8. North Melbourne 18
=9. Gold Coast, Fremantle 17
11. Bulldogs 14
12. Carlton 13
13. Sydney 12
14. Hawthorn 10
15. St. Kilda 9
16. Geelong 4
17. Collingwood 2

So Richmond lost more than any of the non-vic sides save Brisbane when expansion f***** the drafts.
Richmond was ultimately the winner of the 2010 draft.

Pick 6 - Reece Conca
Pick 7 - Josh Caddy
Pick 9 - Dion Prestia
Pick 11 - Tom Lynch
 

PenfoldsFan

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We have gone from a Geelong dynasty to a Hawthorn one and now a Richmond one.

And yet there is no talk of inquests into why non Vic clubs cant do the same, not that id want one held.

Imagine being the biggest league in the land, with the oldest clubs, the GF on your doorstep for the next couple of decades and still having your arse handed to you for 6 years by non Vic clubs.
Then you hold an inquest into why you are s**t at your own game before opening up 80 more spots to recruit from and then introduce FA for key players to walk home in their prime.
 

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