State & Territory WA 2019 - Western Australia's junior footy talent

Les Malone

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Jul 28, 2019
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I think if WA can consistently win the U18's champs for a few years, the draft trend will change.

Well yes, but IMO that is not the only consideration, Vic metro finished last this year, Vic country last in 2018.

From my perspective WA under sells itself as a talent pool and on raw numbers is far and away in front of SA.

I think it has the depth to put 2 good teams in.
 

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Ishikawa

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Jul 18, 2018
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OK, i am on my hobby horse again.

!6(?) WA boys drafted from the under 18 winning team, but apparently no one good enough outside that team to be drafted, yet 4/5 Vic boys from outside the Met and country teams good enough ?.

WA is the second largest market for AF in the WORLD.

It has double the population of the 3rd biggest market SA, it has double the amount of colts teams and double the participation, it has a higher % of the population playing the game than Vic.

Not good enough AFL, WA needs a second under 18 team.
Well the scouts obviously take a bit of notice over here because Georgiades was selected after missing the year.

I think your premise is based on a very large chip on your shoulder.
 

Les Malone

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Well the scouts obviously take a bit of notice over here because Georgiades was selected after missing the year.

I think your premise is based on a very large chip on your shoulder.
I had a feeling if you replied, you would make it personal, i am not sure you have another way.

I think it was you who was proven comprehensively wrong regarding the history of finals and why they were implemented, but when proven wrong disappeared without responding.

Georgiades is a great talent, spotted years ago and would have gone higher in the draft if not injured, always destined to be drafted, you didn't need to look to far or wide.

My points for two teams are based on demographics.

WA has a million more people than SA. ( third biggest AF market in the world) thats a significant margin.

WA has twice the number of kids and colts playing footy than SA

WA also has a higher % of kids playing the game than Vic or SA.

Based on those simple figures two teams in WA would not really dilute the talent but actually increase it with more kids exposed to higher competition.

My gut feel which i cant prove is that WA boys not in rep sides and even some who are - are perennially underrated by AFL clubs and scouts.

Having these opinions does not mean i have a very large chip on my shoulder.
 

andleanback

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Aug 21, 2016
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that might be true but the fact remains that all of the wa draftees were in the U18 WA team and not so for the Vics or even the SA's. Could just be a coincidence.
Bigger pool of talent, some kids have a good finish to the year after the metro squads been picked
 

Zurgblade

Team Captain
Feb 14, 2018
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I had a feeling if you replied, you would make it personal, i am not sure you have another way.

I think it was you who was proven comprehensively wrong regarding the history of finals and why they were implemented, but when proven wrong disappeared without responding.

Georgiades is a great talent, spotted years ago and would have gone higher in the draft if not injured, always destined to be drafted, you didn't need to look to far or wide.

My points for two teams are based on demographics.

WA has a million more people than SA. ( third biggest AF market in the world) thats a significant margin.

WA has twice the number of kids and colts playing footy than SA

WA also has a higher % of kids playing the game than Vic or SA.

Based on those simple figures two teams in WA would not really dilute the talent but actually increase it with more kids exposed to higher competition.

My gut feel which i cant prove is that WA boys not in rep sides and even some who are - are perennially underrated by AFL clubs and scouts.

Having these opinions does not mean i have a very large chip on my shoulder.
If your stats are correct, there's probably a bit of merit to what you are saying. Half our state academy is filled with bottom agers which means a lot of players of current year players miss out entirely. Having watched the system relatively closely for the past couple of years, there were a number of talented players who were over looked and favoured for those who have been in the academies before. Its almost like if you don't make the U16's, you're destined to be overlooked and have an incredibly tough battle of getting in.

How would the two WA teams be split as I would imagine the quality of WA players would be spread between North and South of the River and greater South, therefore a traditional Metro and Country model might not be as viable.
 
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HolyRioli

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Hale is usually stronger than Wesley in the last 5/6 years i have been paying attention.

Every school bar Trinity has the advantage of country boarders, Trinity may put up a couple of indigenous kids on scholarships, but they rely on city kids, they do come from as far away as Mandurah and Yanchep but usually around Dianella, Morley, Swan Valley and many Italian families from those areas, hence sometimes the footy teams look like an Italian world cup soccer team with the names.
In my defence, it's been over 15 years since I was at school (and none of the ones I named). Was going off memory, and have maybe always discounted Hale as more of a rugby school.
 

Les Malone

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In my defence, it's been over 15 years since I was at school (and none of the ones I named). Was going off memory, and have maybe always discounted Hale as more of a rugby school.
That was sort of my impression of Hale from afar, a very old tie English type Rugby school and maybe at one stage it was, but last few years very strong footy school, they could also be a strong Rugby school , i really havent looked into that.
 

Ishikawa

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Jul 18, 2018
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I had a feeling if you replied, you would make it personal, i am not sure you have another way.

I think it was you who was proven comprehensively wrong regarding the history of finals and why they were implemented, but when proven wrong disappeared without responding.

Georgiades is a great talent, spotted years ago and would have gone higher in the draft if not injured, always destined to be drafted, you didn't need to look to far or wide.

My points for two teams are based on demographics.

WA has a million more people than SA. ( third biggest AF market in the world) thats a significant margin.

WA has twice the number of kids and colts playing footy than SA

WA also has a higher % of kids playing the game than Vic or SA.

Based on those simple figures two teams in WA would not really dilute the talent but actually increase it with more kids exposed to higher competition.

My gut feel which i cant prove is that WA boys not in rep sides and even some who are - are perennially underrated by AFL clubs and scouts.

Having these opinions does not mean i have a very large chip on my shoulder.
So with there being about 9 colts teams, lets say theres 180 kids who are in the WAFL system.

In implementing a second academy team to play in the championships that's what another 40 kids on top of the existing WA squad of about 40. There is absolutely not the depth of talent to fulfil two state teams to be away from the clubs half the season. Completely dilutes the colts competition as it is, even more so as the private school old boys and hangers on love to tell us how the PSA is retaining increasing numbers each year. Dilutes the championships itself which is meant to be an elite and meaningful exhibition of the best talent and highest quality games of footy.

Who is paying for the additional resources and infrastructure to support an additional 40 supposedly elite talents? Not only would a whole new coaching staff & support team (again this comes out of the colts or the PSA system) be required, but then theres double the flights, accomodation for interstate games etc. Can the same quality and focus in coaching and talent be maintained with such higher numbers? I doubt it and individual development will suffer.

Every kid doesn't need a prize.
 

Les Malone

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So with there being about 9 colts teams, lets say theres 180 kids who are in the WAFL system.

In implementing a second academy team to play in the championships that's what another 40 kids on top of the existing WA squad of about 40. There is absolutely not the depth of talent to fulfil two state teams to be away from the clubs half the season. Completely dilutes the colts competition as it is, even more so as the private school old boys and hangers on love to tell us how the PSA is retaining increasing numbers each year. Dilutes the championships itself which is meant to be an elite and meaningful exhibition of the best talent and highest quality games of footy.

Who is paying for the additional resources and infrastructure to support an additional 40 supposedly elite talents? Not only would a whole new coaching staff & support team (again this comes out of the colts or the PSA system) be required, but then theres double the flights, accomodation for interstate games etc. Can the same quality and focus in coaching and talent be maintained with such higher numbers? I doubt it and individual development will suffer.

Every kid doesn't need a prize.
OK, there are about 50 kids on each colts list, colts teams in the WAFL play either 24 or 26 kids each game, ( i think 26) with an extended interchange bench.

there are 12 teams in the Vic under 18's
there are 10 teams in SA based on the SANFL

Teams don't usually take away 40 kids interstate - maybe mid 20's.

AS far as more money is concerned ...... i reckon they could find it if needed!!!

For anyone wondering - GWS and Gold Coast profits, losses and distributions 2012-2018. Outside of the guaranteed club distributions and including overall losses, this has so far cost the AFL and the two clubs about $166 million over 7 years.


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WA doesn't deserve another under 18 team because everyone deserves a prize, IMO it deserves another team or at least a serious look at it because of simple demographics which have been explained and then ignored.

The population gap between the 2nd biggest AFL market in the world (WA) and 3rd being SA will continue to increase - now over 1 million people
 

GUMBLETRON

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They've been ignored because your argument is poor. Victoria has 4 million more than WA - perhaps they should have four teams?

The clearest demonstration of demographic strength is on-field performance. Over the past decade, SA has won the championships three times to WA's once.

When WA get too strong they will rightly be split, as Victoria was, but on the actual evidence that is not close.
 

Les Malone

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Jul 28, 2019
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They've been ignored because your argument is poor. Victoria has 4 million more than WA - perhaps they should have four teams?

The clearest demonstration of demographic strength is on-field performance. Over the past decade, SA has won the championships three times to WA's once.

When WA get too strong they will rightly be split, as Victoria was, but on the actual evidence that is not close.
Winning the under 18's is not the be all and end all.

You can come last and have a multitude of players draftees

Vic metro came last this year and Vic country last - last year.

I think the team that finished last this year had the most players drafted?

They only play 4 games, its not a great guide really, 4 games is not really evidence of much.

As has been explained WA may have a much smaller population base than VIC but it does have a higher % of the population playing the game which helps offset the raw player numbers to a degree and dwarfs SA in both player numbers and population.
 
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briztoon

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Winning the under 18's is not the be all and end all.

You can come last and have a multitude of players draftees

Vic metro came last this year and Vic country last - last year.

I think the team that finished last this year had the most players drafted?

They only play 4 games, its not a great guide really, 4 games is not really evidence of much.

As has been explained WA may have a much smaller population base than VIC but it does have a higher % of the population playing the game which helps offset the raw player numbers to a degree and dwarfs SA in both player numbers and population.
How many kids are we talking about?

Not percentages, actual raw numbers?
Vic
WA
SA
NSW
QLD
NT
TAS
 

Zurgblade

Team Captain
Feb 14, 2018
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Theres pros and cons to every argument and unless there is a specific goal in mind, you can debate until the cows come home and will only be chasing your tail.

If the goal is to give aspiring state athletes more exposure, an expansion would be on the cards.
If the goal is to improve the quality of the competition, it might be better to leave the format as is for now.
If the goal is maintain financial stability within the state, it might be better to leave the format as is for now.

The recent reform of the WA Colts competition may drive the need for an extra WA team in the future. The colts system is sub-elite which will see the quality of the competition growing immensely. Taking into consideration the minimum commitment required, I don't see how players can squeeze much more out of their week whilst juggling school and work commitments and there will over 300 players who are exposed to this level of training for the next 9 months. Picking an extra 40 competitive players from this group would not be difficult and it will only get better
 

droogs

Rookie
May 6, 2019
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Theres pros and cons to every argument and unless there is a specific goal in mind, you can debate until the cows come home and will only be chasing your tail.

If the goal is to give aspiring state athletes more exposure, an expansion would be on the cards.
If the goal is to improve the quality of the competition, it might be better to leave the format as is for now.
If the goal is maintain financial stability within the state, it might be better to leave the format as is for now.

The recent reform of the WA Colts competition may drive the need for an extra WA team in the future. The colts system is sub-elite which will see the quality of the competition growing immensely. Taking into consideration the minimum commitment required, I don't see how players can squeeze much more out of their week whilst juggling school and work commitments and there will over 300 players who are exposed to this level of training for the next 9 months. Picking an extra 40 competitive players from this group would not be difficult and it will only get better
Well there has been a rumour that the colts will leave the WAFL in the next five years and a different comp will be created where districts will merge.



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