2nds WAFL Watch - 2025 Edition

[HoneyBadger35]

How did ____ go on the weekend?

Why not consult the Alesana Player Video Database.

Resource - Player Video Database

Putting this into a spreadsheet for convenience. 2024 is still there in a tab on the bottom of the sheet. I'll update this as much as I can throughout the year. The All Stars game and our match sim against Richmond are now up.

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

This is the same MC that currently has Reid on track kicking a grand total of 4 goals 8 behinds at AFL level from 9 appearances (not counting how many OOB), whilst his solitary WAFL outing returned a total of 0 goals as the Beagles key forward? Is that correct?

Jack Williams on the other hand has kicked 8 goals from 5 AFL games, with his 6th game as the sub (another genius decision from your MC mates). In the WAFL he's kicked 6 goals from 2 games.

Jobe kicked 10 goals from his 5 WAFL games as an 18yr old forward, before being put in backline.

As far as hitting the scoreboard goes Archer Reid is the worst KPF on our list by a long way, at either level.

If you were to compare AReid to Williams in his second year, Archer has him beat on basically every statistic one would value in a key forward. Reid >Williams in score involvements, shots on goal, goal assists and has performed better than Williams in hit out win %.

I'll come back and provide a more in depth comparison after today as they would have both played 10 games in their second season after today.




If we are comparing Archer and Jobe as KPF in their first season. Archer kicked 14 goals in 10 games, Jobe has kicked 14 goals in 10 games, while spending a little bit of time as a defender. There is little, if anything separating Reid and Shanahan as forwards in their first year.







But the argument isn't really where Jobe should play. I think him playing as a KPD makes alot of sense, but if we played him as a forward, you wouldn't hear any big arguments from me.

The point of contention here is Archer playing as a KPD, which once again you skirt over, don't provide any evidence or rationale for why you think Archer should be a defender other than "his set shot kicking is shit" why I have said over and over again, can be improved and Archer is doing alot right as a forward.

 

[Dark Sharks]

If you were to compare AReid to Williams in his second year, Archer has him beat on basically every statistic one would value in a key forward. Reid >Williams in score involvements, shots on goal, goal assists and has performed better than Williams in hit out win %.

I'll come back and provide a more in depth comparison after today as they would have both played 10 games in their second season after today.

View attachment 2331068


If we are comparing Archer and Jobe as KPF in their first season. Archer kicked 14 goals in 10 games, Jobe has kicked 14 goals in 10 games, while spending a little bit of time as a defender. There is little, if anything separating Reid and Shanahan as forwards in their first year.


View attachment 2331076

View attachment 2331075


But the argument isn't really where Jobe should play. I think him playing as a KPD makes alot of sense, but if we played him as a forward, you wouldn't hear any big arguments from me.

The point of contention here is Archer playing as a KPD, which once again you skirt over, don't provide any evidence or rationale for why you think Archer should be a defender other than "his set shot kicking is shit" why I have said over and over again, can be improved and Archer is doing alot right as a forward.

Look I like your graph, but I'd prefer a pie chart personally.

I'm genuinely curious how Reid even passes the eye test as a forward for you? Other than his goal kicking, which you acknowledge is totally gross yet keep repeating "it can be fixed, it can be fixed..." does he project as a forward to you?

Bloke doesn't have any forward presence, no goal sense, no quality leading patterns and tends to 2 grab his marks. All important things which get fobbed off with "yeah but he's raw though".

Compare this to our boy Janahan who is a presence up forward, his leading lanes are exquisite, he can kick them from almost anywhere, and has some of the stickiest hands you'll see.

I don't think A.Reid is a shit player, he's quite exciting, but he's simply just being played out of position at the moment. Eventually our coaches and MC will catch up, I just hope they don't derail the genuine forwards (Jobe) development in the process of wasting everyone's time.

 

[jdisc]

Is there any reason we played all of our emergencies yesterday?

 

[Keys]

Is there any reason we played all of our emergencies yesterday?

Can only assume we have no one under a cloud and need to get as much game time as possible into everyone in our squad

Sounds like Davis who’s arguably the fittest of all the younger players was pulled out of the game early so he can be an emergency today

 

[THE A5]

Is there any reason we played all of our emergencies yesterday?

Mini expects us to have no late changes and if we do he expects Archer to kick all 13 goals for us

 

[jdisc]

Can only assume we have no one under a cloud and need to get as much game time as possible into everyone in our squad

Sounds like Davis who’s arguably the fittest of all the younger players was pulled out of the game early so he can be an emergency today

Understand that, just have to hope no one pings a hammy in the warm up today

 

[new breed]

H Davis kicked a few helicopters yesterday might need to improve kicking before regular AFL
BUT he is good at getting possessions and runs all day so should play anyway.

 

[THE A5]

On Jobe. You take a gun kpf over a superstar key back unless they’re in that Mcgovern territory and even then thats gery debatable.

On Archer he hasn’t kicked a goal since early April and his output has been super low for more than a month now. I never wish bad luck on our boys but that said if he keeps continuing that trend it getting to the point playing him in the seniors will be detrimental to his confidence and say even his development.

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

Look I like your graph, but I'd prefer a pie chart personally.

I'm genuinely curious how Reid even passes the eye test as a forward for you? Other than his goal kicking, which you acknowledge is totally gross yet keep repeating "it can be fixed, it can be fixed..." does he project as a forward to you?

Bloke doesn't have any forward presence, no goal sense, no quality leading patterns and tends to 2 grab his marks. All important things which get fobbed off with "yeah but he's raw though".

Compare this to our boy Janahan who is a presence up forward, his leading lanes are exquisite, he can kick them from almost anywhere, and has some of the stickiest hands you'll see.

I don't think A.Reid is a shit player, he's quite exciting, but he's simply just being played out of position at the moment. Eventually our coaches and MC will catch up, I just hope they don't derail the genuine forwards (Jobe) development in the process of wasting everyone's time.

It's very simple and I've said it about 5 times in this thread. He doesn't lose contests in front of the ball. For a guy who is still 19, that is really impressive.



In 9 games he's averaging 1.6 1v1 in the front half, and winning 1/3. For a 19 year old to be outright winning 1v1's in the front half is impressive.

He outright won two 1v1 contests against Sam Taylor in his 3rd or 4th game ffs.

To contrast. Waterman averages 1.8 1v1 contests per game in 2025 and wins about 1/4. In 2023-24 he was winning about the same number that Archer is winning now. When Waterman was Archer's age about 16% of his 1v1's.

Jack Williams has about the same number of 1v1 contests as Archer but Jack Williams wins about 10% of them.

Mitch Owens - who is known for winning/never losing contests - has about the same 35% win rate as Archer, but has 3.1 contests per game (and is like 2 years older).

Even Sam Mitchell specifically mentioned Archer Reid when talking about us playing Oscar down back to fit in our talented KPF's.

So, if Mini can see it, the match committee can see it, Sam Mitchell can see it. Maybe it isn't a me problem after all.

 

[THE A5]

H Davis kicked a few helicopters yesterday might need to improve kicking before regular AFL
BUT he is good at getting possessions and runs all day so should play anyway.

Kids built very solidly and with his ability to find it and run, would really love him developed into a balanced mid

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

On Jobe. You take a gun kpf over a superstar key back unless they’re in that Mcgovern territory and even then thats gery debatable.

On Archer he hasn’t kicked a goal since early April and his output has been super low for more than a month now. I never wish bad luck on our boys but that said if he keeps continuing that trend it getting to the point playing him in the seniors will be detrimental to his confidence and say even his development.

People are very quick to forget Archer kicked 2 goals, took 3 contested marks and had 7 score involvements in his 3rd game in the derby.

 

[THE A5]

get Tom McCarthy in and drop Maric

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Can you give me a step by step process in how we can get a new 6 team league going? Thanks.

Bit disingenuous to ask for a 12 page business plan. Before I answer I ask

What revenue do you think the WAFL generates? Remember all we would need to do is beat that

 

[bzparkes]

Bit disingenuous to ask for a 12 page business plan.

Just use AI dude.

 

[Cuzz09]

When he bulks up a bit do you think Archer could be given a run in the ruck?

He's a big boy

 

[Keys]

It’s been a bit of a scattergun approach to team selection and players roles on game day which hasn’t always made sense

But I think that McQualter is simply exploring what he has to work with and which players are capable/willing to adapt to the way he wants us to play

 

[jdisc]

On Jobe. You take a gun kpf over a superstar key back unless they’re in that Mcgovern territory and even then thats gery debatable.

On Archer he hasn’t kicked a goal since early April and his output has been super low for more than a month now. I never wish bad luck on our boys but that said if he keeps continuing that trend it getting to the point playing him in the seniors will be detrimental to his confidence and say even his development.

It's interesting because Gov was drafted as a key forward/back up ruck, floated around in the WAFL seniors and ressies for a while until Simmo stuck him at CHB and persisted with it

 

[Dark Sharks]

It's very simple and I've said it about 5 times in this thread. He doesn't lose contests in front of the ball. For a guy who is still 19, that is really impressive.

View attachment 2331100

In 9 games he's averaging 1.6 1v1 in the front half, and winning 1/3. For a 19 year old to be outright winning 1v1's in the front half is impressive.

He outright won two 1v1 contests against Sam Taylor in his 3rd or 4th game ffs.

To contrast. Waterman averages 1.8 1v1 contests per game in 2025 and wins about 1/4. In 2023-24 he was winning about the same number that Archer is winning now. When Waterman was Archer's age about 16% of his 1v1's.

Jack Williams has about the same number of 1v1 contests as Archer but Jack Williams wins about 10% of them.

Mitch Owens - who is known for winning/never losing contests - has about the same 35% win rate as Archer, but has 3.1 contests per game (and is like 2 years older).

Even Sam Mitchell specifically mentioned Archer Reid when talking about us playing Oscar down back to fit in our talented KPF's.

So, if Mini can see it, the match committee can see it, Sam Mitchell can see it. Maybe it isn't a me problem after all.

That's excellent, good to know.

Now, howbout he "wins contest's" in defense instead of up forward then?

That way he doesn't burn his team by undoing all our hard work getting a mark inside 50 and a shot at goal that ends up our of bounds?

If he's as good 1v1 in the air as you say, that's even better that he goes into the backline as far as I'm concerned. Contested marking is rolled gold in defense, he could be quite useful.

Good call from you

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

Bit disingenuous to ask for a 12 page business plan. Before I answer I ask

What revenue do you think the WAFL generates? Remember all we would need to do is beat that

This shows a complete lack of understanding of how WAFL works.

WAFL is funded by WAFC who in turn get their funding from the royalties from the two WA AFL clubs and the State Gov in the form of the Optus Stadium user agreement.

The WAFC then distributes money to clubs for particidoaption, development, and WAFL program.

There is no way West Coast can subsidise an entire break away league particularly when they’re no longer making 2-3 million profits due to lower crowds and poor on field results.

And there is no desire from WAFL clubs to be under the thumb of the West Coast Eagles as opposed to WAFC.

West Coast need to either be in the WAFL or the VFL unless a national reserves comp emerges, which looks like it is back on the back burner after being discussed last year (or the year before).

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Bit disingenuous to ask for a 12 page business plan. Before I answer I ask

What revenue do you think the WAFL generates? Remember all we would need to do is beat that

Who is the “we” that is creating this renegade league?

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

That's excellent, good to know.

Now, howbout he "wins contest's" in defense instead of up forward then?

That way he doesn't burn his team by undoing all our hard work getting a mark inside 50 and a shot at goal that ends up our of bounds?

If he's as good 1v1 in the air as you say, that's even better that he goes into the backline as far as I'm concerned. Contested marking is rolled gold in defense, he could be quite useful.

Good call from you

This is the issue with this argument/discussion.

The rationale for persisting with Archer up forward is informed by data and evidence and the discussion to move him down back is just vibes.

It’s hard to take any argument seriously when the rationale is not based on anything tangible. It’s just based off a whim.

 

[Dark Sharks]

This is the issue with this argument/discussion.

The rationale for persisting with Archer up forward is informed by data and evidence and the discussion to move him down back is just vibes.

I mean not really.

You've provided evidence that in the air he provides a contest and rarely loses against his opponent when it comes to being outmarked. Handy trait to have.

None of that means he should be playing forward. He can just as easily do that and be a threat in the air by playing in the backline, like everyone wants.

I've provided loads of stats around how his scoreboard impact stacks up against our actual key forwards in Jilliams and Jobe. If I dug deeper I'm sure I could find his actual kicking efficiency at goal, but I think we both know that's going to be proper grim.

Until the bloke actually starts kicking goals like a proper forward should, he's just an athlete and none of us are going to take him seriously as the Oscar/Jake replacement.

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

I mean not really.

You've provided evidence that in the air he provides a contest and rarely loses against his opponent when it comes to being outmarked. Handy trait to have.

None of that means he should be playing forward. He can just as easily do that and be a threat in the air by playing in the backline, like everyone wants.

I've provided loads of stats around how his scoreboard impact stacks up against our actual key forwards in Jilliams and Jobe. If I dug deeper I'm sure I could find his actual kicking efficiency at goal, but I think we both know that's going to be proper grim.

Until the bloke actually starts kicking goals like a proper forward should, he's just an athlete and none of us are going to take him seriously as the Oscar/Jake replacement.

You can’t compare what Jobe is doing in the WAFL with what Archer is doing at AFL level, that’s an apples and oranges comparison.

You can compare what Jobe did in his first year in the WAFL with what Archer did in his first year last year -as I did- and you can see that Jobe and Archer are basically on level peggings as firsts in their first years.

You can compare Archers output in the AFL to what Williams was in his second year- and Archer is ahead on most important statistics both as a forward and a ruck.

This is why the arguments just don’t stack up. It’s smoke and mirrors.

Archer doing fine -in fact he’s doing well- with the caveat that he needs to improve his goal kicking.

 

[Tyberious Funk]

There is no way West Coast can subsidise an entire break away league particularly when they’re no longer making 2-3 million profits due to lower crowds and poor on field results.

It's not just the money, right? The WAFC owns WCE through Indian Pacific Limited. We aren't doing anything they disagree with, no matter how much money we have in the bank.

 

[Donkers]

Gov = Junior forward/ruck
Barrass = Junior Forward
Jakovich = Junior Forward
McIntosh = Junior Forward
Glass = First round pick Junior Defender

Those are who I consider our 5 best ever key defenders. There's a pretty good correlation there. I think Archer has the talent level above Barrass and Glass and could be a great key defender or maybe ruck eventually.

You watch footy long enough and you see enough to form opinions and make decisions on how you think players will develop. Now I think Shanahan is best suited as a forward.

The interesting part becomes if Shanahan plays CHB and Archer becomes FB in the future we desperately need to draft another key forward.....

(arguable on Barrass and probably a bit stiff on Emac)