Europe War in Ukraine - Thread 4 - thread rules updated

[Gethelred]

This is the thread for discussing the War in Ukraine. Should you want to discuss the geopolitics, the history, or an interesting tangent, head over here:

Europe - Backdrop to the war in Ukraine

This is the thread for the geopolitics, history and framework around the Russia-Ukraine conflict. If you want to discuss the events of the war, head over to this thread: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/war-in-ukraine-thread-4-thread-rules-updated.1376293/page-146

www.bigfooty.com

If a post isn't directly concerning the events of the war or starts to derail the thread, report the post to us and we'll move it over there.

Seeing as multiple people seem to have forgotten, abuse is against the rules of BF. Continuous, page long attacks directed at a single poster in this thread will result in threadbans for a week from this point; doing so again once you have returned will make the bans permanent and will be escalated to infractions.

This thread still has misinformation rules, and occasionally you will be asked to demonstrate a claim you have made by moderation. If you cannot, you will be offered the opportunity to amend the post to reflect that it's opinion, to remove the post, or you will be threadbanned and infracted for sharing misinformation.

Addendum: from this point, use of any variant of the word 'orc' to describe combatants, politicians or russians in general will be deleted and the poster will receive a warning. If the behaviour continues, it will be escalated. Consider this fair warning.

Finally: If I see the word Nazi or Hitler being flung around, there had better have a good faith basis as to how it's applicable to the Russian invasion - as in, video/photographic evidence of POW camps designed to remove another ethnic group - or to the current Ukrainian army. If this does not occur, you will be threadbanned for posting off topic

This is a sensitive area, and I understand that this makes for fairly incensed conversation sometimes. This does not mean the rules do not apply, whether to a poster positing a Pro-Ukraine stance or a poster positing an alternative view.

Behave, people.

 

[Zidane98]

This bloke is definitely a Ausse Cossack doppelganger.

 

[Zidane98]

So much for the Minerals Deal keeping Ukraine safe

It never amounted to anything really anyway.


Russians stealing lithium is kinda like Eskimos stealing ice. They've got massive reserves already. But that's Russians for you. They will loot Ukraine as much as they can as long as the occupation continues and if / when they are forced to withdraw they'll take the scorched earth approach.

 

[CD Xbow]

I hope Mr P's very public rejection of Mr Trumps advances encourages Mr Trump to reconsider his decision to halt arms shipments to Ukraine. "it makes you look weak Mr President etc."

Added - I forgot to post this one earlier, PRC FM Wang being rather frank.

China's foreign minister tells EU that Beijing cannot afford Russia to lose in Ukraine, media reports

China's Foreign Minister Wang Yi reportedly told the EU's top diplomat Kaja Kallas on July 3 that the country cannot afford for Russia to lose the war in Ukraine amid fears the U.S. would shift focus towards Beijing, the South China Morning Post (SCMP) reported, citing sources familiar with the...

kyivindependent.com

 

[Aussie in exile]

I hope Mr P's very public rejection of Mr Trumps advances encourages Mr Trump to reconsider his decision to halt arms shipments to Ukraine. "it makes you look weak Mr President etc."

Added - I forgot to post this one earlier, PRC FM Wang being rather frank.

China's foreign minister tells EU that Beijing cannot afford Russia to lose in Ukraine, media reports

China's Foreign Minister Wang Yi reportedly told the EU's top diplomat Kaja Kallas on July 3 that the country cannot afford for Russia to lose the war in Ukraine amid fears the U.S. would shift focus towards Beijing, the South China Morning Post (SCMP) reported, citing sources familiar with the...

kyivindependent.com

TACO donny is weak on russia and putin as putin has something on him that TACO donny doesn't want made public.
China will continue to gift arms to russia and then call in the debt later with free oil, gas and coal from russia.

 

[wannabejack]

I hope Mr P's very public rejection of Mr Trumps advances encourages Mr Trump to reconsider his decision to halt arms shipments to Ukraine. "it makes you look weak Mr President etc."

Added - I forgot to post this one earlier, PRC FM Wang being rather frank.

China's foreign minister tells EU that Beijing cannot afford Russia to lose in Ukraine, media reports

China's Foreign Minister Wang Yi reportedly told the EU's top diplomat Kaja Kallas on July 3 that the country cannot afford for Russia to lose the war in Ukraine amid fears the U.S. would shift focus towards Beijing, the South China Morning Post (SCMP) reported, citing sources familiar with the...

kyivindependent.com

Maybe China want the war in Ukraine to continue and take advantage of russia when it’s at its weakest?

https://thehill.com/opinion/international/5379824-china-wants-to-invade-siberia-not-taiwan/

Taiwan remains a long-term Chinese goal, but its conquest risks global isolation and economic collapse. Siberia, in contrast, is a stealthier, more pragmatic target. The West, distracted by the conflict in Ukraine and the persistent threat to Taiwan, is unlikely to intervene decisively in a region it has long deemed peripheral to its core interests

 

[Aussie in exile]

Maybe China want the war in Ukraine to continue and take advantage of russia when it’s at its weakest?

https://thehill.com/opinion/international/5379824-china-wants-to-invade-siberia-not-taiwan/

Taiwan remains a long-term Chinese goal, but its conquest risks global isolation and economic collapse. Siberia, in contrast, is a stealthier, more pragmatic target. The West, distracted by the conflict in Ukraine and the persistent threat to Taiwan, is unlikely to intervene decisively in a region it has long deemed peripheral to its core interests

I say again that china will call in the debt that russia owes it in oil, gas and coal for free

 

[The Terrible Thinker]

Maybe China want the war in Ukraine to continue and take advantage of russia when it’s at its weakest?

https://thehill.com/opinion/international/5379824-china-wants-to-invade-siberia-not-taiwan/

Taiwan remains a long-term Chinese goal, but its conquest risks global isolation and economic collapse. Siberia, in contrast, is a stealthier, more pragmatic target. The West, distracted by the conflict in Ukraine and the persistent threat to Taiwan, is unlikely to intervene decisively in a region it has long deemed peripheral to its core interests

Yep, why invade overseas countries for resources when you weak opponent next door has everything you need.

 

[The Terrible Thinker]

I hope Mr P's very public rejection of Mr Trumps advances encourages Mr Trump to reconsider his decision to halt arms shipments to Ukraine. "it makes you look weak Mr President etc."

Added - I forgot to post this one earlier, PRC FM Wang being rather frank.

China's foreign minister tells EU that Beijing cannot afford Russia to lose in Ukraine, media reports

China's Foreign Minister Wang Yi reportedly told the EU's top diplomat Kaja Kallas on July 3 that the country cannot afford for Russia to lose the war in Ukraine amid fears the U.S. would shift focus towards Beijing, the South China Morning Post (SCMP) reported, citing sources familiar with the...

kyivindependent.com

Trump seems to idolize Putin, I hope the bad experience turns on him pretty quickly. Not sure it would involve support to Ukraine as US interests in Europe is diminishing by the day. Trump will shut up shop to dictate his own country and he will forget other nations in the process.

 

[OneGreatClub]

JFC

 

[CD Xbow]

Trump seems to idolize Putin, I hope the bad experience turns on him pretty quickly. Not sure it would involve support to Ukraine as US interests in Europe is diminishing by the day. Trump will shut up shop to dictate his own country and he will forget other nations in the process.

Yes he does seem to idolise Putin. A rather unhealthy state of mind. WRT to withdrawal from the world, it certainly seems to be one impulse, however there is also the opposite - to dominate the world. Makes for messy foreign policy. I did see President Z has spoken to Trump about weapons and air defence.

Trump, Zelensky talk weapons in ‘productive’ call after Russia pummels Kyiv

Waves of drones and missiles targeted Ukraine’s capital overnight in the largest aerial assault since Russia’s invasion of Ukraine began more than three years ago.

www.smh.com.au

Hopefully something comes out of it.

 

[Mobbs]

With the back and forth about Ukraine purchasing resources instead of having them be donated, perhaps it's just a case of temporarily taking everything off the shelves in order to smack a price tag on them.

 

[Mobbs]

RF open fire with a massive attack on Ukraine minutes after Putin gets off the phone with Trump.

 

[wannabejack]

This is a month old and may have been posted before but it applies even more.

 

[OneGreatClub]

More delaying tactics while Putin is given carte blanche to murder and maim Ukrainian civilians

 

[Mofra]

Another clumsy Russian fell out of a window.

Transneft Vice President Andrey Badalov dies after falling from window

Vice President of the "Transneft" company, Andrey Bedelov, has passed away, APA's Moscow correspondent reports citing Mash

en.apa.az

 

[Mobbs]

Don't forget, if you congratulated an American on July 4, you're a nazi sympathiser.

 

[CD Xbow]

I saw this posted in another forum, Kegsbreath is allegedly the main one stopping aid, the critical shortage of munitions was simply a lie as we suspected.

'Multiple sources have told the American outlet NBC News that — contrary to the stated reason for the suspension of deliveries of vital military aid to Ukraine — the Pentagon’s weapons inventory check did not reveal a critical shortage in US stockpiles.

The assessment found some stocks of precision-guided munitions were at reduced levels, but did not reach a critical minimum. The Pentagon Joint Staff concluded that continuation of aid to Ukraine would not deplete the stocks below the threshold to ensure combat readiness in the US.

Rep. Adam Smith of Washington, the ranking member of the House Armed Services Committee, said, “We are not at any lower point, stockpile-wise, than we’ve been in the 3½ years of the Ukraine conflict.”

NBC News confirmed that the decision to suspend aid was a unilateral move by Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth, pushed by director of policy planning Elbridge Colby.

The sources said Hegseth also tried to halt deliveries in February and May but his decision was reversed days later on each occasion.'

I'm hopeful the Trumpster has come around after being rebuffed by Putin.

 

[Chief]

Another clumsy Russian fell out of a window.

Transneft Vice President Andrey Badalov dies after falling from window

Vice President of the "Transneft" company, Andrey Bedelov, has passed away, APA's Moscow correspondent reports citing Mash

en.apa.az

Not surprised. Looks pretty out of it. And standing a bit close to that big window.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Who invaded who, you ****wit?

 

[Nothing]

All these numbnuts who've banged on about Orwell/1984 for years. Now we have the US moving to "Ukraine have always been the enemy" and they're cheering it on.

Arsehats.

 

[wannabejack]

Zelensky Hails ‘Most Productive’ Call With Trump

The Ukrainian president hinted at the US’s willingness to help Kyiv bolster its air defenses following a deadly strike on the country between Thursday and Friday.

www.kyivpost.com

“Regarding the conversation with the president of the United States, which took place a day earlier, it was probably the best conversation we have had during this whole time, the most productive,” he said.

Lets hope Trump doesn’t turn on Zelensky again.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Zelensky Hails ‘Most Productive’ Call With Trump

The Ukrainian president hinted at the US’s willingness to help Kyiv bolster its air defenses following a deadly strike on the country between Thursday and Friday.

www.kyivpost.com

“Regarding the conversation with the president of the United States, which took place a day earlier, it was probably the best conversation we have had during this whole time, the most productive,” he said.

Lets hope Trump doesn’t turn on Zelensky again.

Trump will just delay delay delay

 

[OneGreatClub]

 

[OneGreatClub]

Enter The America Party

 

[CD Xbow]

Trump will just delay delay delay

He's been denying there was a freeze so I have a feeling he will supply the Patriots and the other kit. Good business at the very least and keeps the pro ukraine GOP members happy. There are still a few who aren't vatniks.

While the numbers of munition used by Russia was a record 539 drones and 11 missiles, the damage was relatively slight and seems concentrated of civilian targets. If this is the best a 'super power' can do against a much smaller enemy, it's pretty poor as it seems to have negligible useful military effect.

It's estimated they can build 300-400 Shahad drones a month, so if they stock up they can deliver an attack of this scale every month or so. We will have to wait and see if these estimates turns out to be true.

I suspect the drones mainly provide cover for the missiles which have much larger destructive potential. WRT to the Russian ballistic missiles I think the only thing Ukraine has to take them down are the Patriots, hence their importance ( and probably why Kegsbreath stopped them specifically).