Watts names St. Kilda

[deluxeman]

Frankly it wouldn't bother me at all - what would bother me is seeing Watts dictate to us and win

At least the next one will think long and hard - have no problems if he wants to go home for family reasons - but dictating which club and giving ultimatums as a 20 year old that has provided no service

I have to agree with you and if Watts was doing this at Carlton I would get rid of him in a second. But frankly Carlton lacks good KPPs and if picked him up he might have a questionable attitude but at least he isn't on drugs and stealing from fellow teammates like previous players we got from Adelaide.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I have to agree with you and if Watts was doing this at Carlton I would get rid of him in a second. But frankly Carlton lacks good KPPs and if picked him up he might have a questionable attitude but at least he isn't on drugs and stealing from fellow teammates like previous players we got from Adelaide.

He will be areasonably good KPP exactly what Carlton need IMO

Unless he did a deal with Carlton NOT to nominate for the main draft I cab see him being taken by half a dozen clubs in Victoria.

I would expect you to take Murphy with #1 but IMO #4 for Watts is better than whats in the draft unless of course you wnat a Hurne (midfielder) V a KPP

 

[deluxeman]

He will be areasonably good KPP exactly what Carlton need IMO

Unless he did a deal with Carlton NOT to nominate for the main draft I cab see him being taken by half a dozen clubs in Victoria.

I would expect you to take Murphy with #1 but IMO #4 for Watts is better than whats in the draft unless of course you wnat a Hurne (midfielder) V a KPP

I think he'll probably end up nominatign for the PSD if a deal falls through as in the national draft he could slip down to a non Victorian team but in the PSD he won't.

In the national draft Pick 4 will be very interesting as Carlton have the option of a KPP in Ryder or Kennedy or a midfielder like Hurn. Will probably come down to what Hawks pick.

If Watts entered the National draft, I don't think Carlton would take him at 4 but rather go for one of the other KPPs.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I think he'll probably end up nominatign for the PSD if a deal falls through as in the national draft he could slip down to a non Victorian team but in the PSD he won't.

In the national draft Pick 4 will be very interesting as Carlton have the option of a KPP in Ryder or Kennedy or a midfielder like Hurn. Will probably come down to what Hawks pick.

If Watts entered the National draft, I don't think Carlton would take him at 4 but rather go for one of the other KPPs.

9 Western Bulldogs 22 11 0 11 2385 2351 101.45 44
10 Fremantle 22 11 0 11 2041 2038 100.15 44
11 Brisbane Lions 22 10 0 12 2139 2164 98.84 40
12 Richmond 22 10 0 12 2022 2190 92.33 40
13 Essendon 22 8 0 14 2118 2302 92.01 32
14 Hawthorn 22 5 0 17 1904 2317 82.18 20
15 Collingwood 22 5 0 17 1884 2425 77.69 20
16 Carlton 22 4 1 17 2016 2670 75.51 1
no thats not going to happen - he would definately get picked up by a Vic club.

Hawks have declared they want to start from KPP - set-up the spine. Clarkson spent years in Sth Aust and would be well aware of Watts.

They could pick Watts up with #3 - Collingwood I think would overlook him and go for midfielders.

Essendon & Richmond would definately take him first pick

What is your most urgent need - KPP or midfielders - assuming you take Murphy (midfielder) at #1, would you take another midfielder of a 20 year old that has already been groomed for 2 years and NOW has the body to play V an 18 year old that will require another 2 years of development?

 

[deluxeman]

9 Western Bulldogs 22 11 0 11 2385 2351 101.45 44
10 Fremantle 22 11 0 11 2041 2038 100.15 44
11 Brisbane Lions 22 10 0 12 2139 2164 98.84 40
12 Richmond 22 10 0 12 2022 2190 92.33 40
13 Essendon 22 8 0 14 2118 2302 92.01 32
14 Hawthorn 22 5 0 17 1904 2317 82.18 20
15 Collingwood 22 5 0 17 1884 2425 77.69 20
16 Carlton 22 4 1 17 2016 2670 75.51 1
no thats not going to happen - he would definately get picked up by a Vic club.

Hawks have declared they want to start from KPP - set-up the spine. Clarkson spent years in Sth Aust and would be well aware of Watts.

They could pick Watts up with #3 - Collingwood I think would overlook him and go for midfielders.

Essendon & Richmond would definately take him first pick

What is your most urgent need - KPP or midfielders - assuming you take Murphy (midfielder) at #1, would you take another midfielder of a 20 year old that has already been groomed for 2 years and NOW has the body to play V an 18 year old that will require another 2 years of development?

You must remember though that apart from the 3 stand out midfielders: Murphy, Eliis and Hurn, there is a huge amount of talented KPPs in the draft.
There is Ryder, Kennedy, Clark, Dowler and the question would remain if a club would want to pick up a player who has questionable loyalty for their club or a new youngster?

In the PSD though due the lack of quality players avaliable he would not go past 1 or 2. I don't see why he would nominate for the National draft though and not the PSD unless he has a problem playing for Carlton in which case I wouldn't want him anyway.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

There is Ryder, Kennedy, Clark, Dowler and the question would remain if a club would want to pick up a player who has questionable loyalty for their club or a new youngster?

Ryder is a ruckman that will TRY to convert to a KPP

Clark is a dead set coward and will struggle with the physicality of AFL - did you see his efforts in the U18 comp

Kennedy - don't know much

Dowler - OK but no champion

All of these need 2-3 years of development - Watts is ready now - plus what he has that these others don't is he is a pack mark - his game is based around marking

 

[deluxeman]

Ryder is a ruckman that will TRY to convert to a KPP

Clark is a dead set coward and will struggle with the physicality of AFL - did you see his efforts in the U18 comp

Kennedy - don't know much

Dowler - OK but no champion

All of these need 2-3 years of development - Watts is ready now - plus what he has that these others don't is he is a pack mark - his game is based around marking

That might be true but not many AFL players step into the National draft and I don't see why Watts would be any different. I pray he goes into the PSD and get another star for free from the South Australian teams

 

[Markthirtytwo]

Fergus, nominate yourself for the pre-season draft. Prequisite a one year $300,000 contract.

Have a development year at Carlton where you can play a major role in their forward line.

We will then discuss with Carlton next year.

You dont really believe they would sign him for only a year, and with all their money problems, him nominating a huge and overrated fee, Collingwood would be in the best possi for him IMO.

 

[deluxeman]

You dont really believe they would sign him for only a year, and with all their money problems, him nominating a huge and overrated fee, Collingwood would be in the best possi for him IMO.

We're going to have more room under the salary cap once LAppin. Campo and LAnce all leave or take massive pay cuts.

 

[just maybe]

Absolutely give Fergus Watts his wish - SEND INTO THE PSD

Adelaide must not capitulate on this one as it sends a very clear message to ANY draftee from Victoria the Crows pick-up in the future.

Cool off there. It doesn't send any message at all. It doesn't stop anything happening. It only makes us look stupid for losing a player for nothing.

Port gained NO benefit out of the Stevens affair, and in fact this was laughably proven the next year when Carr asked to go home straight away, despite the Steven affair, and Port eventually capitulated to get much less than they wanted for him - because they didn't want to lose another topliner for nothing.

 

[Truck Rutten]

Thank you Nicho.

After your insightful and intelligent commentary I have reconsidered my opinion.

I think that the Crows should be happy to accept whatever St Kilda are prepared to offer, whatever that may be, happy in the knowledge that this wonderful young man can fulfil his potential at the club he chooses to play for, the club where his father is CEO.

And despite all of the nasty AFL rules like the draft, and the father son rule, which, as fair and reasonable as it is, disgracefully doesn't recognise where a parent is an officeholder at a club and give some reasonable concession (even though his dad didn't hold the office at the time), Fergus should be allowed to choose his own club. Unlike everyone else.

Because he is special.

Thank you. I have seen the light.

You are correct. Fergus is correct. I am Bad. Very very bad.

BTW. Didn't Cornes someone coach us at some stage? Just a thought, does he have any siblings who play footy?

Let's just have free agency. These knobheads from other boards coming on here..............who would play for their clubs if not for the draft? Only these spoilt Vic kids. All the draft does is reward incompetence, it favours these losers and we have to put up with their rubbish.

Hey Nicho (brainwave). The non-Victorian clubs dominate the AFL at the moment. It won't last of course because of the draft. But how do you think it would be if the Vic clubs gave back all of their WA/SA players and the WA/SA clubs gave back their Vic origin players? Would the gap widen or narrow? You would have all the Vic clubs fighting over Judd, but only one would get him.

The draft props you guys up. We would happily do away with it in favour of free agency.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Cool off there. It doesn't send any message at all. It doesn't stop anything happening. It only makes us look stupid for losing a player for nothing.

Port gained NO benefit out of the Stevens affair, and in fact this was laughably proven the next year when Carr asked to go home straight away, despite the Steven affair, and Port eventually capitulated to get much less than they wanted for him - because they didn't want to lose another topliner for nothing.

Do you think? - I would put it to you that Port gained alot - TWT when the next situation occurs.


St Kilda and other clubs are putting all their faith in your type of attitude - you'd be a wonderful poker player (not)

 

[- PC -]

This seems stangely familiar comment. I reackon I've heard it before somewhere by someone else.

But for the record champ, if I can call you that, it apparentlyl turns out this was his decision before even being drafted.

Maybe when you were travelling in the outback ?

 

[Markthirtytwo]

Maybe when you were travelling in the outback ?

 

[Markthirtytwo]

We're going to have more room under the salary cap once LAppin. Campo and LAnce all leave or take massive pay cuts.

But that will go to pay half of Fevs pay packet to the club he goes to.

 

[tribey]

Port gained NO benefit out of the Stevens affair, and in fact this was laughably proven the next year when Carr asked to go home straight away, despite the Steven affair,

JM, Port's decision to hold firm had absolutely nothing to do with an attempt to prevent players from wanting to go home out of hand in future - it had everything to do with saying that Port would not be held to ransom and be dictated to by players wishing to leave.

Josh Carr signalled his intention to leave for home - regrettable but a reality - and then left it up to his agent and the relevant clubs to strike the best concerned for all parties, which was fair enough.

Port eventually capitulated to get much less than they wanted for him - because they didn't want to lose another topliner for nothing.

2) Massive difference.

Unlike with Nick Stevens who had Port over a barrel from the very beginning, Josh Carr had absolutely nothing to gain by going into the PSD - what, end up even further away from Perth?

When Port's interest in Schammer was rebuffed, they took the next best thing on offer was Freo's first three picks.

It wasn't just in Port's best interest to accept that deal, but Josh Carr's as well. Given that the only party unaffected if a deal couldn't be brokered was Freo, I don't know how you can say that Port 'capitulated' in the end.

 

[just maybe]

Erm...Carr would have stayed if a deal couldn't be worked out.

Carr did dictate to Port - I want to go home, Fremantle is my preference, make it happen. Port got a poor deal and were arguably bent over by Fremantle - 11, 27 and 43 is not a good return for a player of Carr's quality.

Clearly shows the 'we will not be bent over' attitude from Nick Stevens was useless and they completely folded the next year. If they had been so sure of that attitude, they would have told him the deal was not good enough and he was staying.

 

[Saint Corin]

Well people onlt saying that Fergus is crap now that he is leaving the crows... the weks before when we kciked 10 goals in teh SANFL everyone and many crow supporters were singing him praises.... now he's leaving ti's good ridence and ''he was crao all along''

This is the tune of many people.... not everyone so come down im nto saying everyone says this...

Bottom Line: regardless od weather the kid is crap or good.... he is yet to prove himself at AFL footy yet and his only attribute is that he is potential.... Pick 17 is worth it as he was pick 14 back in the days, thats fair most would think.... Adelaide will want the best deal they can get... as he can just be chukced in the pre-season draft..... saints don't really loose as we didn't have anything in the first place.... but the crows do loose something.....

Crows should go a decent fair deal... and pick 17 souds aout right... it's a first round pick and aint that bad either..... chuking in a player is sily as that way saints are giving up a proven AFL player for someone with onyl potential nothing proven yet..... but still i player aint out of the question I guess

 

[jo172]

Bottom Line: regardless od weather the kid is crap or good.... he is yet to prove himself at AFL footy yet and his only attribute is that he is potential.... Pick 17 is worth it as he was pick 14 back in the days,

How the hell do you get this, a Pick 14 with 2 years experience and ready to play AFL now would be worth pick 10 in an equivalant draft and in this year's weakish draft top 6.

saints don't really loose as we didn't have anything in the first place

Ask Jim Watts if he cares whether Watts spends a few years with Collingwood or Carlton.

 

[tribey]

because they didn't want to lose another topliner for nothing.

Erm...Carr would have stayed if a deal couldn't be worked out.

Slight contradiction in what you're saying, isn't there?

If a deal couldn't be brokered by Port and Freo and Carr was forced to re-sign a new deal, there's every chance a homesick Carr's performance would have been hindered - either resenting not being allowed to go home, or looking forward to another crack at walking in 12 months.

Carr did dictate to Port - I want to go home, Fremantle is my preference, make it happen.

Carr dictated to Port no more than Jarman and Thompson dictated to their clubs upon their desire to return home - the Stevens (and Watts) situations are on a completely different plain.

Carr said, I want to go to Fremantle, make it happen.

Stevens said, I want to go to Collingwood or else.

Port got a poor deal and were arguably bent over by Fremantle - 11, 27 and 43 is not a good return for a player of Carr's quality.

In terms of raw value it was below what he was worth, but Port really had no option. Freo could've walked away with no consequences if they wished - Port had no leverage with which to extract a Schammer or Pavlich.

As I said, if a deal couldn't be worked out Port would've been left with a player whose heart wasn't in it for however long he chose to re-sign for (in all likelihood a short term deal.)

Instead, Port chose to take the picks and hope that what turned out to be Thomson, Ezard and Walsh turn into quality players for them.

Clearly shows the 'we will not be bent over' attitude from Nick Stevens was useless and they completely folded the next year. If they had been so sure of that attitude, they would have told him the deal was not good enough and he was staying.

"Completely folded"?

The options were Freo's first three picks, or the possibility of signing what would have been a clearly ********ed off/homesick/unhappy Carr on a short-term deal.

All three parties reached an agreement in good faith, as opposed to the scenario 12 months earlier where Stevens acted like a complete cnut and all parties walked away embittered as a result.

 

[just maybe]

Just an aside for a moment, dyertribe: why is what Stevens and his manager said about Port during that time automatically a lie, yet everything Port said about Stevens the truth?

Seems to me you're placing way too much faith in what Port tell you.

 

[Saint Corin]

How the hell do you get this, a Pick 14 with 2 years experience and ready to play AFL now would be worth pick 10 in an equivalant draft and in this year's weakish draft top 6.



Ask Jim Watts if he cares whether Watts spends a few years with Collingwood or Carlton.

Any player who hasn't had a fair run is only potential... not he aint worht a top 10 or pick number 6.... Pick 17 and a player would be fair... depending on the player.... but adleaide arn't in the position to go an bargain (neither are the saints) I think adelaide should settle for something at least and teh saints should be fair and give them a decent deal....

Watts aint anything special at the moment... what has he done? played 2 season for the SANFL or something? kciked 10 goals in a final once, didn't play senior football this year.....

he still has a way to come... and now he's worth pick number 6 after all this?
James Gwilt kicked 3 goals in a final and played a big part in defeating adelaide.... he hasn't proved himself but has potential is he worth pick 6 now?

 

[Crow-mosone]

Fergus, nominate yourself for the pre-season draft. Prequisite a one year $300,000 contract.

Have a development year at Carlton where you can play a major role in their forward line.

We will then discuss with Carlton next year.

I am pretty sure you can't nominate one year in the PSD.

and if you think Carlton will do you any favours - ha ha ha

 

[*PAF]

Carr has done nothing wrong. Neither has Kane Johnson. Unfortunate that they left from a supporter point of view, but nothing wrong. If they should want to return I am sure both clubs would welcome them back with open arms if the price was right.
Wanting to go home after giving good service is not a crime. Both clubs got compensated reasonably well for them leaving. Win some lose some.
Nick Stevens case was different. Fergus Watts? Well we will know by the end of the week.

 

[tribey]

Just an aside for a moment, dyertribe: why is what Stevens and his manager said about Port during that time automatically a lie, yet everything Port said about Stevens the truth?

FACT: Max Stevens came out and said that Nick would only entertain a move to Collingwood or he'd walk to the PSD - just as he has with his client Fergus and the Saints.

HERESAY: After Nick Stevens refused both deals Port had agreed with Carlton and Melbourne, Port sent Nick to the PSD after they deemed Collingwood's offer to be worth far less than Stevens was worth.

FACT: Nick Stevens then came out and said that he 'never designated a chosen destination (despite what Max stated previously)' and that he was happy to go anywhere as long as it was in Melbourne.

Macca19 posted an article a few pages ago where Nick is directly quoted and actually contradicts himself in this respect.

Given this clear contradiction and now Max's current behaviour with Fergus, this is why I believe Port over the two Stevenses.

Seems to me you're placing way too much faith in what Port tell you.

It seems to me you're swinging entirely the other way. The difference is?