Waverly Park plans

[bacon buster]

everyone complains about waverley being gone now, but noone ever went to the games there.

if you look at docklands as being a replacement waverley, the average crowd is around 6,000 higher.

this is more impressive when you consider that docklands now has a lot of the shit games that used to be played at princes park or the whitten oval as well (north/bulldogs vs interstate opponents)

 

[Wonaeamirri33]

The only image I could find...

Wow... This picture reminds me a lot of the Maracana over in Brazil too (not the current evolution of it, but the original construction back some decades ago at the 1950 World Cup, when it fit 200,000 or more). Waverly would have been an unreal stadium if this plan had come about IMO

 

[Astro_]

everyone complains about waverley being gone now, but noone ever went to the games there.

if you look at docklands as being a replacement waverley, the average crowd is around 6,000 higher.

The docklands stadium is also 6,000 times better.

 

[brucetiki]

Whilst Waverley had it's shortcomings, it was OWNED by the AFL, which was the key thing. Now they've moved into a rental property in Etihad Stadium. The AFL should never have sold Waverley. Downsize it to 30-40 000 capacity perhaps, and flog some of the surplus land previously used for car parking for housing, but the AFL made a shortsighted decision in selling it. Now they're in a situation where the MCG and Etihad are exploiting the AFL, and the AFL has no bargaining power. If they'd kept Waverley, then they could have started shifting games there and kept on the front foot in the stadium deal fiasco they've now found themselves in. Teams like North Melbourne could have made Waverley their home and be making money from their games.

 

[Beckers]

Whilst Waverley had it's shortcomings, it was OWNED by the AFL, which was the key thing. Now they've moved into a rental property in Etihad Stadium. The AFL should never have sold Waverley.

Well said Bruce! Greedy decision that was beneficial for the short term. The long term issues and changing financial conditions were never factored in!


Although the Hawks did alright out of it!!!

 

[vinum coupe]

What dumb things to say. The sale of that hole kicked the league along.
The AFL get the dome back in 15 years. Trust me kiddies, 15 years goes quick.

And just quietly, I'd prefer to own city real estate. Especially when it is being given to me for 30 mil.

 

[bacon buster]

Teams like North Melbourne could have made Waverley their home and be making money from their games.

imagine the kangaroo crowds at waverley?

be pushing to get 10k i reckon

 

[Fossie 32]

So did we!!
The players were dead set ants. It was far worse than the top deck of the old olympic stand.

And wooden bench seats that just got soaked through. A hump in the middle of the ground that meant you couldn't see below the waist of players on the other side of the ground.

Even if they still had the ground now they would have to rebuild it. They're talking about rebuilding the souther stand already and the southern stand makes waverley look silly

Whatever!

People just had a mind set against it and dream up objections.

 

[PottSie2]

Remember the days you could have a kick of the footy after the game.

"The Peoples Game" ....

 

[Beckers]

Whatever!

People just had a mind set against it and dream up objections.

I spent as much time at Waverley as anybody, loved the ground and everything Vinum said was true. The players looked like ants from the top of the Kenneth Luke stand and if you sat on the boundary, you couldn't see below players waists if they were on the opposite side of the ground.

Think i watched about 5 - 10 games a year there from about 1980 until it closed in around 2001 and can tell you he didn't 'dream up' anything.

 

[hawker5]

Took my wife to her first ever game at Waverley and she loved it - been to MCG, Subiaco and Docklands and she prefers Waverley. We were there for the Collingwood Hawks game, the 91 Grand Final and a number of preseason grand final games where the crowd was big and we both loved the atmosphere.

We love telling our kids how you could start most games watching from the wing and then move if desired to behind the goals with the official Hawthorn cheersquad (Police Rd end) and then move to the other side of the ground to be with the unofficial Hawthorn cheersquad (yes the Hawks had an official cheersquad and an unofficial cheersquad in the late 80's early 90's). The cost was minimal and who cared about the rain - we lived in Melbourne and wet and cold is the norm in the middle of winter.

John Cain was an incompetant fool who sent the state of Victoria bankrupt (how can we forget the Tricom Bank fiaso forcing Joan Kirner to sell the State bank of Victoria to the CBA to stop the state being declared bankrupt. His arrogance towards the VFL at the time was pathetic - the MCC was struggling and they needed the VFL's/AFL's money to survive as the original Southern Stand had been condemed and they could not rebuild it without the having the Grand Final there. In stepped Cain and told the MCC that he would never allow Waverley to expand and he would never build the needed rail link.

Hawthorn fought to the very end to save Waverley. They begged St Kilda to join them but they ran away to Docklands. They almost got Collingwood to join their fight and commit to making Waverley their new home ground but at the last minute that deal fell through. In the end they was only one team fighting, threatening legal action against the AFL for breach of contract (they had a 20+ year home ground agreement with the AFL) but the AFL started to issue threats and in the end the Hawks folded took the "secret agreement" and we lost Waverley. As much as I love my Hawks and I know they tried their best they should of issued the threatened injunctions to stop the closure - they should have never folded - yes we did get a great deal but Waverley as our home ground today would of been huge - we would have the same advantage as all Interstate clubs.

 

[tandino]

As much as I love my Hawks and I know they tried their best they should of issued the threatened injunctions to stop the closure - they should have never folded - yes we did get a great deal but Waverley as our home ground today would of been huge - we would have the same advantage as all Interstate clubs.

I think that's the point.

We had our Subi, our Football Park, our (what will be) New Carrara, and we (well, Jackson) sold it off to make a quick buck. We had a stadium in this city where the clubs and the league could control everything. Ticketing, stadium membership, food, alcohol, corporates, signage, parking, the lot. The clubs would have the ability to generate as much revenue as it could. And what do you know, Jackson traded that in for the Dome. And embelished the truth, just a little bit.

In 1997, the AFL released a handout with the Footy Record in Melbourne. In it they outlined, essentially, how the Dome was going to be so great and how Waverley Park was so shit. In it, Jackson told us that a club like Hawthorn drawing an average of 23-24k a game, would be $161,000 a year better off at the Dome. St Kilda, with their 27-28k a game, would be over $450,000 better off moving out of Waverley.

Let's go back to 1997 and see what Jackson had to say for himself.

One of the key issues raised in recent years has been the ability of some Melbourne clubs to keep pace in a financial sense with the remainder of clubs in our competition. We are in no doubt that Victoria Stadium can deliver significant financial benefits to the clubs which choose to play there

Clearly, we believe this opportunity for clubs to boost their revenue, and enhance their ability to survive in the long term, is too good to miss and we are confident that in the next few months we will have more clubs wanting to play at Victoria Stadium than we are able to accommodate. What Victoria Stadium means for our other Melbourne based clubs is that it will create a new competitive force for other stadia, particularly the MCG.

Well that worked out well.

Even Jackson saw this issue coming, in a roundabout way.

There is no doubt the stadium (Waverley) has served football very well and the administrators who made the decision to buy more than 200 acres off Wellington Rd, Mulgrave - primarily the late Sir Kenneth Luke and Eric McCutchan - had great vision in their time

After years of frustration dealing with cricket authorities and not getting what they considered was a fair share of MCG benefits for football, the then VFL directors pressed ahead with the idea of football getting its own home

If they were given the chance (Essendon certainly, don't know about the others), the members of the Dome tenant clubs used this information, and information pretty much identical to this provided by their clubs, to vote on the decision to move,

• from Waverley to either the MCG (Hawthorn) or the Dome (St Kilda)
• from the MCG to the Dome (Essendon, North Melbourne), or,
• from Princes Park to the Dome (Western Bulldogs, and Carlton eventually)

Really, given the information provided, it's no wonder that they went down that track.

 

[Wonaeamirri33]

Remember the days you could have a kick of the footy after the game.

"The Peoples Game" ....

I remember when you could even take instruments etc. into a match to create a better atmosphere too, without having to be cloak and dagger about it to avoid getting caught by the "Fun Police".

 

[Beckers]

In 1997, the AFL released a handout with the Footy Record in Melbourne. In it they outlined, essentially, how the Dome was going to be so great and how Waverley Park was so shit. In it, Jackson told us that a club like Hawthorn drawing an average of 23-24k a game, would be $161,000 a year better off at the Dome. St Kilda, with their 27-28k a game, would be over $450,000 better off moving out of Waverley.

I wonder why the media aren't bringing Jackson to account for his incorrect statements back in 1997! Suerly he sold the clubs snake oil and would be directly responsible if one or more clubs went broke.

Why isn't he being made to explain why he sold off the AFL's main asset?

 

[bLuEbOy1984]

i loved waverly was just 10 mins away down the monash freeway.. great ground with the big scoreboard and replay in gold and brown rather than colour or black and white... ah the memories

 

[Pino]

Went to many a match at Waverley. So many highlights - Dunstall's 17.5 against the Tiges, The prelim final where Buckenara kicked the goal after the Siren, The drawn Semi against the Kangas (NM won in extra time), many night grand finals.

The last game at VFL park was awesome. Hawks V Swans. The carpark was a at a standstill and the game was about to start, so most people just got out of their cars and left them on the roads in the carpark. Was something I won't forget. Nor the the freezing wind and rain and marsh of a carpark on most Saturday afternoons.

They also played the World Series Cricket Supertest in 1977 and in latter summers it was used for baseball.

 

[hawker5]

I wonder why the media aren't bringing Jackson to account for his incorrect statements back in 1997! Suerly he sold the clubs snake oil and would be directly responsible if one or more clubs went broke.

Why isn't he being made to explain why he sold off the AFL's main asset?

This makes you wonder doesnt it. If the AFL was a Corporation and sprouted the same rubbish to shareholders and the results were the same (promises were not delivered on) then Jackson would be charged under corporate law and he would of received a major fine or possibly a jail sentance. Because the AFL is a sporting organisation he can deliver cr4p and not be held accountable.

 

[Fino]

I watched my first ever game at Waverly, pissing down rain, but it was fun. The last game I went to there was a Pre-Season game in 2001?, and I jumped the fence whilst play was going on to grab some blades of grass...lol. I think the VFL and Springvale Scorpians continued to use it that year for games and the Grand Final. Never went for that though.

 

[Wallaby]

The last game at VFL park was awesome. Hawks V Swans. The carpark was a at a standstill

Not quite - the last game was a VFL Grand Final - my son did the Auskick thing at Half-time.

I can assure you the car park moved quite freely that day.

 

[ozasismick]

We had a stadium in this city where the clubs and the league could control everything. Ticketing, stadium membership, food, alcohol, corporates, signage, parking, the lot. The clubs would have the ability to generate as much revenue as it could. And what do you know, Jackson traded that in for the Dome. And embelished the truth, just a little bit.

And don't forget with control on revenue come expenses. No one can deny the ground needed an upgrade at the time.

Our interstate friends on these boards already have numerous gripes with the Victoria-centric AFL. I don't believe the interstate clubs would be too happy funding improvements to a ground (indirectly through reduced dividends etc) where they do not receive any direct benefit out of it, and may only play once a year.


Easy to get nostalgic after a period of time, but it was a hole people.

 

[Consumed]

Ah yes... Good old Waverley.

For those who haven't seen my video tribute to the place have a look...

I really miss the joint

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4tygaDM3_c

Good stuff mate.

I actually watched your video last year in America, showed it to a couple of Yank mates. They loved it.

Well done

LOL. coke bottle on Cappers Head.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Went to many a match at Waverley. So many highlights - Dunstall's 17.5 against the Tiges, The prelim final where Buckenara kicked the goal after the Siren, The drawn Semi against the Kangas (NM won in extra time), many night grand finals.

The last game at VFL park was awesome. Hawks V Swans. The carpark was a at a standstill and the game was about to start, so most people just got out of their cars and left them on the roads in the carpark. Was something I won't forget. Nor the the freezing wind and rain and marsh of a carpark on most Saturday afternoons.

They also played the World Series Cricket Supertest in 1977 and in latter summers it was used for baseball.

Hawks vs swans i remember perfectly, each bench housing about 60 people instead of 30, 5 people sitting on each step in the stand, there was far more then the 70 odd k they said were there.

Also remember getting there at 9am, they had the ground already open, and hearing "Cold Pies, Hot Drinks"

ahh, the memories.

 

[tandino]

Our interstate friends on these boards already have numerous gripes with the Victoria-centric AFL. I don't believe the interstate clubs would be too happy funding improvements to a ground (indirectly through reduced dividends etc) where they do not receive any direct benefit out of it, and may only play once a year.

But they were all too happy to have their hands out for the Waverley Park special distribution cash, were they not?

Cash recieved from the sale of an asset which wouldn't have existed if not for the sacrifice of the 12 original VFL clubs, in relation to match day reciepts, financing costs and sales of Footy Records.

 

[mcgarnacle]

This makes you wonder doesnt it. If the AFL was a Corporation and sprouted the same rubbish to shareholders and the results were the same (promises were not delivered on) then Jackson would be charged under corporate law and he would of received a major fine or possibly a jail sentance. Because the AFL is a sporting organisation he can deliver cr4p and not be held accountable.

wtf are some of you smoking? did jacko commit some sort of illegal act? attempt to intentionally defraud the AFL and his stakeholders?

his decision was a forecast that companies make every freaken day. some come off, some dont. the AFL wouldve had the beancounters pouring over the numbers and making 'professional judgements' on all the variables regarding the decision. there's an argument that the league wouldve had to have spent millions on renovating the ground to be suitable for current AFL standard. just because the strategic decision turned out to be a poor one re stadium revenue for clubs doesnt mean that Jacko needs to be tried & executed. dont forget, the commission wouldve examined the issue too and 'shouldve' asked the hard questions of jackson and the executive team at the time.

furthermore, the money that did come from the sale has been influential in the game's march into the northen markets. without it, the propoganda of football dominantion across the country would be baseless.

 

[magilla]

Waverly was a cold, windy hole. Wooden bench seats everywhere, a very slight slope to the stands, nowhere near steep enough meant that the back of the stand was to far from the boundary. The walls at the back of the stands were tin and rusty and full of holes.
You climbed a waterslide type metal/tin ladder setup on the outside of the ground to get back to your seat if you were in a top level.

It was basically a massive version of what your local team uses. Would've needed what Telstra will cost in the end just to change the seats. Good move to **** it off and help the league expand witht the funds received.


BTW - If it was still around it would be sanctioned and have the same rules as all the grounds in Vic. Losing waverly didn't cause all the changes in rules and whats appropriate at a footy match. Society, Government and fear of litigation did that.