We have Voss, now we have the Assistants...

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Jeremias

Moderator
Sep 26, 2004
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The facts are he was a bad senior coach in his stint at the Lions.
The facts are (and proven by statistics) he coached Brisbane to their worst results since before Leigh Matthews took over (over a decade).
Those are not my opinions.
If you dont believe me, look it up for yourself
Looks like you're shifting the goal posts now, nowhere did I say he wasn't a poor coach at the time, though I think it would be fairer to suggest he was inexperienced and clearly not ready for the role.

None of this has to do suggesting Voss was lucky to make finals in year one, or solely responsible for the subsequent recruiting errors made under his tenure, which is what you said initially.
 

therubbernub

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Mar 1, 2005
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Simon Goodwin had Paul Roos. Hows that for a start.
as did Longmire.
Suppose Hardwick didnt have anyone but he was an assistant in 2008 to Clarkson.
Wheres Voss's premiership experience as an assistant.
When was he an apprentice to a master coach- dont think he was
Goodwin had a mentor in Roos yes. And Vos had Hinckley. But that is not the same as a senior mentor looking over your shoulder when you are the senior coach

Sent from my Mi 9T using Tapatalk
 

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Jeremias

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Sep 26, 2004
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No he was responsible for it all but looking at the bigger picture he was a pretty poor senior coach.
Again, it is pretty widely acknowledged Graeme Allan was mostly responsible for the recruiting stuff.

Yet here you are telling us Voss was pretty much solely responsible for not only the problems Brisbane faced on the field, but also off it? Did they have no other staff members at that time?
 

Davey33

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Jun 21, 2017
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Looks like you're shifting the goal posts now, nowhere did I say he wasn't a poor coach at the time, though I think it would be fairer to suggest he was inexperienced and clearly not ready for the role.

None of this has to do suggesting Voss was lucky to make finals in year one, or solely responsible for the subsequent recruiting errors made under his tenure, which is what you said initially.
I guess you are right though as senior coach he had to take responsibility for those trading mistakes.
And he did cause Bradshaw to leave, intentionally or not.
I can retract the initial comment about him being lucky in the first year but overall I think we agree that his tenure at the Lions wasn't great.
Do you have genuine hope for success in his coaching at Carlton?
 

Davey33

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Jun 21, 2017
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Again, it is pretty widely acknowledged Graeme Allan was mostly responsible for the recruiting stuff.

Yet here you are telling us Voss was pretty much solely responsible for not only the problems Brisbane faced on the field, but also off it? Did they have no other staff members at that time?
Ok point taken but what makes you think he will be more likely this time around? (Voss)
 

Davey33

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Jun 21, 2017
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Again, it is pretty widely acknowledged Graeme Allan was mostly responsible for the recruiting stuff.

Yet here you are telling us Voss was pretty much solely responsible for not only the problems Brisbane faced on the field, but also off it? Did they have no other staff members at that time?
Graeme Allen was responsible for alot more than that.
he was list manager from1999-2010 so has to be given credit for one of the greatest teams of the modern era.
 

Jeremias

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Sep 26, 2004
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Do you have genuine hope for success in his coaching at Carlton?
Obviously yes, though nothing is guaranteed.

Ok point taken but what makes you think he will be more likely this time around? (Voss)
More likely what?

Voss wasn't ready for his first senior coaching stint. He now has 12 years coaching experience under his belt. He's a vastly different proposition now.

Graeme Allen was responsible for alot more than that.
he was list manager from1999-2010 so has to be given credit for one of the greatest teams of the modern era.
What's that got to do with anything?
 

BigFrizz36

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Mar 20, 2017
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Obviously yes, though nothing is guaranteed.



More likely what?

Voss wasn't ready for his first senior coaching stint. He now has 12 years coaching experience under his belt. He's a vastly different proposition now.



What's that got to do with anything?
Hoping that Voss becomes our Bill Belichick with Sam Walsh as our Tom Brady!!
 

blue healer

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How come he gets no credit as a senior assistant at Port for their 6 point loss in the prelim in 2020 against the tigers (who then went on to win the flag easily) ? All downhill hey? Or did he just get lucky?
Don't want to get into this but just for the giggles, how much credit should we give Barker when we missed a prelim by a kick in 2011?
 

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WalshYouLegend

21: B&F, AA, AFLPA 2nd, BL 4th - 20: MOTY - 19: RS
Aug 10, 2019
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Simon Goodwin had Paul Roos. Hows that for a start.
as did Longmire.
Suppose Hardwick didnt have anyone but he was an assistant in 2008 to Clarkson.
Wheres Voss's premiership experience as an assistant.
When was he an apprentice to a master coach- dont think he was
Who is Leigh Mathews.
 

GordonBlue

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Dec 12, 2008
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Alot of hopeful optimism in that post based on not much.
hope youare right
Disagree. Are you saying you can only have optimism when we start winning games? I personally would like to start my optimism a lot earlier. The current Coaching structure, experience and expertise is different to anything we've had since Parkin's return.

Since Parkin, we have gone with Caretaker, Massiah, Caretaker, Massiah, Inexperienced, Caretaker.

The Massiah did whatever they pleased and the Caretakers/Inexperienced were not supported properly.

Voss is different. He is an experienced coach, who's not the Massiah and he's been properly supported. That's enough to get me optimistic.
 

Justnetime

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May 18, 2021
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Think we all know vossy was a rear guard face saving option for Sayers. Basically Vossy met the criteria… just :).

Doesnt mean I’m upset about the Voss appointment. I like the fact he has failed once As he can learn from this. I don’t like the fact that he hasn’t moved around much.

I like the fact that it could just be good timing and dumb luck for success this time around.

Im ok with just giving him a go too. No real hate here, just hoping.

What am I looking for in 6 months time:
  • Cripps being ‘told’ to return to see ball get ball and ‘handpass’
  • No more of the playing underdone or injured players. We have depth, it just requires trust
  • A decent two way transition plan
  • Selection integrity
  • Being in the 8. We have the quality
  • Getting Charlie back to being an asset
  • Ensuring there are much better inside 50 kicking options than Cripps and Ed
  • Experimenting with Stocker and midfield minutes in 2022
  • Finding a replacement for Plowman
  • Finding a way to turn TDK into a more physical and hitout threat
  • Sending me the winning lottery numbers
 

4flagsin5yrs

Team Captain
Dec 30, 2020
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Think we all know vossy was a rear guard face saving option for Sayers. Basically Vossy met the criteria… just :).

Doesnt mean I’m upset about the Voss appointment. I like the fact he has failed once As he can learn from this. I don’t like the fact that he hasn’t moved around much.

I like the fact that it could just be good timing and dumb luck for success this time around.

Im ok with just giving him a go too. No real hate here, just hoping.

What am I looking for in 6 months time:
  • Cripps being ‘told’ to return to see ball get ball and ‘handpass’
  • No more of the playing underdone or injured players. We have depth, it just requires trust
  • A decent two way transition plan
  • Selection integrity
  • Being in the 8. We have the quality
  • Getting Charlie back to being an asset
  • Ensuring there are much better inside 50 kicking options than Cripps and Ed
  • Experimenting with Stocker and midfield minutes in 2022
  • Finding a replacement for Plowman
  • Finding a way to turn TDK into a more physical and hitout threat
  • Sending me the winning lottery numbers
Harsh on Plowman, very harsh.
 

Schoonerman

Senior List
Sep 9, 2015
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He got lucky with his first year at Lions (most would agree) and even luckier to win the elimination final against us if you remember (came back from 5 goals down to beat us in the last quarter).
Did some massive damage to his club losing some club champions through very flawed trading philosophies.
We know how Fev trade worked out and the results at the Lions the next few years.
Was given the flick after 4 consecutive years of failure. Took Brisbane about another 3 years to start to finally recover and become a contender.

Don't know much about his time at Port but he missed 2014 their best year (probably until even now).
Think 2020 was a compromised year due to shortened games, season and everything else. (point in case- Carlton almost beat Port mid season and we didnt even make the finals...)
So in truth how much success has he actually had?
Not an awful lot. Champion player, unproven as senior coach.

Happy that you are so confident in his ability to turn things around as a "proven coach" without training wheels. But to me he is still another massive risk with maybe even less credentials than someone like Bolton.

Time will tell and as I said I am the first to hope to beproven wrong, just not sure it will happen.

Cheers
Even Clarko would’ve been a risk, Heck every appointment is Davey

Voss seems passionate and has the skills to right this ship

We need to give him a go, I reckon this is a start of great things (finally)
 

GordonBlue

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Dec 12, 2008
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Even Clarko would’ve been a risk, Heck every appointment is Davey

Voss seems passionate and has the skills to right this ship

We need to give him a go, I reckon this is a start of great things (finally)
I think Clarko would have been another "Massiah" solution that has not worked.

I just did not feel he had the passion to coach this club. Much prefer Voss.
 

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