Anything that Mathew Lloyd has to say about us I take with a grain of salt. Still a bitter bitter man.
We need to talk about Oscar
- Thread starter Hollow Knight
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I think Oscar is being treated a bit harshly by who ever created this thread. He was obviously injured earlier this year and yes he did get beaten against Richmond and St Kilda. However he is averaging 16 disposals, 30 hitouts and 7 clearances a game over the last month... he's not a star but he is what I'd consider a good ruckman and those stats back it up.
He along with the rest of the team seemed a bit down over the last few weeks, but I'm backing him in. He's good enough to be our main ruckman for the years to come. He just needs better support (from our 2nd ruck).
He along with the rest of the team seemed a bit down over the last few weeks, but I'm backing him in. He's good enough to be our main ruckman for the years to come. He just needs better support (from our 2nd ruck).
- Oct 13, 2015
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He had a pretty good fortnight prior to the saints game (and I thought he was far from the biggest problem in that one), but he was brutally bad against the tigers. I don't expect him to dominate against above average rucks but he can't be giving away free kicks.
McIvor
Premiership Player
HE's our only choice, which is grim.
Occasionally I think he goes well, but he blossomed when Stef was at the club, he was dangerous down forward and ran all over the opposition's no.2.
I just don't think he is a no.1 ruck, but if he's not how do you play a second ruck and then Joe without mucking up the team balance?
Occasionally I think he goes well, but he blossomed when Stef was at the club, he was dangerous down forward and ran all over the opposition's no.2.
I just don't think he is a no.1 ruck, but if he's not how do you play a second ruck and then Joe without mucking up the team balance?
Too young. We need someone who's proven now, not yet another untested young player.
Depends which one you see Oscar as. If you believe he's a first ruck, like Fagan presumably did, then we need a ruck-forward. If you believe he's a ruck-forward, like Matthew Lloyd does, then we need a first ruck.
I agree with your reasoning, but I also think North will ask too much for Goldstein considering his age. Wouldn't go above two 3rd rounders. If they're not willing to take that trade, I'd prefer a less heralded alternative who isn't getting a chance behind one of the best rucks in the comp.
The same as Oscar, except Darcy is four years younger and is a better ruckman.
That's not an issue until Hipwood returns. Then at that point you drop whoever is performing the least well.
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Again, was he dangerous down forward? I don’t think our opponents every really worried too much about him kicking a bag or anything. He wouldn’t be in the top 8-10 forwards on our list. Probably similar to Ah Chee
Darcy is only one year older than Coleman-Jones.
Now if you don’t rate Coleman-Jones as a ruck, that’s fair enough, but age shouldn’t really come in to it, talent and ability should be the metric used.
I believe CCJ would offer more up forward as a ruck forward, than what Oscar does.
Another option could be Nankervis. There were rumours Richmond were ready to let Nankervis go at the end of last season, before Soldo did his ACL.
If Soldo is set to return next season, Nankervis would be a good option. Will be 27 next year.
Did we pick up the Dees 3rd round pick as well as part of that trade? Not even Gubby Allen & Crazy Vossy would give up a first round pick for Goldstein now.
- Oct 13, 2015
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I wouldn't say it would be the Dees first straight up, but it might involve trading back for a couple of picks in the 30s and giving one to north. I can't see a point for North to trade out Goldstein for a third rounder, as they will want to get more early picks in rather than just bulk crappy picks which is kind of what they did last year. He's contracted and they probably get more out of him to develop their young midfield and young rucks than our third rounder.
Yeah I agree, no point in North getting rid of Goldy now. That boat sailed three years ago. He's more use to them as a playing development coach than getting a third rounder.
But I doubt we'd entertain the notion of giving up a first round pick for a player who is one injury away from never playing again regardless of what came back the other way as part of the deal.
dlanod
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- Sep 14, 2006
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When the question is "Can Lions win flag with McInerney as ruck?", providing example of ruckmen who have not shown anyone can win a flag with them as a ruck seems... dumb, if not irrelevant.
Funny thing is that Geelong are the flag fancies (this week). They're hardly kicking arse & taking names with their ruck setup. Has been an issue for them for years.
100%, after we smashed the Cats a few weeks ago a hell of a lot of pundits had us if not premiership favourites in the top 2-3 fancies, every team has luls during a season.
And has played 57 games to Coleman's 6. Experience also counts.
Age is a massive factor when it comes to tall players (particularly rucks) for the simple reason that they need time to develop their bodies to match it with opponents who are both tall and physical. Obviously it's not the only factor, but I've seen precious few rucks be a roaring success before the age of 23. Even Darcy has improved a lot this year.
Maybe you're right, but we have little evidence to suggest he's a better ruckman, especially at this moment in time. I'd be quite happy with Nankervis.
Hawkins part time rucking helps soften the blow of not having a top end main ruck.
This sounds like judging players based on the number of premierships they've won rather than their actual performance. Is Nathan Buckley somehow not a good player because he never won a premiership? If Darcy played for Richmond he'd probably have a premiership by now.
The two best players I ever saw over 30 years growing up and older played 3 finals games between them over 15 year careers. They were too loyal.
It's a complete nonsense to think that only premiership players have proven themselves.
There have been total spuds play in premiership teams. And proven it by having zero influence when they went to weaker clubs.
In life , in business , and in team sports in particular timing, luck and circumstance have a lot to do with being involved in team success.
And Darcy is four years younger and already a better ruck.
dlanod
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Exactly. Which is why I find it a joke when someone leads with "Can Lions win flag with McInerney as ruck?" (sic) Obviously they can. Worse rucks have won premierships because they've been in the right place at the right time. And then they double down by comparing him to two better ruckman, but neither of which have shown that any team can win a flag with them either. Either the answer is yes for all based off other ruckmen, or no for all because none of the three have demonstrated you can - but comparing McInerney to ruckmen who have shown their teams can win a flag with them would make how stupid the question is completely apparent. After all you'd be comparing him to Nankervis, Lycett and Jordan Roughead from the last five premiers.
There's a difference though. Some teams are assisted by their ruck in winning a premiership, some win the premiership despite them. I don't think the rest of our team is currently good enough to win a premiership with a net negative player at ruck. You'd have to say that over the past few weeks Oscar has been a net negative to our chances of winning, though he was a net positive in several games earlier this season.
Darcy and Grundy are both net positive players almost every week. They suffer from bad teams around them.
I maintain Lycett and Nankervis are both better at rucking than Oscar.
Im probably nit picking, but I hate that description of our champion captain and to see a Brisbane supporter saying it seems so disrespectful.
