Mass Weight Training: Building Muscle - A Tribute to Kong

[THRILLHO]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

Can someone define the lock-out point for me? I have a fair idea, but cant really find information on the 'net to clearly define it for me.

 

[daveymak]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

good tri workout whomb. mine at the moment is
skullcrushers 2-3x 8-10
dumbell kickbacks 3x 12-15
cable pushdown (alternating grip attachments) 3x 15-20
dips 2x max

i periodise often but thats what im doing right now for tris. i usually work from heavy bar exercises with less reps towards dumbells towards cables towards bodyweight when progressing one body part. not trying to get too much bigger more strength for size. just thought i might share. if anyone wants any examples of my progressions for any other body part im happy to let you guys know

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

lockout is where you have a straight armed position with your elbows locked where the stress shifts away from the muscles and onto the tendons, ligaments and joint bones...think of the top of a bench press and the bottom of a pushdown

for strength puposes the lockout is good to use but for muscle gaining efforts you want to go to just before it so that the muscles are doing all the work for the whole set

 

[THRILLHO]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

lockout is where you have a straight armed position with your elbows locked where the stress shifts away from the muscles and onto the tendons, ligaments and joint bones...think of the top of a bench press and the bottom of a pushdown

for strength puposes the lockout is good to use but for muscle gaining efforts you want to go to just before it so that the muscles are doing all the work for the whole set

Thanks for that mate. Guess I go to lock-out when I bench. I'll try and eliminate it.

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

don't elimnate it completely

for your strength sets lockout (sets of 6 or less) but those over 6 reps don't

for mine bb bench presses isn't great for mass anyway but gives you the strength to use heavier wt on db variations which will

 

[Mofra]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

On a different track:

Split my routine, on my day 2 there is an arm component.
For biceps, are undergrasp chin ups a better exercise than curls?

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

1000x better

why do you need an arm component?

 

[Mofra]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

1000x better

why do you need an arm component?

Why wouldn't I?
The previous day I have wide-grip overgrasp chin ups, and I can feel my lats fatigue well before my arms get tired.

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

For building muscle? No.

For practical strength? Yes.

why can't chin ups build muscle?

I've just started doing chinups and I suck at them, is it better to do say 3 sets of 8 assisted chinups or just to try and do 1 or 2 unassisted ones at a time?

i'd just have you do 15 sets of 1, 8 sets of 2 etc until you can do sets of 6...if you can do them unassisted then you don't need assisted...for longer time under tension do pulldowns

Why wouldn't I?
The previous day I have wide-grip overgrasp chin ups, and I can feel my lats fatigue well before my arms get tired

work on your lats then, your arms aren't the problem although for most it's not that theit arms are stronger and that's they don;t evn use their lats during pull ups

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

there was study i read that compared 1 group who did chin ups only and the other chin ups followed by curls and there was no difference in arm growth between them

i beleive chin ups will work both heads, it's the same basic position just on another plane...the lats and shoulders do some of the work but it's part of the work of a much bigger wt...much like push ups vs bench presses

with push ups you lift 60% of your bodyweight so if you can't bench press at least 60% of your bodyweight then benches are not the best option

chin ups are the the best indication of upper body relative strength too so i would never make them redundant

great for lower traps too

 

[Mofra]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

work on your lats then, your arms aren't the problem although for most it's not that theit arms are stronger and that's they don;t evn use their lats during pull ups

Everyone is different so the same routine wont work for everyone, which is why I was after a biceps exercise.

I just came off a year+ of swimming training so my lats are much stronger than my arms (although my tris are pretty well developed from that as well). In addition, if day 1 split I go hard on the overgrasp wide-grip, I'm after an exercise specifically for biceps to incoprporate for may day 2 routine. I tend to do a set of undergrasp chin-ups when I leave the gym anyway so they're not excluded.

Curls are better for building mass in the biceps than chin ups. With Curls (if you do them properly) you should only be working both heads of the Biceps Brachii, as well as the Brachialis in some cases.

Cheer Whomb - given the finish off of each session with chin ups (and I still haven't made my weight belt yet!) it sounds like the curls are the better option at this stage.

 

[Fire Storm]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

Chins are great for forearms as well.

 

[Mofra]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

why don't one of you sugegst a new muscle then?

I'll suggest one (simply because I've been doing a fair bit of reading about it) - probably the most under-worked, under utilised and important muscle for prevention of injury.

Glutes.

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

i'm gonna do a post on glutes on my blog in the coming days but as far as training goes my best exercises and sets/reps are:

supine bridge, mini band side steps, side lying clams, prone hip extension exercises for 1 - 3 x 10+ reps or as long as you keep actual glute activation

deads always under 6 reps

rdl's x 6 - 12 reps

pull through x 10 - 15 reps

lunges x 6 - 12 reps

step ups x 6 - 12 reps

amount of sets depends on the goal really

 

[mcuzzy]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

I wont post glutes because then I will have nothing to post for legs.

 

[Mofra]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

go then mofra...

After my break now, you've already listed the good ones

One interesting point I've found is that when doing compound movements that work glutes (squats, deadlifts, leg press etc) if you focus on pushing the force through your heel instead of the ball of your foot, you can get a real "squeeze" on teh glute instead of focussing on the quads.

I've also started finishing my day 1 routine with "hip thrusts" which are really just a supine bridge with an explosive thrust prior to holding the movement.

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

there really aren't a lof of big glute exercises, 100's of activation one's but probably only 7 or 8 real good big one's but they are also the bigger lifts overall so their potential is a lot higher then bb curls (i.e. you can continually add wt to the exercise) so you need a lot of exercise rotation

pushing through the heel is a must for glutes or the stress goes to the quads where everyone is already dominant, making your anterior/posterior imbalance even worse

another secret is to squeeze the glutes during everything you do in the gym, ecspecially when standing...you'll lift more

 

[Mofra]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

another secret is to squeeze the glutes during everything you do in the gym, ecspecially when standing...you'll lift more

Good tip, I think it happens anyway on some exercises that don't normally have a glute function - on chin-ups when I'm near failure I feel like everything is tensed.
I always do undergrasp chin-ups on my way out of the gym, and I can definately feel every muscle used during the workout.

 

[Mofra]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

On a different track - I'm looking at incorporating a rear delt exercise into my day 1 routine - at the moment they get some work from the wide-grip overgrasp pull-ups, however my existing routine has seated rows or rear delt rows in it, both seem a bit too trap dominant with lats also involved.

Lying rear delt rows (lying on front) seems to stabilise to torso a bit more - anyone found this more useful? Or are lateral raises are better for isolation?

* I'm also using lateral raise for the middle delts - very light weights done really slow with a hold at the top.

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

face pulls and scarecrows

instead of thinking rear delts, just think upper back i think

 

[cptkirk]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

i was sort of meaning with exercise selection...rows will get them but instead of training the rear delts whish you can't isolate, think more of training upper back with the above exercises and their variations

to be honest though i think if your rear delts aren't semi decent from rows, pulldowns and pull ups then you must be doing them wrong

 

[Brad Goodman]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

Less effective I guess, but they can be done sitting down as well?

 

[Mofra]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

Your rear delts will get worked on back exercises (rows etc), no doubt.

However if you really want to develop them, isolation exercises are your friend. Standing Bent-Over Lateral Raises are the s**t. It can take time (I often use two warm-up sets to get the exact 'feel') to master the technique, as it's fairly easy to bring in the traps or the back in general. I've found going in an arc (a reverse hug, if you will), but not too wide as not to bring the back into play, works best.

Cheers Whomb, sounds like one to try. I assume slow in the raise, hold in position, slow on the negative works best?

 

[hodgeisboss]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

On a different track - I'm looking at incorporating a rear delt exercise into my day 1 routine - at the moment they get some work from the wide-grip overgrasp pull-ups, however my existing routine has seated rows or rear delt rows in it, both seem a bit too trap dominant with lats also involved.

Lying rear delt rows (lying on front) seems to stabilise to torso a bit more - anyone found this more useful? Or are lateral raises are better for isolation?

* I'm also using lateral raise for the middle delts - very light weights done really slow with a hold at the top.

iv'e found the best way to work your rear delts is to start with rear delt raises in a seated position. sit on the end of a bench and lean forward to rest your chest on your knees. if the bench is too high put something under your feet to bring your knees up. use a light weight, around 5 kilo is enough. do slow reps and pause at the top. the low weight is so you can concentrate on the movement. when raising the weight keep your elbows slightly bent and try raising the weight without any movement in your traps. it'll get harder to achieve without trap movement as the reps go on, to a point where you cant do anymore without a large amount of trap involvement, when this occurs don't put the weight down but switch and go into rear delt rows and push out a set of those. with the rear delt rows in doesn't matter that your getting a lot of trap involvement because your rear delts are already half fatigued, the delt rows will just finish them off. 3 sets of these with 15 reps of rear delt raises and 15 reps of rear delt rows in each set. only move up in weight when form is perfect for all reps.

 

[mcuzzy]

Re: Optimal Exercises and Optimal Techniques for Muscle Gains

my delts are going to s**t lately. Going to experiment a bit with amount of shoulder press exercises I do.