Toast Welcome to St.Kilda - COOPER SHARMAN!

[Jack Green]

I don't know about that. It would make some Saints fans happy but neither seem like huge personalities off field. Ben particularly looks quite reserved. McKay for Carlton is as good as any KPF going but I doubt he sold them massive amounts of memberships. Winning a premiership would do more and if that means keeping the cheaper but equally as effective Sharman then that would allow us to compete much more in trades to bring in missing pieces.

Yeah , your read of the situation is similar to mine. There is the romance and nostalgia of it . I remember my Pies mates wetting their knickers quarter of a century ago when Anthony left Sydney and joined Sav at the Pies . Didn't work out quite how they [ or the club] anticipated.

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

I don't know about that. It would make some Saints fans happy but neither seem like huge personalities off field. Ben particularly looks quite reserved. McKay for Carlton is as good as any KPF going but I doubt he sold them massive amounts of memberships. Winning a premiership would do more and if that means keeping the cheaper but equally as effective Sharman then that would allow us to compete much more in trades to bring in missing pieces.

What about we win our first as a scrappy under dog then Bing requests a trade to us to get on the band wagon. Another top end mid does as well and we win a second as the best team in the comp with a bunch of premium trade ins

 

[Dr Spaceman]

I don't know about that. It would make some Saints fans happy but neither seem like huge personalities off field. Ben particularly looks quite reserved. McKay for Carlton is as good as any KPF going but I doubt he sold them massive amounts of memberships. Winning a premiership would do more and if that means keeping the cheaper but equally as effective Sharman then that would allow us to compete much more in trades to bring in missing pieces.

I think you and your fellow “Anti Bring In The Star Brother Of The Star Forward” troublemakers should take it away from the forum.

You’re bringing the mood down

 

[ScrappyDo]

If he wants in at St Kilda we will have to do it.
Gonna be hard to say no if he nominates us, but if the price is too high still a no from me. Remember how Cochrane screwed the Hawks over O'Meara 5 years ago.

I'm pretty sure it was us that screwed the Hawks and not so much Cochrane. And there's only so much they can ask for an OOC player that wants out.
Historically the big (modern) trades haven't really worked for the receiving party, but in this case it's for a guy with 10+ years left to pay off. The argument that we'll be fine without him holds merit, but there's an equal argument that we'd be almost unstoppable with both Kings.
It's at this point that Brad Hill's deal is starting to hold us back, but there's still time for that to come good if Brad has the hunger.

 

[bird_man]

Beat thing for us IMO would be for Ben to sign a 2 year deal with the Suns.

Use the next two years to plug the holes in our list.

If he is then available as a FA then we can go hard for him.

 

[Jack Green]

I'm pretty sure it was us that screwed the Hawks and not so much Cochrane. And there's only so much they can ask for an OOC player that wants out.
Historically the big (modern) trades haven't really worked for the receiving party, but in this case it's for a guy with 10+ years left to pay off. The argument that we'll be fine without him holds merit, but there's an equal argument that we'd be almost unstoppable with both Kings.
It's at this point that Brad Hill's deal is starting to hold us back, but there's still time for that to come good if Brad has the hunger.

We were the beneficiaries with the first round pick [ Hunter Clark I think -
Remember I went down to Launceston for Hawks/Saints game and it was on our run through banner . Winning by 13 goals made it a very worthwhile trip. My memory [ bit hazy] was Cochrane playing hard ball with Hawks , let us do nicely.

Certainly arguments on both sides for the King boy re-union - hell, we could do a poll .

 

[pebblesofsand]

No doubt- reckon some Blues fans would question it now Kennedy is closing 700 goals , a premiership player and still playing long after Judd has retired.
We payed a lot for Hill mind you and IMO he is not that sort of player.
But on Ben , you have no reservations that we should get him regardless of cost?

No club ever in the history of the AFL has picked a player regardless of cost.

If Ben wants to come to St Kilda he knows it will have a financial cost to him, all he will do is decide if that cost is higher or lower than playing alongside his brother and winning the Saints a premiership.

And the only reason no club has never played two players over 2 metres tall on the same forward line is because no club has ever before had the chance to have two players of this quality on the list at the same time.

 

[gringo2011]

No club ever in the history of the AFL has picked a player regardless of cost.

If Ben wants to come to St Kilda he knows it will have a financial cost to him, all he will do is decide if that cost is higher or lower than playing alongside his brother and winning the Saints a premiership.

And the only reason no club has never played two players over 2 metres tall on the same forward line is because no club has ever before had the chance to have two players of this quality on the list at the same time.

Probably that is because there haven't been many forwards that tall in the past. Guys in the 80s and 90s were KPS at current midfield height. If Brisbane could get a Joe Daniher twin would they be unstoppable?

Everything comes with a cost. It limits access to other players and may even shake loose other listed players. It also means stepping out of a couple of high rounds of drafts which for a list with a lack of superstars makes everything more condensed into the forward line. We still look average in the midfield and drafting high is still where to find those. You'd want to be very sure we were about to have a genuine crack not just play a few finals series and start again post Steele etc.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

If i was Gold Coast , and Ben was out of contract and asking for a trade, I'd be asking for a player, and a good one as part of the deal.
Depending how their seasons go, the likes of Sharman and Battle would be on my list, or maybe Clark.

They won't just shrug it off and the AFL will be siding with them.

 

[gringo2011]

If i was Gold Coast , and Ben was out of contract and asking for a trade, I'd be asking for a player, and a good one as part of the deal.
Depending how their seasons go, the likes of Sharman and Battle would be on my list, or maybe Clark.

They won't just shrug it off and the AFL will be siding with them.

They'd ask for Steele and 2 firsts. Settle for Sharman and 2 firsts.

 

[Ducky Tie]

Beat thing for us IMO would be for Ben to sign a 2 year deal with the Suns.

Use the next two years to plug the holes in our list.

If he is then available as a FA then we can go hard for him.

He'd still be two years away from being a FA if he signed for two years wouldn't he?

 

[SaintsSeptember]

They'd ask for Steele and 2 firsts. Settle for Sharman and 2 firsts.

Yep and i for one would not be happy with that deal.

 

[bird_man]

Yep and i for one would not be happy with that deal.

Yeah you're right, for some reason I was thinking 6 years not 8

Edit: quoted the wrong post Ducky Tie

 

[bird_man]

They'd ask for Steele and 2 firsts. Settle for Sharman and 2 firsts.

How often does a decent player get used as part of a deal for a big named player?

It's usually just picks.

 

[Joffaboy]

They'd ask for Steele and 2 firsts. Settle for Sharman and 2 firsts.

They can ask for Steele, Gresham. Clark and 10 firsts if they like. If he is OOC they can't ask for too much.

I would rather walking him to North or whoever is last in the PSD than let those incompetent plastic fold coast clowns get anything more than what is reasonable.

Edit: Doesn't matter what any of us think, the club has a huge hard on for Ben so if he want to come to the Saints they will make it happen.

 

[bird_man]

And the only reason no club has never played two players over 2 metres tall on the same forward line is because no club has ever before had the chance to have two players of this quality on the list at the same time.

Daniher and Hipwood are both over 200cm

As are Marshall and Ming

I'm sure it's happened a bit and will happen even more so now that key forwards are regular 200cm rather than 192 back in the day.

The difference is we already currently have Ming, Marshall, Membrey and Sharman.

Marshall may become the only ruck if King comes which helps but a key forward is still not top of our list in terms of needs

 

[ScrappyDo]

Beat thing for us IMO would be for Ben to sign a 2 year deal with the Suns.

Use the next two years to plug the holes in our list.

If he is then available as a FA then we can go hard for him.

Let's just wait and see where the "holes" are at the end of next season. With this draft intake and the raft of young'ns already on 20-60 games we might have cause to reassess our opinions.

I also reckon you might be over estimating the value in those couple of picks we'll lose. The odds that they would have a greater positive effect than Bing are fairly slim IMHO.

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

Let's just wait and see where the "holes" are at the end of next season. With this draft intake and the raft of young'ns already on 20-60 games we might have cause to reassess our opinions.

I also reckon you might be over estimating the value in those couple of picks we'll lose. The odds that they would have a greater positive effect than Bing are fairly slim IMHO.

Yeah if our midfield depth looks strong and a couple of these draftees show potential of becoming that top shelf mid then we might be good to go in on a forward

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Replace GOAT with Bing.
Positive effect = zero.

Piss on you, I'm working for Cooper Sharman.

 

[bird_man]

Let's just wait and see where the "holes" are at the end of next season. With this draft intake and the raft of young'ns already on 20-60 games we might have cause to reassess our opinions.

I also reckon you might be over estimating the value in those couple of picks we'll lose. The odds that they would have a greater positive effect than Bing are fairly slim IMHO.

Yep, a lot can change in 12 months no doubt.

Sharman might come out and kick 40 goals and our forward line might work really well.

I'm not suggesting we have to take those two draft picks to the draft to fill those holes. We could use them and the money Bing would cost to target a mid or a genuine key defender or both.

 

[Jack Green]

If i was Gold Coast , and Ben was out of contract and asking for a trade, I'd be asking for a player, and a good one as part of the deal.
Depending how their seasons go, the likes of Sharman and Battle would be on my list, or maybe Clark.

They won't just shrug it off and the AFL will be siding with them.

How often does a decent player get used as part of a deal for a big named player?

It's usually just picks.

Top established player rarely. Hawks gave away Ryan Burton [ who has been handy to good ] in Wingard deal and Blues obviously Kennedy in the Judd deal. Both were emerging potential very good players alongside offloading top picks on top of an exiting potential young gun.
Agreed with most posts here, in 12 months time we will all be much the wiser, but as it sits currently as Simon Cowell would say, 'It's a big no from me."

 

[Dr Spaceman]

Top established player rarely. Hawks gave away Ryan Burton [ who has been handy to good ] in Wingard deal and Blues obviously Kennedy in the Judd deal. Both were emerging potential very good players alongside offloading top picks on top of an exiting potential young gun.
Agreed with most posts here, in 12 months time we will all be much the wiser, but as it sits currently as Simon Cowell would say, 'It's a big no from me."

Players have to agree to be traded.

Very good young players will not agree to go to that ridiculously run club up on the Gold Coast.

So we can forget Clarke, Sharman or any other talented player. And rival clubs won't be able to offer them up either, as only players stuck in the 'ressies' or approaching retirement would have any interest.

No; if Ben wants to come back to Melbourne as an uncontracted player, the Caville Avenue Clowns will just have to make do with a couple of decent picks.

 

[bird_man]

Top established player rarely. Hawks gave away Ryan Burton [ who has been handy to good ] in Wingard deal and Blues obviously Kennedy in the Judd deal. Both were emerging potential very good players alongside offloading top picks on top of an exiting potential young gun.
Agreed with most posts here, in 12 months time we will all be much the wiser, but as it sits currently as Simon Cowell would say, 'It's a big no from me."

The Judd deal was almost 15 years ago now. A lot has changed since then.

 

[Jack Green]

The Judd deal was almost 15 years ago now. A lot has changed since then.

Correct - the 2 cases cited - the players didn't want to go. And things have changed with more power to the players. My premise is giving away good potential players with picks is a no-no.
Personally, I would not at all be surprised if Clarkson lands at the Gold Coast next year. If that happens , the attraction to sunny Queensland for a lot of players would be far more appealing.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Daniher and Hipwood are both over 200cm

As are Marshall and Ming

I'm sure it's happened a bit and will happen even more so now that key forwards are regular 200cm rather than 192 back in the day.

The difference is we already currently have Ming, Marshall, Membrey and Sharman.

Marshall may become the only ruck if King comes which helps but a key forward is still not top of our list in terms of needs

Yeah I suppose its better that we wait around until Walsh is a free agent since apparently all we need is an AA quality mid.

Take the best availble. If push came to shove and Bing was available and a better option than Ming, it would be - no hard feelings Ming but here's some sunscreen.